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  #81  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2014, 7:05 PM
the urban politician the urban politician is offline
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My problem with moving the Marriott hotel is that the current proposed location fronts Michigan Avenue, and I would rather see a more intense use there to help revitalize the motor row district
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  #82  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2014, 7:13 PM
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Does any of this musical chairs affect the design? I'd hate to see that get screwed up.
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  #83  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2014, 7:31 PM
Vlajos Vlajos is offline
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Originally Posted by r18tdi View Post
I've been a huge fan of Pat Dowell ever since she proposed a Chicago bike tax to offset the rising cost of HBO/Cinemax for fixed-income seniors.

http://transitized.com/2013/10/23/al...ation-fee-why/
Lol
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  #84  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2014, 8:55 PM
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Originally Posted by the urban politician View Post
My problem with moving the Marriott hotel is that the current proposed location fronts Michigan Avenue, and I would rather see a more intense use there to help revitalize the motor row district
With that land in contention right now, I don't mind the move seeing as that Michigan Avenue site would be developed at a later date into the boutique hotel which would still activate the space.


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Originally Posted by wierdaaron View Post
Does any of this musical chairs affect the design? I'd hate to see that get screwed up.
Go to the meeting tomorrow night and drive that point home.
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  #85  
Old Posted Jan 28, 2014, 3:16 PM
SamInTheLoop SamInTheLoop is offline
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McHugh's Strategy

Has McHugh taken their hardball here too far for their own good? Like many here, I just assumed they were holding out for some better pricing to be negotiated to a successful agreement with McPier. Was McPier just not hearing it, or what? In any case, Chicago being Chicago, how smart is this really for McHugh long-term/big picture? It doesn't take an overly active imagination to conjure up politiclaly-influenced scenarios that might not be especially favorable for McHugh down the road.....
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Last edited by SamInTheLoop; Jan 29, 2014 at 4:17 PM.
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  #86  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 2:15 AM
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A few notes from tonights meeting

-ABC Building to be refurbished

-bowl for the arena will be sunken below grade

-facades will be lined with active spaces

-truck elevators that will lower them to the lower level
-trucks will be staged in the MPA garage as there's internal circulation

-it's an event center, not just a basketball arena

-seats will be retractable

-height of the roof at the eaves about the height of trees at the edge so it's more pedestrian friendly and the roof will swoop up at the center


-50' at edge and 90' at top
-skybridge connecting event center to hotel at 2nd floor

-30,000 sq foot ballroom

-financing shifting. all TIFF used will go toward the hotel and none to the event center

-event center 1/2 by MCPier and 1/2 by DePaul

-2,500 permanent jobs and 10,000 construction

-Goal is to be in the ground by early 2015 and to be done by 2016/17 for both the arena and the tower

-fixed seating is about 10,000 for ballgames and about 8,000 for concerts

-prediction/estimate of up to 60 events the first year

-roughly 1,200 room hotel

-approx 150 parking spaces underground for hotel

-60 stories 600'+

More to come.....
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  #87  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 2:37 AM
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Randomguy34 Randomguy34 is offline
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Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
-60 stories 600'+
This building is going to be really imposing in this area of south loop.
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  #88  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 3:08 AM
the urban politician the urban politician is offline
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Damn, BVictor, great update! I'm glad there will be active space along the arena's facade. I also love the density and low parking ratio. Will the Marriott's design be changed from the one that has been posted here?

To be honest, I'm kind of stoked about this proposal. In due time there is a chance to develop something akin to Wrigleyville. I look forward to seeing more
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  #89  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 3:24 AM
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Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
-truck elevators that will lower them to the lower level
-trucks will be staged in the MPA garage as there's internal circulation
Barclays Center does the same thing. It's a really great idea that avoids the gigantic array of ramps and loading docks that are usually built.
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  #90  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 4:54 AM
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What could be...

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Last edited by BVictor1; Feb 8, 2014 at 9:41 PM.
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  #91  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 2:33 PM
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The images above were taken by me of the renderings presented.

Gensler is the architect of the tower.
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Last edited by BVictor1; Jan 29, 2014 at 4:17 PM.
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  #92  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 2:39 PM
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Sweet! Very Hudson Yardsy http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...187315&page=88 Great work BVic
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  #93  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 4:13 PM
trvlr70 trvlr70 is offline
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What is the advantage of having a data center in such a strategically located parcel of real estate? Couldn't it be further west?
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  #94  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 4:19 PM
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What is the advantage of having a data center in such a strategically located parcel of real estate? Couldn't it be further west?
It would be directly across the street from an existing data center.
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  #95  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 4:20 PM
SamInTheLoop SamInTheLoop is offline
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^^ No real advantage, and yes could and should be further west. It's just that the developers who own the land struck a deal that works for them financially for this particular usage, and instead of holding out for a 'more highest and best usey-type' project, they want to go for a quicker acceptable return with data center..........definitely agree though that it's a poor use here....
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  #96  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 4:31 PM
marothisu marothisu is offline
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Great updates. Very interesting and cool that the height has gone up. I admit I'm not that familiar with the specific area south of Cermak to I-55 and east of Wabash. I've noticed a few new bar/lounge/restaurant openings in that area in the last month or two. Is this normal or are people starting to jockey for position in the area business wise? I always thought of that area as a kind of a small business wasteland currently.
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  #97  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 4:45 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
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Originally Posted by SamInTheLoop View Post
^^ No real advantage, and yes could and should be further west. It's just that the developers who own the land struck a deal that works for them financially for this particular usage, and instead of holding out for a 'more highest and best usey-type' project, they want to go for a quicker acceptable return with data center..........definitely agree though that it's a poor use here....

^^^ False. Completely and utterly false. Data centers are one of the most locationally sensitive uses of RE. They need to be built directly on top of as many fiber lines as possible, particularly if they are being used for prop trading. The Lakeshore data center sits on top of a massive fiber run along the Metra Electric tracks and simply saying "put it a few blocks further west" means millions upon millions of dollars of superfluous infrastructure work and degradation in the performance of the fiber connections. Even adding a single fiber relay (which would be required to branch off that far from the mainline fiber along the lake) adds a few nanoseconds and essentially makes the facility useless to the entire prop trading industry (which is really what is driving all these data centers in Chicago).

Also, there are other massive infrastructure concerns that come into play when locating data centers. The second major requirement is access to extremely heavy power. Obviously server farms and the associated cooling equipment burn up power more intensely than just about any other modern use. This means you need extremely heavy power on site. Again, saying "just move it a few blocks west" means running massively expensive heavy power to a building that doesn't already have it. The Lakeshore Data Center and the proposed ABC data center stand at a beautiful intersection of heavy power and fiber as both buildings were once used for printing which, fittingly, used to be one of the most electricity intensive industries. Both buildings already have a huge amount of power running to them again saving millions in infrastructure costs.

Finally, you have to factor in the structural requirements for data centers. Again, this is a third demand for a good data center. Clients are looking for the most structurally robust buildings they can find in order to resist disruptions from natural disasters. Additionally, many buildings can't even carry the loads created by the densely packed server equipment and would need to be retrofitted to accommodate it. You could build an all new building with similarly robust construction, but it would again cost millions more than just finding a existing building that perfectly meets all your needs. Again, the ABC building excels in this category as printing equipment weighed even more than server farms so the building is massively overbuilt for just about any other use.

What it all comes down to is reuse. These buildings are literally perfect for reuse as data centers. It would be a horrible waste to convert them to anything else since it would cost millions more to create a new facility with the same features. Converting them to a data center takes nothing more than cleaning up and doing deferred maintenance on the existing building and then packing it full of the necessary equipment. Almost no infrastructure or structural work is necessary, they are virtually plug and play buildings which is an extremely rare occurrence for 100 year old structures.
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  #98  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 5:05 PM
Chi-Sky21 Chi-Sky21 is offline
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Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright View Post
. Converting them to a data center takes nothing more than cleaning up and doing deferred maintenance on the existing building and then packing it full of the necessary equipment. Almost no infrastructure or structural work is necessary, they are virtually plug and play buildings which is an extremely rare occurrence for 100 year old structures.
I would think building onsite power generating capabilities for backup might just cost a little bit. Just sayin.
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  #99  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 5:11 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
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Originally Posted by Chi-Sky21 View Post
I would think building onsite power generating capabilities for backup might just cost a little bit. Just sayin.
I include that under "necessary equipment" just as I would include the cooling towers and other HVAC equipment that will be needed. The point is that the infrastructure, location, and structure are all nearly perfect and all they need to do is install the equipment they need which includes servers, security systems, HVAC, generators, etc..

Also, they might not even need a generator at this site if they have an Automatic Throwover Switch (ATS) with dual (or even more rarely triple) feeds to two different transformer yards. Typically an ATS is greatly preferred to a generator backup as it is seen as more reliable in all but the most extreme power failures. That really depends on the level of clients they are pursuing though as certain clients will even back up the ATS with a generator just in case of a radical event where all the power in the entire region goes down, not just one yard or another. However, if something like that happens you are a pretty fucked anyhow as the odds are that the relay stations along the fiber lines will go down due to the power outage as well completely cutting your internet connection. There is not much you can do to plan for widespread/regional blackouts.
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  #100  
Old Posted Jan 29, 2014, 5:41 PM
brian_b brian_b is offline
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The ABC building is already connected to the Lakeside building via an existing skybridge. The Lakeside building uses the paper delivery system (it was also previously a printing plant) as a competitive advantage - this allows shorter fiber runs between floors and is as major selling point for the prop trading firms. Running fiber through the existing skybridge would give the proposed data center a competitive advantage over a data center farther down the road.

Furthermore, the Lakeside center has multiple redundant power delivery points (it is supposedly the 2nd largest consumer of electricity in Chicago) that can be leveraged for the proposed data center as well as a truly gigantic brine-based cooling system that can also be leveraged for the proposed data center. Since both buildings already exist and the ABC building is vacant, it really does make a lot of sense to put the data center there - if a data center is going to be built in the area.
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