HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForumSkyscraper Posters
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > United States > Southeast

Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #41  
Old Posted Nov 24, 2009, 3:26 PM
Dyingyak Dyingyak is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Birmingham...and all points statewide
Posts: 126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy McDowell View Post
Sample rendering of the proposed elevated section of US 280...who likes this?
I don't like it and think it's a terrible idea. In review some of the previous rendering I think the proportions are entirely wrong of the proposed overpass. It appears that in the renderings the overpass couldn't be nearly as wide as they say it will be. I'm not entirely familiar with ALDOT requirements but think about how wide a 4-lane road profile is with the appropriate shoulder widths.

The 280 overpass is really an attempt to out-build traffic which has been proven time and time again all around the country cannot be done.
__________________
"Make no little plans. They have no magic to stir men's blood and probably themselves will not be realized. Make big plans. Aim high in hope and work. Remembering that a noble, logical diagram once recorded will not die."
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #42  
Old Posted Nov 24, 2009, 6:42 PM
tascalisa's Avatar
tascalisa tascalisa is offline
Discovered in 1593
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Vulcan's Empire
Posts: 3,246
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy McDowell View Post
Sample rendering of the proposed elevated section of US 280...who likes this?

Source: http://www.elevatedhighway.blogspot.com/
It's not as imposing as you would think it would be, but it's still obscene. Plus, what is that college student talking about? I thought the tolls were only going to for the elevated portion. Maybe I read it wrong, I dunno.

Either way, how does this kid expect anything to get done in a state that doesn't allocate enough money to its transport department? We have to get things done some how...
__________________
SSP Alabama Metros: Birmingham (City Compilation) - Huntsville - Mobile - Montgomery - Tuscaloosa - Daphne-Fairhope - Decatur

SSP Alabama Universities: Alabama - UAB - Alabama State
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #43  
Old Posted Nov 24, 2009, 7:16 PM
Dyingyak Dyingyak is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Birmingham...and all points statewide
Posts: 126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alabadrock View Post
It's not as imposing as you would think it would be, but it's still obscene.
It absolutely would be...and worse. Consider only that one rendering with the massive shadow that overpass would create and the lack of a tolerable environment underneath. Those plants would never survive and I highly doubt the final design would be anything near as reminiscent of that image.

Considering the engineering community in which I work and having spent plenty of time with municipalities, county commissions, MPOs and ALDOT...I feel extremely confident in saying that drawing is skewed enough to make it look like it wouldn't be "too bad."
__________________
"Make no little plans. They have no magic to stir men's blood and probably themselves will not be realized. Make big plans. Aim high in hope and work. Remembering that a noble, logical diagram once recorded will not die."
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #44  
Old Posted Nov 24, 2009, 9:26 PM
Sulley's Avatar
Sulley Sulley is offline
Trendy.
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Trendier than yours.
Posts: 13,378
Oh, Alabama, why are you so retarded?
__________________
Celebrating 12 years of DallasTexan!

DallasTexan-Boomer-DhallassTecksanne-Disceaux Fantasia-Sulley-Optimus Prime-Gloria Estefan

...and others I've surely forgotten...
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #45  
Old Posted Nov 25, 2009, 12:25 AM
ttownfeen ttownfeen is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Sherman's stomping ground
Posts: 374
Why not make this thing unidirectional? So instead of needing four lanes and a median plus two emergency lanes (which doesn't seem like it's going to fit unto a bridge that narrow anyway), all you need is two (or threes) travel lanes and one emergency lane?

This tollway isn't going to have exits between the end points is it?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #46  
Old Posted Nov 25, 2009, 1:14 AM
Rail Claimore's Avatar
Rail Claimore Rail Claimore is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 6,196
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dyingyak View Post
I was speaking with a traffic engineer recently about US-280...you know the last time ALDOT or the MPO had the the signals synchronized? Over 7 years ago.....things have changed a lot during a 7 year period along 280. I think adjusting the timing would drastically improve some the back-ups and delays.
I'm not in Birmingham very often, but when I'm there two or three times a year, I'm almost always on 280. The absolute worst stretch is between The Summit and Valleydale. Those lights are not synchorized at all, and each direction has only two thru-lanes over 459, so traffic is squeezed on top of that.

On the toll-road proposal for 280, I'm not sure it's feasible. Despite the conveniences of electronic toll collection, I'm not sure Alabamians, even in Birmingham, would be very receptive of the idea. And while US 280 traffic could surge in the coming years, generally speaking, you need 20,000 vehicles per lane per day for tolling to be viable. I'm not sure tolled portions will get that much use outside of peak periods.
__________________
So am I supposed to sign something here?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #47  
Old Posted Nov 25, 2009, 6:02 AM
tascalisa's Avatar
tascalisa tascalisa is offline
Discovered in 1593
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Vulcan's Empire
Posts: 3,246
The only way to fix 280 is to figure out some really innovative ways to get people to use public transit. A commuter line would be fantastic, but it wouldn't fix anything, considering that most people don't work along 280, they just use it to get to various job locations that are miles off the beaten path.
__________________
SSP Alabama Metros: Birmingham (City Compilation) - Huntsville - Mobile - Montgomery - Tuscaloosa - Daphne-Fairhope - Decatur

SSP Alabama Universities: Alabama - UAB - Alabama State
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #48  
Old Posted Nov 25, 2009, 3:32 PM
Go7SD's Avatar
Go7SD Go7SD is offline
(Go7SD)
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: INDY
Posts: 2,481
If they can build something elevated then they might as well throw some tracks or guide way for monorail or light rail. As for working along 280 there actually are many businesses lined along the corridor where people work. Now someone who living in Homewood could always park their car at a station lot and when they arrive at another station further south they can always take a feeder shuttle that can do circular runs to and from the office parks. I've seen this method work successfully in another metro.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #49  
Old Posted Nov 25, 2009, 5:55 PM
Dyingyak Dyingyak is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Birmingham...and all points statewide
Posts: 126
I just don't think there is the density of residential or commercial (work-related) locations along the 280 corridor to support a transit system. But then again it gets back to the discussion of what comes first...the density to support the transit, or the transit to influence the density and development.

The over-riding issue though in our State is the lack of control that counties and municipalities have over property development. Our legislature (constitution) just doesn't provide the proper tools to control growth at the county and municipal level. For crying out loud...Hoover doesn't even have, or ever had, a Comprehensive Plan to direct their growth!
__________________
"Make no little plans. They have no magic to stir men's blood and probably themselves will not be realized. Make big plans. Aim high in hope and work. Remembering that a noble, logical diagram once recorded will not die."
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #50  
Old Posted Nov 26, 2009, 2:16 AM
Rail Claimore's Avatar
Rail Claimore Rail Claimore is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 6,196
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dyingyak View Post
I just don't think there is the density of residential or commercial (work-related) locations along the 280 corridor to support a transit system. But then again it gets back to the discussion of what comes first...the density to support the transit, or the transit to influence the density and development.

The over-riding issue though in our State is the lack of control that counties and municipalities have over property development. Our legislature (constitution) just doesn't provide the proper tools to control growth at the county and municipal level. For crying out loud...Hoover doesn't even have, or ever had, a Comprehensive Plan to direct their growth!
There are probably only 7 or 8 cities in the entire state with real planning departments that have teeth. They tend to be the cities that actually look like cities and not just overgrown subdivisions. You can see it here in my part of the state. Madison, from a macro perspective, looks like someone just barfed on a map, and its roads, despite being recently widened, are sub par. Southeast Huntsville, on the other hand, has a noticeable order to it. It's the little things such as curbs on streets, streetlights, sidewalks, etc that make the difference.
__________________
So am I supposed to sign something here?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #51  
Old Posted Nov 26, 2009, 5:09 PM
B'ham Bound's Avatar
B'ham Bound B'ham Bound is offline
I concede
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Birmingham / Auburn
Posts: 748
The elevated lanes would be a monstrosity but it would be a terrible and embarrassing failure if the project was not built to accommodate light rail lines -- either immediately, or at least in the future. Even car-dependent, hyper-auto Atlanta got that right with GA 400.
__________________
War Eagle.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #52  
Old Posted Nov 28, 2009, 7:19 PM
tascalisa's Avatar
tascalisa tascalisa is offline
Discovered in 1593
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Vulcan's Empire
Posts: 3,246
So, I've done a lot of driving in the past three days, so I have a bunch of news.

I 65

Repaving around the Walkers Chapel Road exit is progressing nicely and has greatly improved the driving conditions of that stretch of road.

US 431 Between Eufala and Phenix City

Widening from two to four lands is progressing, it was night so I couldn't see much. It appears that the divided highway is finished, and there are just some final paving and striping to be done. But, I can't be sure, again it was very dark.

I 65 South of Cahaba Valley Road to Alabaster

Widening is progressing. I was dark, so I couldn't see what all was being done.

I 65 north of Malfunction Junction

Widening is finished, the basics are being finished upright now. Barriers, road quality, etc...

Boll Weevil Circle - Enterprise

Widening of the circle from AL 167 to (or past I'm not sure) the turn off for Geneva is still ongoing, but appears to be near completion. This is another one where it was dark, very dark.

I 85 at East Boulevard - Montgomery

Interchange bridge widening is complete.

I 65 north of I 85 interchange

Widening is still ongoing. It appears that the roadbed is complete. The only thing left, it appears, is the paving to bring the road surface up to grade with the existing roadway.

That's about it, there isn't much else I can think of.
__________________
SSP Alabama Metros: Birmingham (City Compilation) - Huntsville - Mobile - Montgomery - Tuscaloosa - Daphne-Fairhope - Decatur

SSP Alabama Universities: Alabama - UAB - Alabama State
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #53  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2009, 2:52 PM
Dyingyak Dyingyak is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Birmingham...and all points statewide
Posts: 126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alabadrock View Post
US 431 Between Eufala and Phenix City

Widening from two to four lands is progressing, it was night so I couldn't see much. It appears that the divided highway is finished, and there are just some final paving and striping to be done. But, I can't be sure, again it was very dark.
It'll be a cold day in hell when that project is finished. I believe they started the 4-laning of 431 between Phenix City and Dothan over 30 years ago.
__________________
"Make no little plans. They have no magic to stir men's blood and probably themselves will not be realized. Make big plans. Aim high in hope and work. Remembering that a noble, logical diagram once recorded will not die."
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #54  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2009, 6:32 AM
neilson neilson is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Sweet Home Alabama
Posts: 2,621
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dyingyak View Post
It'll be a cold day in hell when that project is finished. I believe they started the 4-laning of 431 between Phenix City and Dothan over 30 years ago.
They did eventually get 280 between Birmingham and Phenix City 4 laned the whole way.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #55  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2009, 9:17 PM
tascalisa's Avatar
tascalisa tascalisa is offline
Discovered in 1593
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Vulcan's Empire
Posts: 3,246
So, I just got home from Tuscaloosa. I'm finally home for the holidays! At least, until I have to be back in Ttown to fly to Los Angeles

So, here are some updates for road construction between Tuscaloosa and Decatur.

I-20/59 Repaving - Tuscaloosa

Seems like everything is finished. The speed is back up to 70 mph, so you can now drive 70 mph all the way from Tuscaloosa to Birmingham. HOWEVER, there are some odd punctures in the roadway. I don't know where they came from, they just look really weird and out of place, but they definitely weren't put there intentionally. So, it looks like those will have to be repaired.

This is a long with some hillside damage that was cause by this week's massive amounts of rain that caused some hillslides along the road side. Someone needs to tell ALDOT that this is what happens when the most substantial vegetation you have on your roadside is grass... things tend to not hold together nicely. Get some mimosas or something....

I-65/I-22/US 31 Interchange - North Birmingham

I can see progress! The widening is almost finished, though it seems to be in the same status as the last time I updated.

What's different?

They've actually started clearing out vegetation, and you can actually see, yes SEE the roadway cut coming in from the west. I'm going to try and create a graphic with Bing maps or Google maps so I can really tell you what I saw.

I-65 around Cullman

I don't know what's going on here. I mean, they've finished the great wall of 65, but they've got these wooden stakes out in the median. Don't know what they're for, so if anyone has any idea, tell me.

That's it for now. If I'm able to draw up a map, I'll post it later.
__________________
SSP Alabama Metros: Birmingham (City Compilation) - Huntsville - Mobile - Montgomery - Tuscaloosa - Daphne-Fairhope - Decatur

SSP Alabama Universities: Alabama - UAB - Alabama State
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #56  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2009, 9:39 PM
tascalisa's Avatar
tascalisa tascalisa is offline
Discovered in 1593
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Vulcan's Empire
Posts: 3,246
I came up with a graphic!



NOTE: The only part that I'm sure about is the part that has all the squares. I'm not sure if the interstate is gonna fly over 65 and immediately hit 31 like that.
__________________
SSP Alabama Metros: Birmingham (City Compilation) - Huntsville - Mobile - Montgomery - Tuscaloosa - Daphne-Fairhope - Decatur

SSP Alabama Universities: Alabama - UAB - Alabama State
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #57  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2009, 11:49 PM
Rail Claimore's Avatar
Rail Claimore Rail Claimore is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 6,196
I've got a very important update from Huntsville: The Weatherly and Whitesburg overpasses on the Parkway have opened as of this past Wednesday. There's still two months left of work, mainly with landscaping and signage, but the roadway is open. It's cut my morning and afternoon commutes by a good 15 minutes.
__________________
So am I supposed to sign something here?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #58  
Old Posted Dec 12, 2009, 5:13 AM
philopdx philopdx is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 1,275
Any progress on Montgomery's much-fabled outer loop?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #59  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2009, 3:53 PM
Dyingyak Dyingyak is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Birmingham...and all points statewide
Posts: 126
Two days worth of new information on an elevated 280 and no new posts? I'm surprised.

http://blog.al.com/drivers-side/2009/12/post_9.html
http://blog.al.com/drivers-side/2009/12/post_10.html

Still an overly expensive and wasteful endeavor in my opinion. I was at the intersection of Dolly Ridge and US-280 last night where they show the rendering of the underpass, and there is no way their graphic representation will fit without using every inch of ROW and then some more.
__________________
"Make no little plans. They have no magic to stir men's blood and probably themselves will not be realized. Make big plans. Aim high in hope and work. Remembering that a noble, logical diagram once recorded will not die."
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #60  
Old Posted Dec 22, 2009, 4:15 PM
| BRAVO | | BRAVO | is offline
Closed account
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 786
I can't help but be leery of the timeline. Seems a bit ambitious for Aldot.

Other than that I have no opinion. I avoid 280 at all costs and suspect I will continue to do so.
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > United States > Southeast
Forum Jump


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 7:42 PM.

     

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.