HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Atlantic Provinces > Halifax > Transportation & Infrastructure


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #21  
Old Posted Feb 1, 2016, 11:18 PM
OldDartmouthMark OldDartmouthMark is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 8,407
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phalanx View Post
Actually, our climates are remarkably similar. It gets a bit colder here in the winter, but not by much (average highs are about the same, we just have lower lows). So a bit more snow, but our conditions are not extremely different by any measure. They get hurricanes about as often as we do.

Anyway, all of that is moot because wind turbines are already demonstrably working here. Other places with turbines have to deal with high winds and storm situations, and turbines typically aren't built where conditions do not permit. Again, I'll leave it to people far more knowledgeable in these things to figure out, and they already seem to think it's workable, so there you go.

And nuclear waste is always a problem. Yes, there are lots of storage options, but they all require long term and intensive monitoring. And while it doesn't happen often, things can and do go wrong with storage...

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-us...0HE03020140919

And then you have good old human error and indifference...

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-26658719

So brush it off as fear mongering all you want, but there are many practical problems with nuclear waste. Not something I want to have to put blind faith in for the next few (24k) years.
I agree.

I don't think anybody has come up with a reliable way to store nuclear waste for tens of thousands of years... if they said they did I'm afraid I'd have to call BS.

I'm not sure what their target life is but at some point the containment areas will have to be safely repaired/refurbished/replaced. There is a financial cost related to that as well as an environmental/ethical cost should anything go wrong.

For the life of me, I can't understand why we would want to burden our descendants with having to deal with this for hundreds of generations to come. Cripes, what we've already done to the planet through our consuming other forms of stored energy is bad enough...
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #22  
Old Posted Feb 2, 2016, 2:49 AM
Colin May Colin May is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,480
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phalanx View Post
Actually, our climates are remarkably similar. It gets a bit colder here in the winter, but not by much (average highs are about the same, we just have lower lows). So a bit more snow, but our conditions are not extremely different by any measure. They get hurricanes about as often as we do.

Anyway, all of that is moot because wind turbines are already demonstrably working here. Other places with turbines have to deal with high winds and storm situations, and turbines typically aren't built where conditions do not permit. Again, I'll leave it to people far more knowledgeable in these things to figure out, and they already seem to think it's workable, so there you go.

And nuclear waste is always a problem. Yes, there are lots of storage options, but they all require long term and intensive monitoring. And while it doesn't happen often, things can and do go wrong with storage...

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-us...0HE03020140919

And then you have good old human error and indifference...

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-26658719

So brush it off as fear mongering all you want, but there are many practical problems with nuclear waste. Not something I want to have to put blind faith in for the next few (24k) years.
My reference to storms is in the context of storm influence on engineered structures at sea level, or below sea level,and designed to generate tidal power.
Brand covers nuclear waste storage in his book. I have a copy.
The book is available at local library :
http://www.halifax.ca/boardscom/bpc/...Search=oneword
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23  
Old Posted Feb 2, 2016, 12:57 PM
IanWatson IanWatson is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,220
It is indeed true that the wind doesn't blow all the time. In the short term that can be a challenge for grid operators, but they do balance it out. Hydro-electric dams and natural gas plants are good pairs for wind because they can basically be turned on and off at will to balance out fluctuations in wind. Coal isn't such a good pair because ramping up a coal plant is a 15+ minute process. In Nova Scotia we have a good mix of different sources of generation, so there was a fair bit of capacity in the grid to accommodate wind. With South Canoe coming on-line Nova Scotia has basically hit its limit for stable wind integration, so we probably won't see new projects for a while.

It will be interesting to see what happens to the Provincial Government's appetite for new wind when Muskrat Falls is complete, because on one hand it supplies a new option for balancing wind, while on the other hand it'll put us over the 40% renewables threshold set out in legislation. At least with this Liberal government, I don't suspect there is too much drive to set a new renewable target that's higher than 40%.

Even though wind does need to be backed up to some degree, there's no denying that the 27 percent of power supplied by renewables was 27 percent that didn't require burning fuel. One could argue that the need for backup does require a duplication in capital infrastructure (i.e. you need a wind plant and a gas plant) and in the short term that is to some degree true. However, a certain percentage of wind (I don't know the number off the top of my head) can be counted on for firm power. A few of the coal units at Trenton or Point Acconi (can't remember which) were decommissioned a few years ago due to the new federal air quality regs, but they weren't replaced because wind did provide enough firm power.

In the medium term the world's investment in wind probably will mean we can decommission old fossil fuel plants. Battery technology is racing forward, and other options for energy storage are being developed (Nova Scotia's LightSail Energy for one). We likely won't see too many power companies decommission existing plants early purely based on wind development, because that would mean writing off a capital asset. But as existing plants run up against air quality regs or reach the end of their 50+ year capital depreciation curve they will be decommissioned and not replaced.

On a side note, if you ever get a chance to visit a NSP open house at one of their plants I highly suggest you do. They often have their engineers on hand and they tend to be VERY knowledgeable people who don't have the same corporate "scared of saying anything at all meaningful" filter that you get when you talk to the higher-ups.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #24  
Old Posted Feb 3, 2016, 6:28 PM
fenwick16 fenwick16 is offline
Honored Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Toronto area (ex-Nova Scotian)
Posts: 5,558
These would be the Godzilla of wind turbines. Maybe we will see these offshore Nova Scotia sometime in the future. If not this large, then maybe 80 meter long blades as employed in the largest currently offshore wind turbine, located in Japan.


Researchers working on massive wind turbines with blades two football fields long
U.S. Dept. of Energy-funded project developing 200-metre blades for enormous 50-megawatt offshore turbines



Todd Griffith shows a cross-section model of a 50-meter blade. Sandia National Laboratories says the technology could lead to the massive 200-metre blades. PHOTO: Sandia/Randy Montoya
.
.
.
The research team’s design will dwarf even the largest turbines in operation, and would make the one or two-MW turbines common onshore across the world appear absolutely miniature. For comparison, the world’s largest current offshore wind turbine was anchored off the shore of Japan last year; it employs 80-metre blades and has a generating capacity of seven MW.

The new design, however, includes blades 200-metre long—twice the length of a football field—and offers a whopping 50-megawatt generating capacity.
.
.
.

FULL STORY - http://www.canadianmanufacturing.com...ECH-EN02032016
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #25  
Old Posted Feb 4, 2016, 12:19 PM
beyeas beyeas is offline
Fizzix geek
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: South End, Hali
Posts: 1,303


Cool!
I used to work in Albuquerque, and had security clearance to enter Sandia National Labs (it is on an air force base that also doubles as a nuclear missile base) as part of a research collaboration I had going there. Crazy shit they had going on (much of it around energy research actually), include sometimes where they would make these cryptic announcements like "You will hear a very loud explosion in the desert south of the base at 1:15pm today. Please ignore."! Everything from fusion reactors to all kinds of crazy stuff going on there!

Last edited by beyeas; Feb 5, 2016 at 3:54 PM. Reason: spelling mistake
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #26  
Old Posted Feb 4, 2016, 6:40 PM
someone123's Avatar
someone123 someone123 is offline
hähnchenbrüstfiletstüc
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 33,673
Quote:
Originally Posted by beyeas View Post
I used to work in Albuquerque, and had security clearance to enter Sandia National Labs (it is on an air force base that also doubles as a nuclear missile base) as part of a research collaboration I had going there. Crazy shit they had going on (much of it around energy research actually), include sometimes where they would make these cryptic announcements like "You will hear a very loud explosion in the desert south of the base at 1:15pm today. Please ignore."! Everything from fusion reactors to all kids of crazy stuff going on there!
A place near my house is working on some kind of fusion reactor. Apparently some models predict a low probability that everything within a few kilometers will be vapourized if a certain chain of events happens.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #27  
Old Posted Feb 4, 2016, 8:40 PM
fenwick16 fenwick16 is offline
Honored Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Toronto area (ex-Nova Scotian)
Posts: 5,558
Quote:
Originally Posted by someone123 View Post
A place near my house is working on some kind of fusion reactor. Apparently some models predict a low probability that everything within a few kilometers will be vapourized if a certain chain of events happens.
So there just a slight possibility of a small H-bomb occurring in your neighbourhood .
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #28  
Old Posted Feb 4, 2016, 9:35 PM
OldDartmouthMark OldDartmouthMark is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 8,407
Quote:
Originally Posted by someone123 View Post
A place near my house is working on some kind of fusion reactor. Apparently some models predict a low probability that everything within a few kilometers will be vapourized if a certain chain of events happens.
Yikes!

If ever there was a compelling case to be a NIMBY, this is it!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #29  
Old Posted Feb 5, 2016, 3:56 PM
beyeas beyeas is offline
Fizzix geek
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: South End, Hali
Posts: 1,303
Quote:
Originally Posted by someone123 View Post
A place near my house is working on some kind of fusion reactor. Apparently some models predict a low probability that everything within a few kilometers will be vapourized if a certain chain of events happens.
Meh... they said the same thing about the Large Hadron Collider, but it's all good! There is a far higher probability of everything being vaporized (including the economy) if a certain chain of events happens which leads to the election of Donald Trump.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #30  
Old Posted Feb 5, 2016, 4:55 PM
someone123's Avatar
someone123 someone123 is offline
hähnchenbrüstfiletstüc
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 33,673
Quote:
Originally Posted by beyeas View Post
Meh... they said the same thing about the Large Hadron Collider, but it's all good! There is a far higher probability of everything being vaporized (including the economy) if a certain chain of events happens which leads to the election of Donald Trump.
I will be surprised if they accomplish anything at this place. It's just a little startup, not the Max Planck institute. TRIUMF is more interesting.

I also have a rail line running about 100 meters from my house. The train cars carry mundane but hazardous materials like oil, benzene, and sulfuric acid. I think that has a much larger chance of actually causing problems. The "riskiest" thing in my life is probably my sedentary desk job.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #31  
Old Posted Feb 5, 2016, 4:57 PM
MonctonRad's Avatar
MonctonRad MonctonRad is online now
Wildcats Rule!!
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Moncton NB
Posts: 34,342
Quote:
Originally Posted by someone123 View Post
A place near my house is working on some kind of fusion reactor. Apparently some models predict a low probability that everything within a few kilometers will be vapourized if a certain chain of events happens.
Star Labs!!!!

Watch out for meta-humans wandering in your neighbourhood.....
__________________
Go 'Cats Go
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #32  
Old Posted Feb 5, 2016, 6:53 PM
Colin May Colin May is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,480
Quote:
Originally Posted by someone123 View Post
I will be surprised if they accomplish anything at this place. It's just a little startup, not the Max Planck institute. TRIUMF is more interesting.

I also have a rail line running about 100 meters from my house. The train cars carry mundane but hazardous materials like oil, benzene, and sulfuric acid. I think that has a much larger chance of actually causing problems. The "riskiest" thing in my life is probably my sedentary desk job.
Bed is the riskiest place.
More people die in a bed than anywhere else.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #33  
Old Posted Feb 5, 2016, 8:41 PM
OldDartmouthMark OldDartmouthMark is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 8,407
Quote:
Originally Posted by Colin May View Post
Bed is the riskiest place.
More people die in a bed than anywhere else.
Hospitals... stay out of hospitals.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #34  
Old Posted Feb 6, 2016, 8:33 PM
Colin May Colin May is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,480
If you are into tidal power.....or wind......or nuclear
http://www.theguardian.com/environme...d-say-lib-dems
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #35  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2016, 1:39 PM
OldDartmouthMark OldDartmouthMark is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 8,407
Quote:
Originally Posted by Colin May View Post
If you are into tidal power.....or wind......or nuclear
http://www.theguardian.com/environme...d-say-lib-dems
Interesting. It appears that, as usual, the best technology for environment, etc., will be bypassed for the cheaper alternative.

Would be interesting to see how that plays out.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #36  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2016, 6:28 PM
fenwick16 fenwick16 is offline
Honored Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Toronto area (ex-Nova Scotian)
Posts: 5,558
This gives an idea of the potential of offshore wind power - http://www.canadianmanufacturing.com...CMO-EN02092016. It seems like huge wind turbines (7 megawatts each) are becoming commonplace.
World’s largest offshore wind farm to be built off U.K. coast
Dong Energy forging ahead with plan to build huge 1.2 gigawatt wind farm

LONDON—Spread across 407 square-kilometres of turbulent, North Sea salt water off the U.K.’s east coast, DONG Energy is planning the world’s largest offshore wind project.

Due east of Hull, 120 kilometres from the rocky Yorkshire shoreline, the Denmark-based energy firm plans to install approximately 170 enormous, 7 megawatt wind turbines. With a planned capacity of 1.2 GW, the ambitious Hornsea Project One, which was given the green-light last week, will power well over one million U.K. homes.

“We are making a major financial investment to construct this giant wind farm and this underlines our commitment to the UK market,” Dong Energy’s UK chairman Brent Cheshire, said. “Hornsea Project One will support the supply chain and help create local jobs. To have the world’s biggest ever offshore wind farm located off the Yorkshire coast is hugely significant, and highlights the vital role offshore wind will play in the UK’s need for new low-carbon energy.”

.
.
.
Reply With Quote
     
     
End
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Atlantic Provinces > Halifax > Transportation & Infrastructure
Forum Jump


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 10:32 AM.

     
SkyscraperPage.com - Archive - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.