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  #61  
Old Posted Oct 9, 2016, 10:39 AM
Jonesy55 Jonesy55 is offline
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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
I would also be somewhat skeptical of the Jewish counts. There are no uniform business rules for counting Jews; they're just getting estimates from local Jewish organizations.
For the Uk at least I would think the numbers are from the 2011 census which showed 263,000 identifying their religion as Judaism in England & Wales plus another 6,000 in Scotland & Northern Ireland. It's thought that a significant number of Orthodox Jews though chose not to answer the census question on religion and there will probably also be non-religious ethnic Jews who did the same..


http://www.thejc.com/news/uk-news/94...wish-breakdown
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  #62  
Old Posted Oct 9, 2016, 10:50 AM
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I'm not sure why people are that surprised at cities having low Jewish populations, there are only 14 million Jewish people in the whole world, less than 0.2% of the global population.

Compare that with 2.5 billion Christians, 1.5 billion Muslims, 1 billion Hindus, 0.5 billion Buddhists and you can see it's a tiny religion. There are even twice as many Sikhs as Jews in the world.
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  #63  
Old Posted Oct 9, 2016, 11:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Minato Ku View Post
I see more and more people openly showing their Jewish identity in Paris.
mm, same trend as the French Muslims, isn't it? Which is almost always deemed as offensive proselytizing over here.

Granted, we may be stupidly inflexible in that respect, we struggled more than enough in the past to remove any sadistic crucifix from classrooms in schools.

So I'm just wondering, why should we undergo any outdated Muslim or Jewish tradition now that we almost succeeded in relaxing old Catholicism? That would only raise useless conflicts between ourselves, while people here could easily come together.
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  #64  
Old Posted Oct 9, 2016, 12:27 PM
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Originally Posted by mousquet View Post
mm, same trend as the French Muslims, isn't it? Which is almost always deemed as offensive proselytizing over here.

Granted, we may be stupidly inflexible in that respect, we struggled more than enough in the past to remove any sadistic crucifix from classrooms in schools.

So I'm just wondering, why should we undergo any outdated Muslim or Jewish tradition now that we almost succeeded in relaxing old Catholicism? That would only raise useless conflicts between ourselves, while people here could easily come together.
In many western countries, the majority population largely abandoned religion and effectively took it out of the public sphere. Making it a personal choice to have a religion or not, and at which level.

The implicit expectation was this would over time lead to less religion in society. But certain groups are now taking the interpretation of total freedom "of" and "from" religion and running with it.

As a result, many places now paradoxically seem to be on a path to re-religionizing. With more - not less - requests for religious accommodation in society.
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  #65  
Old Posted Oct 9, 2016, 7:40 PM
yaletown_fella yaletown_fella is offline
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Originally Posted by Docere View Post
And for selected Toronto areas:

Annex/Yorkville 3,520 12.8%
Forest Hill/Cedarvale 14,165 31.3%
North York 58,370 9.1%
(York Mills 5,990 20.5%)
(Bathurst-Sheppard/Steeles 18,750 21.2%)
Thornhill (Vaughan) 46,175 39.6%

http://www.jewishdatabank.org/studie...fm?FileID=3130
Surprised it's not higher for Thornhill and Bathurst-Sheppard. I wonder if this could be due, in part, to USSR jewish immigrants whose first language is Russian?
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  #66  
Old Posted Oct 9, 2016, 9:37 PM
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I often wonder about the Jewish headcount in US cities. Many of the Jews I know, myself included, would be described as "secular". We probably grew up in homes that belonged to Reform, Conservative, or Orthodox congregations, but as adults we did not participate in organized religious life. Still, most of us identify as being Jewish on at least some level. I recently started receiving junk mail from a Jewish organization, so I guess I must now be on the radar screen enough to be included on mailing lists. This is very recent. Probably half of the Jewish people I know here in Austin have no affiliation with a local congregation. Austin's Jewish population has exploded in the past twenty years, growing from about 5,000 to close to 18,000. I suspect the actual number of Jews in the area is at least 25% higher than these figures would indicate. I think this might be true in many other communities in the US and elsewhere.
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  #67  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2016, 6:31 AM
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Originally Posted by yaletown_fella View Post
Surprised it's not higher for Thornhill and Bathurst-Sheppard. I wonder if this could be due, in part, to USSR jewish immigrants whose first language is Russian?
Perhaps partly, though it wouldn't surprise me if a fair number of non-Jews from the FSU moved in too.

Thornhill is a very large area and it looks like what they call "Bathurst-Sheppard" stretches from Yonge to Dufferin.

Bathurst-Sheppard has a smaller Jewish population than it did a generation or two ago as older generations die off and younger generations move out. Meanwhile newer groups such as Filipinos move in.
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  #68  
Old Posted Oct 11, 2016, 3:26 AM
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100K strong in Montreal, and source of many of the city's most iconic foods.
Ashkenazi and Mizrahi/Sepharadi generally live in different neighborhoods.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_in_Montreal
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  #69  
Old Posted Oct 11, 2016, 3:38 AM
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Originally Posted by MolsonExport View Post
100K strong in Montreal, and source of many of the city's most iconic foods.
Ashkenazi and Mizrahi/Sepharadi generally live in different neighborhoods.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jews_in_Montreal
Yes and no. CSL/Hampstead has lots of both. Westmount is more secular Ashkenazi, Outremont is Hasidic Ashkenazi. St. Laurent is mostly Sephardic.
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  #70  
Old Posted Oct 11, 2016, 3:47 AM
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Looking at the Toronto data again, you can really see the shift from North York to Thornhill since the 1980s and 1990s.

The Bathurst-Sheppard area saw a substantial decline, from 30,000 in 1991 to 19,000 today. Cote St. Luc in Montreal, which is a rather similar area, has basically the same number of Jews, but they make up a larger percentage of the population. Their numbers have declined modestly.

All of Montreal's traditional Jewish neighborhoods have seen a decline or have stayed about the same over the last 20 years, the exception being the Hasidic areas (Outremont and Park Avenue/Park Extension) with their very high birth rates.
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  #71  
Old Posted Oct 11, 2016, 1:10 PM
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  #72  
Old Posted Oct 16, 2016, 1:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Docere View Post
In Britain, meanwhile, the Jewish population is much more concentrated in London nowadays than it was in the early 20th century. Manchester, Leeds and to some extent Glasgow had good sized Jewish populations.
Of those four British cities mentioned, Leeds and Glasgow certainly have declined in terms of Jewish population by A LOT in the past few decades. Manchester, however, has held its own, staying constant at roughly 30-35,000 or a bit more. This is due both to provincial British Jews moving to Manchester from places like Leeds and Glasgow, and to the increase in the Haredi population over there. Outside London, therefore, I'd say that British Jewry has concentrated itself much more in Manchester than in the past. London, of course, takes the cake in terms of ever-increasing concentrations of British Jewry living just there.

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^ More spread out than say, Baltimore, Cleveland or Detroit, but L.A. probably has the most geographically concentrated Jewish population of any Western U.S. city.
My feeling is that Detroit Jewry is more spread out than Baltimore or Cleveland Jewry, though perhaps not quite as much as LA Jewry. As an example, I'm sure that Oak Park/Southfield and West Bloomfield, where many of Detroit's more observant Jews live, are much further apart geographically than the equivalents in Cleveland like Cleveland Heights, University Heights, and Beachwood.

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Originally Posted by MayDay View Post
As mentioned, Cleveland's Jewish community is primarily in the eastern suburbs - the Orthodox community is primarily in the inner ring (Cleveland Heights and Shaker Heights); the further east you go, the more the population skews to Reform/secular.
The last time I looked - and I've spent a lot of time in Cleveland - Shaker Heights and western/southern Cleveland Heights don't have a lot of Orthodox Jews, though they have quite a few secular/liberal and wealthy Jews. It's eastern Cleveland Heights (esp. in the S. Taylor area between Cedar and Mayfield), as well as - more recently - eastern University Heights (east of Warrensville Center) and northwestern Beachwood (esp. north of Fairmount and west of Richmond), that have high concentrations of Orthodox Jews. There are somewhat fewer Orthodox Jews in between those two areas - in other words, western University Heights (west of Warrensville Center) plus S. Euclid south of Mayfield. But it is true that the rest of Beachwood, and certainly Pepper Pike, Orange, Moreland Hills, Solon, and other far eastern suburbs, all have lots of secular and wealthy Jews.

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Originally Posted by SHiRO View Post
Interesting that Oslo, Copenhagen, Stockholm, and Gothenburg all don't show up on the map while Helsinki (among Nordic cities) does. Last I looked, Copenhagen and Stockholm both have much larger communities than Helsinki. I'm not talking tens or hundreds of thousands, but as far as I believe, Copenhagen and Stockholm both have several thousand Jews.

Moreover, Brussels is also not mentioned in the map, and yet it has a Jewish population about equal to that of Antwerp, though it's a completely different kind of community (much more secularized).

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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
These days Jewish Ottawans are quite spread out although it seems there is a small concentration in the inner suburb of Nepean to the west of Ottawa. There are synagogues and community centres in that general area.
You forgot another area of diffuse Jewish concentration in Ottawa - the Alta Vista area. That, too, has a substantial number of synagogues.

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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
The Jewish community of Montreal is the 2nd largest in Canada and has about 120,000 members.
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Originally Posted by MolsonExport View Post
100K strong in Montreal, and source of many of the city's most iconic foods.
Montreal Jewry currently numbers 85-90,000, if you go according to the latest Census and Jewish communal figures. Back in the early 1970s, there were indeed 120,000 Jews in Montreal, and as recently as the early 1990s, there were still 100,000. Take my word for it, as I'm a Modern Orthodox Jew living in Montreal. (By the way, I'm brand new to this forum.)

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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
I don't know if it is true but these areas are said to have the largest concentration of Holocaust survivors in the world outside of Israel.
First of all, I don't think that for Montreal, it's specifically and only Cote St. Luc/Hampstead that has the largest concentration of survivors outside Israel, though that area does have a lot of survivors. And when you say "concentration", do you mean percentage-wise among the total Jewish population, or do you mean in terms of absolute numbers? If the latter, Montreal does have the highest number of survivors outside Israel and New York. If the former, then somewhere like Melbourne, Australia, might have an even higher percentage of survivors among the total Jewish population than Montreal.

Last edited by Yofie; Oct 16, 2016 at 5:13 PM.
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  #73  
Old Posted Oct 16, 2016, 9:48 AM
Jonesy55 Jonesy55 is offline
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Originally Posted by Yofie View Post
Of those four British cities mentioned, Leeds and Glasgow certainly have declined in terms of Jewish population by A LOT in the past few decades. Manchester, however, has held its own, staying constant at roughly 30-35,000 or a bit more. This is due both to provincial British Jews moving to Manchester from places like Leeds and Glasgow, and to the increase in the Haredi population over there. Outside London, therefore, I'd say that British Jewry has concentrated itself much more in Manchester than in the past. London, of course, takes the cake in terms of ever-increasing concentrations of British Jewry living just there.
Yes, Manchester is one place where the growth of Haredi communities has been enough to counteract the loss of secular jewish people ceasing to identify as Jewish. The other main Haredi community I can think of which is stable/growing is in Newcastle-upon-Tyne/Gateshead, but that is much smaller at some 3,000-4,000.

One feature of the London jewish population is that it is spilling over the borders of the city due to suburbanization. Here is the London Jewish population mapped from the 2011 census.



As you can see, a large part of the population lives in the Northwest of the city, especially the borough of Barnet. Just over the boundary of London, next to Barnet is the borough of Hetsmere in Hertfordshire and at the 2011 census around 15% of the population of just over 100,000 there identified as Jewish, up from 10% at the 2001 census.
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  #74  
Old Posted Oct 16, 2016, 10:15 AM
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Paris, Jewish populaton spreads all over the city (centre, west, east, north, south).
Western inner suburbs like Neuilly or Levallois have large Jewish population as well as eastern inner suburbs like Vincennes or Saint Mandé.
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  #75  
Old Posted Oct 17, 2016, 4:51 AM
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Seattle doesn't have a large Jewish population, but the rate of growth is quite rapid now. Southeast Seattle's Seward Park neighborhood and the suburbs of Mercer Island and Bellevue are the areas with large Jewish populations.

Here's a 2015 story about Seattle's Jewish population growth.

http://blogs.seattletimes.com/fyi-gu...t-study-finds/
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  #76  
Old Posted Oct 17, 2016, 5:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
Orthodox neighborhoods are numerous throughout NY and NJ (but none in CT).
There actually are some new jewish neighborhoods in Waterbury, CT now.

Orthodox Jews Come to a Well-Worn City, Pleased to Find a Piece of Paradise

choice quote from that article:
Quote:
Rabbi Kaufman imagines the day when everyone considers Waterbury the nucleus of New England Jewish life.

A subdivision has been built explicitly for the jewish on the north side.
http://www.blueridgewaterbury.com/commynity/

And now a jewish high school has been proposed in neighboring Naugatuck.

Jewish school on radar
Developer hopes to build prep school

October 15, 2016
BY LARAINE WESCHLERREPUBLICAN-AMERICAN

NAUGATUCK – A Jewish University with locations across the country wants to build a private high school with a campus on the corner of May Street and Maple Hill Road.

http://www.rep-am.com/featured/2016/...hool-on-radar/
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  #77  
Old Posted Oct 17, 2016, 2:59 PM
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everyone has their sukkah up on my street. because i live in a newer neighborhood in the suburbs from the 20s on, everyone has a driveway, even apartment buildings, and so thats where they put the sukkah up.
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  #78  
Old Posted Oct 17, 2016, 3:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Minato Ku View Post
Paris, Jewish populaton spreads all over the city (centre, west, east, north, south).
Western inner suburbs like Neuilly or Levallois have large Jewish population as well as eastern inner suburbs like Vincennes or Saint Mandé.
They are in Créteil too, Minato. In Maisons-Alfort that I live for now, we have a small community of theirs as well, and almost everyone but a few is friendly at them, trying to make them confident.

They are over the rougher side of the 19th arrondissement beyond Stalingrad that I lived for a while when I was a student, along avenue de Flandre. And many of them are in Sarcelles, a very tough suburb.

They are pretty much everywhere, over the rich, average and poor areas just like any regular people. That's why I don't get any insulting stereotype. They are regular fair people in real life.
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  #79  
Old Posted Oct 17, 2016, 3:40 PM
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They are pretty much everywhere, over the rich, average and poor areas just like any regular people. That's why I don't get any insulting stereotype. They are regular fair people in real life.
Which is generally different than in the U.S.

In the U.S., outside of NYC and a few Orthodox or immigrant communities, Jewish enclaves tend to be among the wealthiest and highest educated in the U.S.

A good rule of thumb when trying to find Jewish neighborhoods in the U.S.- find the "favored quarter" in a city/metro, and some slice of that "favored quarter" will be heavily Jewish.

So if Paris were in the U.S., the Jewish neighborhoods would probably be somewhere within the boundaries of Paris 7 and 16, Neuilly, Boulogne-Billancourt.
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  #80  
Old Posted Oct 17, 2016, 3:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
Which is generally different than in the U.S.

In the U.S., outside of NYC and a few Orthodox or immigrant communities, Jewish enclaves tend to be among the wealthiest and highest educated in the U.S.

A good rule of thumb when trying to find Jewish neighborhoods in the U.S.- find the "favored quarter" in a city/metro, and some slice of that "favored quarter" will be heavily Jewish.

So if Paris were in the U.S., the Jewish neighborhoods would probably be somewhere within the boundaries of Paris 7 and 16, Neuilly, Boulogne-Billancourt.
i don't know how often that holds in US cities, but it certainly does in mine. the (orthodox) jewish slice sits on the top edge of the favored quarter like a long slice of cheese on a hoagie, topped with a middle class asian sauce covered with a middle/upper middle class african-american bun. (then there is kind of an industrial valley through the suburbs). i'm sort of an accidental gentile someone dropped on the cheese when they werent paying attention. of course reform jewish folks live all across the region, but concentrate right down the middle of the favored quarter.
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