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  #21  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2013, 3:59 AM
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^ So, in reality, we don't have much of a clue as to whether or not she discovered anything earth shatteringly significant that would change what we already know or believe. I guess the history that came after that is more significant for us.
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  #22  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2013, 5:08 AM
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Trevor3 I checked out The Cabot Project, it is ongoing and quite interesting:

http://www.bristol.ac.uk/history/research/cabot.html

I had heard of some of these things before, like the idea that Italians set up the first Christian church in North America in Carbonear in 1498. I wonder if they were able to prove that? Also that Columbus and Cabot were not really the first modern Europeans to come to North America.

Last edited by Architype; Feb 22, 2013 at 6:42 AM.
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  #23  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 12:30 AM
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Here are a few points of interest on St. John's development history from the 20th century:

On the Trizec Proposal (1974):
Quote:

In 1974, a portion of this land was the site of a proposed five tower, 36 storey office complex by Trizec corporation, which was not cons tructed. Objections to the scale of this proposal and to the original route of the Harbour Arterial, as weil as reaction to the construction of Atlantic Place, encouraged the opposition to uncontrolled development
On The Hotel Newfoundland (1982):
Quote:
A plan to move the hotel operation to a new location fell through when the proposal for a hotel tower atop Atlantic Place was precluded by the adoption of height limitations in the new Downtown Zoning By-Law. The operators of the hotel, Canadian National, were faced with continued occupation of the aging Newfoundland Hotel Building at Cavendish Square. They were receptive, then, to a proposal fiom Baine Johnston Co. Ltd. to develop the site for a new hotel. . . .

the director of the Baine Johnston group of companies, commented that the old hotel "was a cheap building when they built it" noting that the porous quality of the brick led to the advanced deterioration of the facade that would have made rennovation very expensive . . .

The new hotel was designed to resemble a pinwheel in plan, capturing views to all areas of the city. It was built in stages, beginning with the two wings facing south towards the harbour giving views of the harbour entrance - "the Narrows. " The third wing was to be constructed on the site of the old hotel after demolition; however, the economic environment in St. John's since the completion of the new hotel has not encouraged this intended expansion. The site of the old hotel has served as a parking lot ever since. . . .

The Baine Johnston Centre office tower was constructed adjacent to the new hotel. The proposal for an office tower was originally made in conjunction with a conference centre scheme that comected the proposed office tower and the hotel.
http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/o...18/MQ54967.pdf
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  #24  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 12:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Architype View Post
Here are a few points of interest on St. John's development history from the 20th century:

On the Trizec Proposal (1974):


On The Hotel Newfoundland (1982):


http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/o...18/MQ54967.pdf
wow!! :O
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  #25  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 12:39 AM
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wow!! :O
Really, for real, it could have been quite a different skyline !!

I also wonderd about the lack of any further movement to expand the Hotel Nfld as planned, since the economic conditions have really changed since that was written in 2000.
The hotel view would look drastically better from the Military Road approach if there were a third wing.
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  #26  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 12:40 AM
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I'm so proud that public reaction to Atlantic Place was shock and horror even then.
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  #27  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 12:43 AM
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I'd love to have enough time to read all of that thesis, that person seemed to get their hands on some rare/old news articles from the first construction boom around the 70s. I'll be the first to admit that I may be glad that the Trizec proposal wasn't approved: can you imagine how out of proportion everything else would have looked? Nothing else of that magnitude would have ever been built and looked quite weird.

Or it could have started a huge skyscraper renascence for St. John's that would make other cities of our size jealous.
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  #28  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 12:45 AM
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I'm so proud that public reaction to Atlantic Place was shock and horror even then.
It was the first catalyst for all that came, or didn't come, after.
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  #29  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 12:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Marty_Mcfly View Post
I'd love to have enough time to read all of that thesis, that person seemed to get their hands on some rare/old news articles from the first construction boom around the 70s. I'll be the first to admit that I may be glad that the Trizec proposal wasn't approved: can you imagine how out of proportion everything else would have looked? Nothing else of that magnitude would have ever been built and looked quite weird.

Or it could have started a huge skyscraper renascence for St. John's that would make other cities of our size jealous.
There's quite a list of newspaper articles there with dates, if someone had the time and interest they look them up in the archives. Also mentioned are articles from the 90's about the further proposed expansion of Atantic Place.

There were other proposals that were not mentioned there at all, and some that were, like the proposals for the large site on Longs Hill/Harvey Road for which there was a 12 storey residential proposal. It partially explains how rezoning resulted in the demolition of the old school, and why the site has sat there empty for so long.
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  #30  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 12:53 AM
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where would these 36 story building have been?
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  #31  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 12:56 AM
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where would these 36 story building have been?
In the area of the Mile One Centre and Cabot Place.
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  #32  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 12:56 AM
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wow looking at the tallest buildings in Atlantic Canada, if those buildings were built in the 70s we would have the tallest buildings in Atlantic Canada up to this day from the 70s (Fenwick tower is 1 building and 32 floors) , I wonder where and what they were suppose to look like
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  #33  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 12:56 AM
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where would these 36 story building have been?
I think the location was where the Cabot complexes/Mile One/Delta are now. Architype can probably confirm this or give the actual location
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  #34  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 1:00 AM
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wow so if the boom continued back then I wonder what would have happened and how the city would look today ... probably look very similar to Halifax (Probably taller buildings hehehe) time to get some new over 20 story proposals for the west end dt now that we have our heads on straight about development
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  #35  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 1:10 AM
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wow so if the boom continued back then I wonder what would have happened and how the city would look today ... probably look very similar to Halifax (Probably taller buildings hehehe) time to get some new over 20 story proposals for the west end dt now that we have our heads on straight about development
I can't imagine what Mr. Wallace would do if there were a new 20+ story proposal
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  #36  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 1:12 AM
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I can't imagine what Mr. Wallace would do if there were a new 20+ story proposal
where does he live? we can make sure it's right behind his house hahaha and CN tower style tower on the site of the bandstand in bannerman park
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  #37  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 3:07 AM
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just to put things in perspective .. this is what 5 36 story 70s style buildings would look in that area..



they may have been right about the reaction from atlantic place and scale hahaha imagine if atlantic place also had the newfoundland hotel on top ... we could have been a VERY different looking city

seeing how St. John's Metro had a population of what Moncton has ... this seems a bit nutzo
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  #38  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 3:19 AM
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I think thy would have been a bit shorter, and much smaller than you've drawn them, as probably the tallest would have been hotel rooms, possibly around 100 metres in height. Maybe only one of them would have been 36 stories, and the others shorter I expect. I think they would have been a dark colour, maybe black and maybe even cylindrical. Someone should go to city hall, they may still have the model there somewhere which was on display for years after, and let you photograph it. I remember seeing the model, but can't remember everything, just my impressions of it.
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  #39  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 3:52 AM
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Wow.. we could have quite literally been an entirely different city today if some of these long-forgotten mega projects had went ahead! Like Jeddy said, proposing five, 36 story buildings in a city the size of Moncton seems crazy! If somebody happens to go to city hall to see this diagram, please photograph it for me! I would love to see it.

To think, We could have went in a direction that would make Halifax very jealous.. Oh well, It's probably for the better we weren't stuck with 36 story buildings from the 70's. Most buildings from that era are not too attractive! But it makes you wonder what could have become of it all.

Hopefully we'll see some modern 20+ story proposals approved in the west end in the not so distant future to diversify our flat roofed skyline! One can dream..
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  #40  
Old Posted Feb 24, 2013, 4:18 AM
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There is something on this proposal at the MUN library too, search the page for "Trizec":

http://collections.mun.ca/xml/ead/230.xml
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