HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForumSkyscraper Posters
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > United States > Texas & Southcentral > San Antonio

Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #81  
Old Posted Aug 22, 2014, 10:24 AM
KevinFromTexas's Avatar
KevinFromTexas KevinFromTexas is offline
400 feet tall
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: sunshine and taco trucks on every corner
Posts: 43,936
It's been my experience that most projects that stay active and are serious about getting built actually end up getting built larger and grander than originally stated. The only ones in Austin that were scaled back in size and height had been on hold for a time and then started up again, though, not always in the same form. Almost every other project that kept inching along and stayed active ended up being bigger than what was initially announced. Back in like 1997 there was an office tower planned in downtown that was announced as a 352 foot building with 27 floors. It was a decent design, but not exactly groundbreaking or skyline changing. That building never happened in that form, but ended up becoming larger. It's name was Congress at Fourth before Frost Bank became the lead tenant which gave it naming rights to the tower. I've learned to be patient and not believe everything I hear or get my hopes up. Weston and Frost Bank definitely have the ability to get this tower built, and Frost Bank does need the increased space.
__________________
it's just a jump to the left and then a step to the right.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #82  
Old Posted Aug 22, 2014, 7:19 PM
Fireoutofclay's Avatar
Fireoutofclay Fireoutofclay is online now
Weapon of Mass Creation
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 284
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevinFromTexas View Post
It's name was Congress at Fourth before Frost Bank became the lead tenant which gave it naming rights to the tower. I've learned to be patient and not believe everything I hear or get my hopes up.
I agree KevinFromTexas, I bet Mr Weston is getting all kinds of inquires regarding the other 150,000 square feet available. Who knows, when it is all said and done, the demand for new office space may just hike up height a few hundred feet. I personally think 518ft is just fine. And unless I'm mistaken, the construction of the Frost Tower in Austin marked the beginning of their skyscraper boom. I'm expecting the same here in SA. With CPS Energy looking to alter the skyline as well, new hotels being built soon, Weston Urban's future developments, and the Center City Development Office's wooing of new businesses into downtown, we have good momentum moving into future development. Perhaps our newest Fortune 500 company, CST Brands, could be coaxed into considering a new downtown headquarters.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #83  
Old Posted Aug 22, 2014, 9:31 PM
sirkingwilliam's Avatar
sirkingwilliam sirkingwilliam is online now
Loving SA 365 days a year
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 3,374
Not to forget Hemisfair, San Pedro Creek and the potential Tesla gigafactory.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #84  
Old Posted Aug 23, 2014, 12:57 PM
WorldTexas WorldTexas is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 225
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fireoutofclay View Post
With CPS Energy looking to alter the skyline as well, new hotels being built soon, Weston Urban's future developments, and the Center City Development Office's wooing of new businesses into downtown, we have good momentum moving into future development. Perhaps our newest Fortune 500 company, CST Brands, could be coaxed into considering a new downtown headquarters.
Unfortunately, CST won't be moving downtown anytime soon. They will most likely be expanding their operations along 1604. I have some first-hand experience on this one.

Downtown is still a hard sell to companies of all kinds. They prefer to locate close to where their employees live (or will live if coming from out of town). That's the suburbs still. At least when Oracle came to town they chose a spot along 410 instead of along 1604. Small victories.

But to your point, the new Frost tower could be the catalyst that changes everything. When it opens in 4 years, the residential density around downtown will be much higher and some of those companies at Geekdom might be getting big enough to want out of the Rand. Any new office space downtown will most likely need to be filled with younger startups or expanding local companies. So encourage your entrepreneurial friends!

My guess is that Weston wants to build an Innovation District around Geekdom.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #85  
Old Posted Sep 23, 2014, 12:02 PM
Restless 1 Restless 1 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 223
Like those gifs, SirKingWilliam.

I know the talk on these forums is of CPS Energy either building an new headquarters, or having someone else build it and them leasing, but I'm wondering: how likely is it they move into the old Frost tower?

I would rather see some new construction.

Also, any ideas on what is to become of the current CPS hq? I think one of those buildings has historical significance. Any chance the main building, (with the garage), is demolished to make room for new construction? Not sure what could be done with it as is.

Sorry, forgot that the current Frost Tower will house city employees, which is good news. Pretty much leaves CPS to build a new building, or lease a new building built by someone else. My wife works at CPS, and Beneby is saying the same things there he is saying in public. I thinks he wants something iconic for DT, and for CPS.

Last edited by Restless 1; Sep 23, 2014 at 4:47 PM. Reason: ETA
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #86  
Old Posted Sep 29, 2014, 2:10 AM
adtobias adtobias is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 285
Any new development?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #87  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2014, 1:55 AM
GoldenBoot's Avatar
GoldenBoot GoldenBoot is offline
Member since 2001
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Terra Firma
Posts: 2,067
Not yet...anxiously awaiting the next update(s).
__________________
Austin (City): 947,890 +19.93% - '10-'16 | Austin MSA (5 counties): 2,056,405 +19.82% - '10-'16
San Antonio (City): 1,492,510 +12.44% - '10-'16 | San Antonio MSA (8 counties): 2,429,609 +13.40% - '10-'16
AUS-SAT "CSA" (13 counties): 4,486,014 +16.25% - '10-'16 | *SRC: US Census*
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #88  
Old Posted Oct 23, 2014, 5:01 PM
kornbread kornbread is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 786
Primera Makes Bid Vs. Weston Urban/Frost Bank

http://therivardreport.com/weston-ur...st-bank-tower/

Quote:
Primera Partners, the San Antonio-based owners of the 20-story Riverview Towers at 111 Soledad St., submitted a Public-Private Proposal Friday afternoon with the City of San Antonio, one hour before the deadline passed for counter-bids to the Weston Urban-Frost Tower proposal made in June.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #89  
Old Posted Oct 23, 2014, 5:25 PM
STLtoSA's Avatar
STLtoSA STLtoSA is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 327
Quote:
Originally Posted by kornbread View Post
I can't imagine that their proposal as anywhere near as attractive as Weston Urban's

Primera is probably looking to dump Riverview Tower. The City takes up about 30% of the leased space in Riverview Tower, if Primera loses the City as a tenant it will be a major hit. Then add on top of that Class-A office space being built a couple of blocks away...

I would love to see what Primera plan for Municiple Plaza and Metro health are. They have not been a major player in Downtown Development. I just don't see them doing anything exciting.

You can check out all of their exciting available space here:
http://cdx.xceligent.com/CDXDirect/Clients/Frames/ListingsViewFrame.aspx?FullId=3243_15129&GENUSE=5


Look at the comparisons:
Riverview Tower - 248,000 sq feet, 0 parking spaces
Frost Bank Tower - ~400,000 sq feet, 732 parking spaces

I would bet that it gets rejected by the committee.

Last edited by STLtoSA; Oct 23, 2014 at 5:42 PM.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #90  
Old Posted Oct 23, 2014, 6:09 PM
STLtoSA's Avatar
STLtoSA STLtoSA is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 327
Quote:
Originally Posted by WorldTexas View Post
My guess is that Weston wants to build an Innovation District around Geekdom.
I believe that the original plan (or rather idea) was that a sort of innovative district would develop around Rackspace in Windcrest, but I believe that ship has sailed.

I agree with you that it looks like downtown is now the target.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #91  
Old Posted Oct 23, 2014, 6:45 PM
Restless 1 Restless 1 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 223
Aggghhhh!!! Beat me to it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kornbread View Post
Wonder if this will delay the process. According to the article, the process could now be "open ended" if Primera's bid is accepted and goes on to the next steps. Especially if both are proposals are accepted and go forward in the approval process.

The article also states that this is the first instance of the P3 process being used, so it will be interesting to see how that works too.
If it does receive committee approval, the next step will include financial analysis, a building appraisal and other due diligence that could take up to 30 days.

“That’s going to take some time to do our due diligence,” Racca-Sittre said. “If the committee rejects the proposal outright, there’s not a lot to do, but if the committee wants to do financial analysis and wants a building appraisal, it’s open ended. The committee could decide to accept both proposals, just one proposal, or neither proposal.”
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #92  
Old Posted Oct 23, 2014, 7:28 PM
kornbread kornbread is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 786
Yeah, my first thought was that they were trying to unload Riverview Tower.

I could see this last minute proposal delaying or even altering the project. I wouldn't be surprised to see this being approved and forcing the city to publicly choose whether to move into the Frost tower or consolidate into the Riverview tower.

I'm guessing the Weston proposal is more attractive in many ways (including being a catalyst of sorts for that part of downtown), but in terms of city spending who knows? This new proposal could make it tricky as to how the city proceeds. Parking is a big deal and that is the advantage of a Frost move.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #93  
Old Posted Oct 23, 2014, 7:35 PM
STLtoSA's Avatar
STLtoSA STLtoSA is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 327
Quote:
Originally Posted by Restless 1 View Post
Wonder if this will delay the process.
I wouldn't say delay as much as it is following the process.

I can't imagine that the Primera Proposal will be accepted. However, if it is accepted, I will be intrigued. That would mean that they have proposed something that at least comes close to what Weston Urban has. I wouldn't hold my breath, they aren't the sexiest property management company.

There are so many factors to consider:
- Frost is not part of the Primera deal; if city chooses Primera what happens with Frost Bank?
- What will come of other city properties if COSA moved into Riverview?
- No Parking!
- Additional related developments?

As for the Weston Urban proposal:
- Is the Frost bank Building too big for COSA?
- Room to grow!
- Financials?

The Municipal Plaza building is a mess and Metro Health is even worse. Getting rid of those facilities as well as other leased space in downtown and around San Antonio would be huge for the city. It is hard to imagine that Primera can offer even a fraction of what the Weston Urban proposal does/says.

We will know soon how good the Primera Proposal is; simply by whether or not the committee accepts the proposal along with Weston Urban's.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #94  
Old Posted Oct 23, 2014, 7:58 PM
Restless 1 Restless 1 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 223
Yeah, "delay" was probably the wrong word

Quote:
Originally Posted by STLtoSA View Post
I wouldn't say delay as much as it is following the process.

I can't imagine that the Primera Proposal will be accepted. However, if it is accepted, I will be intrigued. That would mean that they have proposed something that at least comes close to what Weston Urban has. I wouldn't hold my breath, they aren't the sexiest property management company.

There are so many factors to consider:
- Frost is not part of the Primera deal; if city chooses Primera what happens with Frost Bank?
- What will come of other city properties if COSA moved into Riverview?
- No Parking!
- Additional related developments?



As for the Weston Urban proposal:
- Is the Frost bank Building too big for COSA?
- Room to grow!
- Financials?

The Municipal Plaza building is a mess and Metro Health is even worse. Getting rid of those facilities as well as other leased space in downtown and around San Antonio would be huge for the city. It is hard to imagine that Primera can offer even a fraction of what the Weston Urban proposal does/says.

We will know soon how good the Primera Proposal is; simply by whether or not the committee accepts the proposal along with Weston Urban's.
It's just that the Weston/Frost proposal was in it's last hour of waiting on counter bids, and now there is, possibly, another thirty days for the Primera proposal.



*Sigh* You do learn patience living here.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #95  
Old Posted Oct 23, 2014, 9:38 PM
Restless 1 Restless 1 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 223
Little bit more has come out

http://therivardreport.com/primera-o...ew-tower-city/
Primera Properties has made an 11th hour offer to sell its 20-story Riverview Towers building at 111 Soledad St. to the City of San Antonio, barely beating the close of a 60-day period to respond to the Weston Urban/Frost Bank public-private proposal.

“It’s really not a competing offer, they are two very different proposals,” said Chuck Brown, Primera’s general partner. “The City currently occupies more than 50% of our building, so we’re just proposing an outright sale of the building. There’s a very good business case to be made for the City to just buy the building outright. The rent alone from other tenants over the next five years would support the bonds to own the building for the next 22 years.”
Looks like you guys nailed it. They seem to be looking to get out of the Riverveiw building.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #96  
Old Posted Nov 5, 2014, 8:53 PM
The Model's Avatar
The Model The Model is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Posts: 406
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoninATX View Post


http://www.therivardreport.com/city-...bank-proposal/

The tower itself hasn't been designed, but could look similar to the conceptual rendering above.
Just got back from Nashville Tennessee and found this building that looks like the mass object displaying the future Frost Bank.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #97  
Old Posted Nov 11, 2014, 2:54 PM
arkitekte's Avatar
arkitekte arkitekte is offline
Preds/Titans/Grizz
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 2,536
^The Pinnacle is pretty sharp!

So, what's the run down of the new Frost Bank tower...currently? (I'll read back through the last few pages if I have the time) I'm assuming the proposal still consists of commercial and residential space? Was Frost ever ready to move the dirt or were they blowing smoke/testing the water in regards to the commercial and residential markets downtown?
__________________
I built it ground up. You bought it renovated.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #98  
Old Posted Nov 12, 2014, 3:20 AM
sirkingwilliam's Avatar
sirkingwilliam sirkingwilliam is online now
Loving SA 365 days a year
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 3,374
Quote:
Originally Posted by arkitekte View Post
^The Pinnacle is pretty sharp!

So, what's the run down of the new Frost Bank tower...currently? (I'll read back through the last few pages if I have the time) I'm assuming the proposal still consists of commercial and residential space? Was Frost ever ready to move the dirt or were they blowing smoke/testing the water in regards to the commercial and residential markets downtown?
From what I've learned, the Tower will be strictly commercial space. The 350 residential units will be built in either one or two towers planned for parking lots nearby.

Not sure I understand your Frost question though.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #99  
Old Posted Nov 12, 2014, 3:51 AM
arkitekte's Avatar
arkitekte arkitekte is offline
Preds/Titans/Grizz
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 2,536
Quote:
Originally Posted by sirkingwilliam View Post
From what I've learned, the Tower will be strictly commercial space. The 350 residential units will be built in either one or two towers planned for parking lots nearby.

Not sure I understand your Frost question though.
Thanks for the info.

As far as the Frost question, I was just asking whether or not they were ready for construction of the residential units, or if they were proposing them to gauge the interest of other developers, but I guess Frost will finance the entire (residential) project themselves.
__________________
I built it ground up. You bought it renovated.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #100  
Old Posted Nov 12, 2014, 6:22 AM
sirkingwilliam's Avatar
sirkingwilliam sirkingwilliam is online now
Loving SA 365 days a year
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 3,374
Quote:
Originally Posted by arkitekte View Post
Thanks for the info.

As far as the Frost question, I was just asking whether or not they were ready for construction of the residential units, or if they were proposing them to gauge the interest of other developers, but I guess Frost will finance the entire (residential) project themselves.
Weston Urban is developing and financing the new Frost HQ and the residential tower[s], not Frost. Frost will just lease the space from Weston Urban in the new building. Aside from its current HQ, Frost does not build nor finance office buildings, they just lease space and if they lease the most space, their name goes on the building.

Frost isn't in.the development business.

Graham Weston's development company is behind this deal and will build the office tower and the residential buildings.
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > United States > Texas & Southcentral > San Antonio
Forum Jump


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 3:19 PM.

     

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.