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  #41  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2009, 6:32 PM
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Why in the world are some people always saying SA will get a team over Austin? Are people really saying we can't have anything on our own that we have to rely on our neighbor to the south for any pro sports whats so ever. No I don't think so I think Austin is a very viable option in the future for Baseball especially. No I would not go to San Antonio to see a baseball game just like I don't go to San Antonio to see a Spurs game. Remember the Round Rock Express could upgrade to Pro level it is AAA after all and other cities in the past that have had AAA have had their franchises upgraded to MLB. Im not saying right now or in the near future but don't rule out that Austin will never have any sort of pro-team ever. It will happen.
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  #42  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2009, 7:49 PM
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People's perceptions sometimes lag reality. Austin has grown so much, and so fast. A lot of people don't keep up with all the development occuring, or the latest population figures. Austin in their minds maybe hasn't changed all that much, except maybe the traffic. It's still just "lil old Austin".

It wasn't that many years ago that Austin had no professional sports whatsoever. The idea that a major-league franchise would ever move here would seem ridiculous. Well, we're no there yet, but if this region continues to grow and prosper it is only a matter of time.
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  #43  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2009, 7:55 PM
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Don't rule out people traveling to see games. Long before the Round Rock Express turned over dirt at the Dell Diamond site. Compelled by a deep thirst for the game my father, I and friends regularly traveled to San Antonio in the summer afternoons/evenings to see the Double A San Antonio Missions (as early as 1990 give or take) when they played at St. Mary's VJ Keefe Stadium and at Nelson Wolff Stadium from 1994 onwards. The Missions were affliliated with LA Dodgers (1977-2000) at the time, whose farm system was known to be very productive. Orel Hershiser, Eric Karros, Mike Piazza, Paul LoDuca, Paul Konerko, Ramon Martinez, Pedro Martinez, Alex Cora, Chan Ho Park were among the players who donned Missions jerseys over the years.

Of course Austin baseball fans were not a big substantial portion of the Missions fan base...but before the Express, the Missions were the only pro baseball team in Central Texas.. within an hour, hour and a half of Austin. Either way, if SA or Austin lands a MLB team down the line, fans from either city will attend....because it beats taking the time to go to Houston or Arlington. My only hope is that of Austin gets a team at some point, we do it right.
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  #44  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2009, 8:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Jdawgboy View Post
Why in the world are some people always saying SA will get a team over Austin? Are people really saying we can't have anything on our own that we have to rely on our neighbor to the south for any pro sports whats so ever. No I don't think so I think Austin is a very viable option in the future for Baseball especially. No I would not go to San Antonio to see a baseball game just like I don't go to San Antonio to see a Spurs game. Remember the Round Rock Express could upgrade to Pro level it is AAA after all and other cities in the past that have had AAA have had their franchises upgraded to MLB. Im not saying right now or in the near future but don't rule out that Austin will never have any sort of pro-team ever. It will happen.

I'm not saying Austin is a small town and we'll never get a pro team I think a pro team in Austin would be awsome but San Antonio is bigger than Austin is and I think tey will probably get a team before we do maby not a baseball team Football team maby. I know people here in Austin that are season ticket holders to the Spurs games and they drive down there to go to the games.
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  #45  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2009, 9:12 PM
Scottolini Scottolini is offline
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You are absolutely correct that San Antonio is larger than Austin. However, it is not that much larger, and Austin is growing faster. The difference in metro population is only 378,843. Would you act like Austin is much bigger than a metro of 1,273,759, especially if it was growing faster and all signs pointed to it becoming a larger metro in the not too distant future?

I also must point out that there is a metro of 400,000 people to the north of Austin which is closer than San Antonio. If, as I assume, a major-league franchise set up shop in Williamson County, I have no doubt that the team would be marketed to Bell County residents as well. I am no expert on how the whole t.v. market deal works, but I would think that the games would be shown in both markets as well. As an example, News8Austin is shown in Bell County, as well as Waco on Time Warner Cable.
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  #46  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2009, 9:52 PM
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I think Austin will eventually surpass SA in population as fast as Austin is growing but SA is growing alot too. I forgot about news8 being in Temple/Waco area that's the only Austin TV station on the cable up in Waco/Temple though they have their own network stations though. I was born in SA and grew up here in Austin (lived here 27 years) and it has changed alot but I love both cities lol.
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  #47  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2009, 9:55 PM
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Austin Metro area is bigger than 1.2 million btw
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  #48  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2009, 10:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Jdawgboy View Post
Why in the world are some people always saying SA will get a team over Austin? Are people really saying we can't have anything on our own that we have to rely on our neighbor to the south for any pro sports whats so ever. No I don't think so I think Austin is a very viable option in the future for Baseball especially.
As far as why San Antonio would get more consideration? It is because (as of right now) it is a larger market and has proven itself with the Spurs. The national perception is that Austin is viewed as a college and Longhorn city, even though probably half (or more) that attend a UT football game are from outside the Austin metro area. Most of the people that I know here have no connection whatsoever to the university, but the perception is much different. I just don't see Austin as a great "sports town" for the traditional sports outside of UT sports, it is more of a music and activity town. I do think that if someone moved a team here (none of the leagues are going to be doing any expanding anytime in the near future) it would have to be a situation like the OKC Thunder, a local buying a team and moving it here. The options are just very limited at the moment in terms of movement. There isn't going to be any in MLB, the NFL is only going to grant a move to LA, the NBA more than likely wouldn't let a team move to Austin and the NHL is a mess and the most likely moves will be back north if any happen. I don't see it happening for either city for quite awhile.

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No I would not go to San Antonio to see a baseball game just like I don't go to San Antonio to see a Spurs game.
I would go to a MLB games in San Antonio, I go to Houston to see games but then we also try to get up to Boston every few years and see a game, last year we saw them when they played the Astros and may head up to Arlington when they play the Rangers in a few weeks although I wish it was the same weekend as the OU-BYU game at JerryWorld. I'm not much of a basketball fan anymore, I went to a Hornets game when they were in OKC, my dad got the company tickets when we were up visiting one weekend and I went to a few Mavericks game (Donald Carter, pre-Cuban days) when I lived in Dallas, I haven't even been to an OU-Texas game when they play here.

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Originally Posted by Jdawgboy View Post
Remember the Round Rock Express could upgrade to Pro level it is AAA after all and other cities in the past that have had AAA have had their franchises upgraded to MLB. Im not saying right now or in the near future but don't rule out that Austin will never have any sort of pro-team ever. It will happen.
Triple A teams have not been "upgraded" to MLB, it is not the English Premier League. What has happened is the Triple A teams moved somewhere else or folded when a MLB team came to town. The Denver Zephyrs moved to New Orleans when the Colorado Rockies were granted a franchise in expansion (along with the Florida Marlins that year). For the past 40 years most of the MLB teams have a different ownership group than the minor league teams in most expansion situations. The Phoenix Firebirds moved to Tucson and the existing Tucson Toros moved to Fresno when the Diamondbacks came into the league.

It hasn't been since the San Diego Padres came into the National League in 1969 that a team could be viewed as moving up, the same person that owned the minor league team was granted an expansion franchise but in reality the minor league team was folded after the 1968 season, that is the only way to terminate the farm system contracts. The players on the 1968 PCL Padres team were no longer under the control of the Padres, they were property of the Philadelphia Phillies, the MLB Padres had to start from scratch.
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  #49  
Old Posted Jul 28, 2009, 12:31 AM
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Austin Metro area is bigger than 1.2 million btw
You didn't understand my post.

My point was that the San Antonio metro is to Austin metro, as the Austin metro is to some hypothetical metro of 1,273,759 (a little larger than the Oklahoma City metro). They are all separated by 378,843 people. It's not a very big difference.

To put it in perspective, the Dallas metro is 571,863 larger than the Houston metro. The Houston metro is 3,696,698 larger than San Antonio. In other words, there are four major metropolitan areas in Texas, situated in two tiers, each of comparably sized metros. The larger tier consist of Dallas and Houston, while the smaller tier consists of San Antonio and Austin.

Last edited by Scottolini; Jul 28, 2009 at 12:45 AM.
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  #50  
Old Posted Jul 28, 2009, 1:22 AM
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The national perception is that Austin is viewed as a college and Longhorn city, even though probably half (or more) that attend a UT football game are from outside the Austin metro area. Most of the people that I know here have no connection whatsoever to the university, but the perception is much different.
Exactly the point. The vast majority of people living in the Austin market did not grow up here, or attend U.T. They are not Longhorn fans. These people may love to watch sports, but do not have any other option except minor-league teams. Many people simply will not attend such events, as the quality, stature, etc. is deemed subpar. Perceptions will and are changing, and UT will not prevent the Austin market from getting a major-league franchise, whether that be football, baseball, basketball, or hockey. I believe we will see a franchise move here in my lifetime.

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Triple A teams have not been "upgraded" to MLB, it is not the English Premier League.
His point was that usually a market with an already successful Triple-A team is where Major League Baseball will expand. The Austin market fits that description with the Round Rock Express. You also have a situation where the ownership group certainly would have the finances to purchase an existing MLB team and move it here. I'm not saying that it will ever happen, and certainly not anytime particularly soon. However, I believe in the next fifteen or twenty years it is a reasonable possibility.
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  #51  
Old Posted Jul 28, 2009, 1:48 AM
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You didn't understand my post.

My point was that the San Antonio metro is to Austin metro, as the Austin metro is to some hypothetical metro of 1,273,759 (a little larger than the Oklahoma City metro). They are all separated by 378,843 people. It's not a very big difference.

To put it in perspective, the Dallas metro is 571,863 larger than the Houston metro. The Houston metro is 3,696,698 larger than San Antonio. In other words, there are four major metropolitan areas in Texas, situated in two tiers, each of comparably sized metros. The larger tier consist of Dallas and Houston, while the smaller tier consists of San Antonio and Austin.
I see now yeah SA isn't much bigger. Another city that doesn't have any pro sports teams is Las Vegas and it's metro population is 1,865,746 they have a AAA baseball team like the Express though.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sports_...ague_prospects
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  #52  
Old Posted Jul 28, 2009, 1:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Scottolini View Post
His point was that usually a market with an already successful Triple-A team is where Major League Baseball will expand. The Austin market fits that description with the Round Rock Express. You also have a situation where the ownership group certainly would have the finances to purchase an existing MLB team and move it here. I'm not saying that it will ever happen, and certainly not anytime particularly soon. However, I believe in the next fifteen or twenty years it is a reasonable possibility.
I can see that possibility, especially after seeing it happen in OKC with the Hornets temporary term and local ownership buying a team. Unfortunately most teams are in a "good" stadium/arena situation right now but that and demographics can change rather quickly. Who know what the future might be for some of the larger markets now. It seems some cities may contract drastically, in that case movement might happen.

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Originally Posted by PartyLine View Post
I see now yeah SA isn't much bigger. Another city that doesn't have any pro sports teams is Las Vegas and it's metro population is 1,865,746 they have a AAA baseball team like the Express though.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sports_...ague_prospects
The very thing that gives Las Vegas its population is also the very thing that gives many of the leagues some concerns about placing a team there. The best chance of any team moving there has to be the NBA, they have shown the least amount of trepidation for placing a team there and the WNBA's Connecticut Sun plays in a casino and is owned by the tribe that owns the casino. More than likely the Sacramento Kings would move since most of the Maloof brothers business interests (hotels and casinos) are in Las Vegas.
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  #53  
Old Posted Jul 28, 2009, 3:27 AM
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Originally Posted by austintilIdie View Post

Of course Austin baseball fans were not a big substantial portion of the Missions fan base...but before the Express, the Missions were the only pro baseball team in Central Texas.. within an hour, hour and a half of Austin. Either way, if SA or Austin lands a MLB team down the line, fans from either city will attend....because it beats taking the time to go to Houston or Arlington. My only hope is that of Austin gets a team at some point, we do it right.
A potential MLB team in Austin could still pull some fans from San Antonio in more ways than just putting them in seats. Yes, there are Spurs fans in Austin. There are a few that would drive in to see games regularly, but there is a larger number who are fans who buy merchandise, watch games on TV, keep up with the team, etc. The metros, while not in the same, still have a decent amount of influence on each other. I would think it is safe to say that the population of Waco and up would most closely identify with the Texas Rangers as their MLB team of choice, and while this is clearly not in DFW metro, it is still good amount of population that would support the team in some way. As stated earlier, whether a new pro sports team is in SA or ATX, there will be some form of overlap in fan base. I am not saying we will see it in the near future, but I see an MLB team eventually going to one city or the other. I believe it to be a very small chance of something going in between. As someone who has lived in San Marcos, Austin, and San Antonio and routinely makes the trip back in forth, San Antonio and Austin are awkwardly placed in terms of distance to each other. If the urban cores were about 15-20 miles closer the dynamics would be much different.

One more point as a native San Antonian: San Antonio is obsessed with the Cowboys supports them in many ways. (Give Jerry Jones credit) As complete outsider, you would have no idea that they are not a local team when watching local TV coverage. SA and Dallas are 275 miles apart.
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  #54  
Old Posted Jul 28, 2009, 3:40 AM
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I wish Austin and SA were 20-30 miles from each other lol closer drive to go hangout down on the riverwalk lol.
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  #55  
Old Posted Jul 28, 2009, 2:52 PM
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Neither one is getting pro sports anytime soon. San Antonio's demographics are bad for advertisers because of income; Austin's demographics are bad for advertisers because not enough watch TV.
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  #56  
Old Posted Jul 28, 2009, 6:26 PM
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I know people in Austin go to see Spurs games, what I was saying is I don't and obviously alot of people do not. By the way the Spurs do use Austin as an extra fan base. They own our NBA-D team and they spend a good ammount of money in Austin. Obviously its a good idea to tap into a large population center near by if you are a pro-sports franchise. The same can be done if Austin had a team and we could tap into San Antonio for expanding the fan base.
Thanks Scottolini for explaining what I was trying to say about expansions of MLB in AAA markets. I probably didn't explain myself as well as I could have.
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  #57  
Old Posted Jul 28, 2009, 8:00 PM
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Austin isn't getting a pro-sports team anytime in the near (10-15 yrs) future.

NFL - Expansion is out of the question, re-location options: 1) L.A. 2) L.A. 3) L.A.
NBA - Spurs, Rockets, Mavericks already within 250 miles. Yeah right.
MLB - Now there is a chance that expansion might happen within the next 10-15 years. There are currently 30 teams. 16 NL and 14 AL teams. There have been rumblings that MLB needs to expand to 32 teams to balance out the leagues. However, given the recent downturn in the economy these rumblings have been reduced to whispers. However, when the economy does turn around and expansion becomes a topic again, I can see the following cities/regions being considered by MLB.
East:
1) Charlotte, N.C. (Fast growing city, right demographics, closest team Atlanta Braves)
2) Long Island/Brooklyn (It's NYC, plenty of $$$ and media)
3) San Juan, Puerto Rico (Demographics)

West:
1) Portland, OR (Submitted bid for the Expos relocation, very interested in obtaining a team)
2) Salt Lake City, UT (Fastest growing State, 1 pro-sports team)
Long Shots: Las Vegas, NV & San Antonio, TX

Here would be my proposed division alignments:
AL East
Boston
New York Yankees
Toronto
Baltimore

AL South
Tampa Bay
Texas
Kansas City
Charlotte

AL North
Cleveland
Detroit
Minnesota
Chicago White Sox

AL West
LA Angeles
Seattle
Portland
Oakland

NL East
New York Mets
Philadelphia
Washington D.C.
Pittsburg

NL South
Atlanta
Florida
Houston
Cincinnati

NL North
St. Louis
Chicago Cubs
Milwaukee
Colorado

NL West
LA Dodgers
San Diego
Arizona
San Francisco
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  #58  
Old Posted Jul 29, 2009, 2:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Jdawgboy View Post
I know people in Austin go to see Spurs games, what I was saying is I don't and obviously alot of people do not. By the way the Spurs do use Austin as an extra fan base. They own our NBA-D team and they spend a good ammount of money in Austin. Obviously its a good idea to tap into a large population center near by if you are a pro-sports franchise. The same can be done if Austin had a team and we could tap into San Antonio for expanding the fan base.
That was the reason why Cuban voted against the Sonics moving to OKC, he considered that a secondary market for the Mavericks, which it is to some extent. I was some Mavs games when I lived in OKC before moving to Dallasn then back to OKC.

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Thanks Scottolini for explaining what I was trying to say about expansions of MLB in AAA markets. I probably didn't explain myself as well as I could have.
Sorry, I just read it too literally I guess.
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  #59  
Old Posted Jul 29, 2009, 3:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Jdawgboy View Post
I know people in Austin go to see Spurs games, what I was saying is I don't and obviously alot of people do not. By the way the Spurs do use Austin as an extra fan base. They own our NBA-D team and they spend a good ammount of money in Austin. Obviously its a good idea to tap into a large population center near by if you are a pro-sports franchise. The same can be done if Austin had a team and we could tap into San Antonio for expanding the fan base.
Thanks Scottolini for explaining what I was trying to say about expansions of MLB in AAA markets. I probably didn't explain myself as well as I could have.

I know the Spurs use Austin as a fan base that's why the Spurs are playing OKC here in Austin October 20th
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  #60  
Old Posted Jul 31, 2009, 11:58 PM
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I actualy see an MLS team comming in the next 10 years or so.
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