How PC has Christmas become where you live?

[Acajack]

OK, so my kids go to non-denominational public school. There is a big banner that says "Joyeux Noël" in the school lobby. They don't the religious Christmas stuff but talk of Christmas is far from verboten.

Commercial radio stations here play Christmas songs with religiously-themed lyrics all the time.

How are things where you live?

Is Christ still in Christmas?

[esquire]

If I drew a line chart illustrating the PC-ness of Christmas around here, it would have topped out around 2005 or so, and either held steady or dipped slightly since then. The extreme PC type stuff ("Gather 'round the holiday tree!") has eased up a bit.

[Nouvellecosse]

Here no one considers Christmas "un-PC" it's just un-PC to assume people celebrate Christmas without knowing anything about them, or to act like everyone celebrates Christmas when we live in an increasingly diverse society with people of different religions and cultures who celebrate a variety of different holidays around this time of year.

So if you're dealing with the public and interacting with people you don't know, you don't wish people a Merry Christmas without having any idea whether they even celebrate it or not; you simply say Happy Holidays which includes everyone. That way you're not acting like people who doesn't celebrate Christmas doesn't exist or aren't important.

I assumed it was like that everywhere in Canada...

[Aylmer]

I figure that much of Christmas (even some of the religious songs) have become very secular at this point. I'd be very interested to hear from some non-Christian/non-atheist forumers to see whether they feel 'included' in Christmas and whether they celebrate it as a cultural holiday instead of a religious tradition.

I'm glad we're getting over the whole "it's happy holidays, not merry Christmas" thing. I don't get all up in arms when someone wishes me happy Divali and I don't think anyone of another religious denomination has ever been offended by a Christmas salutation (though there seems to be a small minority of atheists who seemed to get upset enough for everyone).

So merry Christmas, happy holidays, jolly December-25th-day, whatever floats yer boat!

[hipster duck]

I live in a very PC city (you have to start public meetings by acknowledging you're on unceded native territory), but I don't get a sense that Christmas has gotten crushed.

Maybe it's because I don't have school-aged children.

[Boris2k7]

I've never found celebrating Christmas to be controversial. I mean, the dinner table prayers of some religious relatives notwithstanding, I've always engaged in the holidays in a secular manner anyways. If the Japanese can pull off their barely-resembles the real thing/weird outside of its cultural context Christmas, I can certainly go through the motions without being a militant Athiest.

With regards to the cultural climate here, I'd regard it as almost anti-PC. You know, Ralph Klein/straight shooter/say it like it is sort of culture. Some people will say "Merry Christmas" in a manner like they've got something to prove (you'll hear those types snickering over the water cooler about the 'Happy Holidays' in the corporate email).

[Nouvellecosse]

Originally Posted by Aylmer

I figure that much of Christmas (even some of the religious songs) have become very secular at this point. I'd be very interested to hear from some non-Christian/non-atheist forumers to see whether they feel 'included' in Christmas and whether they celebrate it as a cultural holiday instead of a religious tradition.

I'm glad we're getting over the whole "it's happy holidays, not merry Christmas" thing. I don't get all up in arms when someone wishes me happy Divali and I don't think anyone of another religious denomination has ever been offended by a Christmas salutation (though there seems to be a small minority of atheists who seemed to get upset enough for everyone).

So merry Christmas, happy holidays, jolly December-25th-day, whatever floats yer boat!

Personally I celebrate Christmas despite not being religious and its religious origins don't both me, but I find it annoying to hear people talking about the "true meaning" of Christmas in a religious sense. No, Christianity isn't the "true meaning" of Christmas, it's the main origin of Christmas. The Christmas of today is very much a secular holiday that has religious significance to some people, but it's very much mainstream and widely shared by the religious and non-religious alike.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by Acajack

OK, so my kids go to non-denominational public school. There is a big banner that says "Joyeux Noël" in the school lobby. They don't the religious Christmas stuff but talk of Christmas is far from verboten.

Commercial radio stations here play Christmas songs with religiously-themed lyrics all the time.

How are things where you live?

Is Christ still in Christmas?

The "seasonal lighting" Downtown is less Christmassy than it used to be but the Christmas tree is up in the plaza at Kitchener City Hall and the Cristkindl Market is taking place until Sunday. Tomorrow night, KWS and the Grand Philharmonic Choir perform Handel's "Messiah" at CITS. Christmas events (Church bazaars are popular here) and concerts all over town. The local community radio station plays mostly Christmas music for weeks (last year it lasted into January!). Victoria Park has lots of lights, but the biggest local display is Waterloo's "Wonders of Winter", which includes a very large Nativity Scene. A number of local schools do Christmas-related events, although I don't know how much "Christmas" individual schools do. I don't usually start wishing people "Merry Christmas" until about the 15th of the month.

Oh, and the parking lots in the big box malls have been noticeably busy for a few weeks already.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by Nouvellecosse

Here no one considers Christmas "un-PC" it's just un-PC to assume people celebrate Christmas without knowing anything about them, or to act like everyone celebrates Christmas when we live in an increasingly diverse society with people of different religions and cultures who celebrate a variety of different holidays around this time of year.

So if you're dealing with the public and interacting with people you don't know, you don't wish people a Merry Christmas without having any idea whether they even celebrate it or not; you simply say Happy Holidays which includes everyone. That way you're not acting like people who doesn't celebrate Christmas doesn't exist or aren't important.

I assumed it was like that everywhere in Canada...

I wish everyone Merry Christmas, including non-Christians. I like to be inclusive and I find it is appreciated. I've had Muslim store clerks here wish me Merry Christmas, which I find nice.

[artvandelay]

Originally Posted by Nouvellecosse

So if you're dealing with the public and interacting with people you don't know, you don't wish people a Merry Christmas without having any idea whether they even celebrate it or not; you simply say Happy Holidays which includes everyone. That way you're not acting like people who doesn't celebrate Christmas doesn't exist or aren't important.

I don't really agree with this.

Why would anyone would be offended by being wished Merry Christmas though? Whenever someone wishes me Happy Hanukkah I just say thanks and return the greeting. Anyone who would take offence to something like that is very thinned skinned, in my opinion.

Christmas has become a very secularized holiday anyways - my entire family is comprised of atheists and we still celebrate it, it's a nice excuse to get together.

[Boris2k7]

Originally Posted by Nouvellecosse

Personally I celebrate Christmas despite not being religious and its religious origins don't both me, but I find it annoying to hear people talking about the "true meaning" of Christmas in a religious sense. No, Christianity isn't the "true meaning" of Christmas, it's the main origin of Christmas. The Christmas of today is very much a secular holiday that has religious significance to some people, but it's very much mainstream and widely shared by the religious and non-religious alike.

Well, and... people have been celebrating winter solstices for thousands of years. Christianity was late to the party.

[kwoldtimer]

This has me wondering. Will we hear from any Reform politicians this year about the "attack on Christmas", or have they all had their medication adjusted?

[drew]

Our son is in nursery school at an elementary in Wolseley.

They have a "winter concert" planned, which I assume is the "PC'd" Christmas concert. His class will be singing a song, but it has nothing to do with winter or Christmas. So I have no idea what to think.

[Nouvellecosse]

Originally Posted by artvandelay

I don't really agree with this.

Why would anyone would be offended by being wished Merry Christmas though? Whenever someone wishes me Happy Hanukkah I just say thanks and return the greeting. Anyone who would take offence to something like that is very thinned skinned, in my opinion.

Christmas has become a very secularized holiday anyways - my entire family is comprised of atheists and we still celebrate it, it's a nice excuse to get together.

I have no idea whether being ignored or excluded offends people or not. I'm sure some are and some aren't. Everyone is different.

And I'm an atheist who celebrates it also.

[Ashok]

Personally, being brought up as a hindu - I don't care if people wish me a Merry Christmas. I am certain they have their best of intentions + they are in a jolly mood and that puts me in a jolly mood.

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by Aylmer

I figure that much of Christmas (even some of the religious songs) have become very secular at this point. I'd be very interested to hear from some non-Christian/non-atheist forumers to see whether they feel 'included' in Christmas and whether they celebrate it as a cultural holiday instead of a religious tradition.

I'm glad we're getting over the whole "it's happy holidays, not merry Christmas" thing. I don't get all up in arms when someone wishes me happy Divali and I don't think anyone of another religious denomination has ever been offended by a Christmas salutation (though there seems to be a small minority of atheists who seemed to get upset enough for everyone).

So merry Christmas, happy holidays, jolly December-25th-day, whatever floats yer boat!

I'm an athiest of Jewish background, and I celebrate Christmas as a secular festival of gift-giving and togetherness.

I agree with the overall comment on here that Christmas is largely a secular celebration these days. I mean, Christmas is widely celebrated in Japan even though about two-thirds of Japanese are non-religious and Christians are a small minority among that remaining one-third.

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by drew

Our son is in nursery school at an elementary in Wolseley.

They have a "winter concert" planned, which I assume is the "PC'd" Christmas concert. His class will be singing a song, but it has nothing to do with winter or Christmas. So I have no idea what to think.

The elementary school I went to made national headlines a couple years ago for replacing its Christmas concert with a generic 'holiday celebration' in February.

[Deepstar]

It's funny, being raised from Chinese born parents, we used to have a Christmas tree growing up and more or less celebrated Christmas, although never the religious part. I don't know much about the religious aspect to be honest. I always greet people with Merry Christmas and expect to be greeted the same way.

Hopefully this doesn't start a big ethnic debate, but to me it seems it's like mostly non-denominational, white anglo saxons who care about the greeting the most. Maybe they are worried about offending people like me or maybe offending Hindus and Muslims. I know that it doesn't bother me at all, and the two Muslim guys I work with have no issue. One of them even puts a tree up each year.

[Ashok]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

I'm an athiest of Jewish background, and I celebrate Christmas as a secular festival of gift-giving and togetherness.

I agree with the overall comment on here that Christmas is largely a secular celebration these days. I mean, Christmas is widely celebrated in Japan even though about two-thirds of Japanese are non-religious and Christians are a small minority among that remaining one-third.

OOOO! I know why they celebrate Christmas in Japan. Bloody corporations and their effective marketing campaigns! Apprently, the traditional Christmas meal in Japan is KFC, and apprently, you need to put in orders weeks in advance.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Deepstar

It's funny, being raised from Chinese born parents, we used to have a Christmas tree growing up and more or less celebrated Christmas, although never the religious part. I don't know much about it to be honest. I always greet people with Merry Christmas and expect to be greeted that way.

Hopefully this doesn't start a big ethnic debate, but to me it seems it's like mostly non-denominational, white anglo saxons who care about the greeting the most. Maybe they are worried about offending people like me or maybe offending Hindus and Muslims. I know that it doesn't bother me at all, and the two Muslim guys I work with have no issue. One of them even puts a tree up each year.

Good point... maybe it really is one of those issues where it's mostly non-denominational white folks fretting about offending others while for the most part Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists and others don't really give a shit.

Your post reminded me of this: http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.com/2008...eater-parties/