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  #1  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2007, 2:07 PM
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Centre Mall -> The Centre on Barton

Centre Mall owners plan 23-building super centre

September 26, 2007
By Steve Arnold

The owners of Hamilton’s Centre Mall have filed plans with the city to turn the property into a super centre with 23 commercial buildings.

The $100-million proposal, which is being circulated to city staff, calls for a project of 700,000 square feet of retail space — about 85 per cent the size of Lime Ridge Mall.

Ray Lee, acting manager of development planning, said the buildings on the site will be grouped around the edge of the property.

“It’s going to create a friendly, pedestrian-oriented design, rather than a commercial island in a sea of parking along Barton Street,” he said.

The east-end mall is co-owned by the CPP Investment Board, a Crown corporation that invests funds from the Canada Pension Plan, and Osmington Inc., a Canadian real estate firm.

It is managed by Toronto-based Redcliff Realty Management.

The only structures that won’t be razed are the Canadian Tire and Beer Store buildings, said Ward 4 Councillor Sam Merulla.

“This is the largest inner-city redevelopment project in the history of the east end,” Merulla said.

Once key city departments have reviewed the plans, the owners have one year to apply for a building permit. Merulla expects fast action.

“I think they’re only a few weeks away from the start of serious redevelopment work.”
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  #2  
Old Posted Nov 1, 2007, 4:46 PM
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Does anyone think this will do anything for the surrounding neighbourhood? Honest question.
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  #3  
Old Posted Nov 1, 2007, 5:02 PM
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^^that's a good question. Hopefully it will. Since the retail space will be bigger than what's currently at Centre Mall, hopefully it will employ more people. Hopefully it will not negatively impact existing businesses on Barton, Kenilworth and Ottawa. Hopefully the inependent shops currently in Centre Mall won't all be driven out of business, and perhaps could even fill in some of the many empty storefronts on Barton and Kenilworth. Hopefully...
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Old Posted Nov 1, 2007, 7:57 PM
raisethehammer raisethehammer is offline
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it'll be a positive for the younger crowd moving into the area. I know 5 or 6 young couple who have all bought homes near there and they can't wait.
The old folks will hate it. Centre Mall is much like Mountain Plaza..a real gathering spot for these older people.
Not sure where they'll go now...maybe a diner on Ottawa St or something? There's a 'food court' building in this new plan, so maybe that can become the hangout for older folks.
I think it'll help the neighbourhood though.
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Old Posted Nov 1, 2007, 9:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Dalton View Post
Does anyone think this will do anything for the surrounding neighbourhood? Honest question.
I think it will help the neighbourhood. Not as much as the City claims, but it'll definately help out. ANY development in this area is a welcome sight!

Like Flar said, I'm pretty sure some of the smaller indy places will find new homes in storefronts along Barton/Kenilworth. Much like Jumpoff which is opening in an old bank or something at the S/E corner of Barton/Kenilworth.

Aslong as a Walmart doesn't open up, I don't think Ottawa St will be negatively effected. Actually, I think the relocation of the Centre Mall Farmer's Market to Ottawa street will be a blessing.

I also know ppl who have recently moved into this hood. However, they didn't move b/c the "new mall development", but rather b/c the houses are DIRT CHEAP! One couple I know even moved there from Toronto!? Strange spot for a Torontonian to move to!? hahaha
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Old Posted Nov 1, 2007, 9:57 PM
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yea, my friends didn't move 'because of the mall' at all.
they love the treed streets, nice homes and close proximity to everything.
everything come around...the lower city is really being populated with young couples again. The school board should look pretty stupid (as if they can get any stupider than they already are) in 10 years when people are begging for more schools in the lower city.
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Old Posted Nov 1, 2007, 10:03 PM
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The school board should look pretty stupid (as if they can get any stupider than they already are) in 10 years when people are begging for more schools in the lower city.
I'm actually pretty shocked that they build new in the lower city at all!?
There's one new school at Wentworth/Cannon area (beside Pinky Lewis Rec Ctr) and they're actually buildign a new school at the Queen Vic location across the street from me!! Anyone have any renderings of the new school? I'm so curious to see how it'll look? The land is so small, I'm thinking the school's going to have to be at least 3 stories tall!?
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Old Posted Nov 1, 2007, 10:36 PM
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They like to have new school buildings. I don't know if it's true, but they say the old buildings are not equipped for modern education. Also the maintenance costs are said to be higher than building a new utilitarian building. This thread is amazing and perhaps suggests otherwise: http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=137836

It shows Denver's old schools. They take care of their beautiful historic schools. Perhaps they understand how aesthetics and pride in the surroundings can enhance education. Why do you think universities are proud of their beautiful campuses?
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  #9  
Old Posted Nov 2, 2007, 4:45 PM
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Centre Mall Farmers' Market receives second life

Kevin Werner, Mountain
(Nov 2, 2007)

The Centre Mall Farmer's Market may have found a second life.

Ottawa Street Business Improvement Area officials and Ward 4 councillor Sam Merulla announced Oct. 26, a tentative agreement to relocate the market from Centre Mall to the Ottawa Street BIA area.

"It's great news," said Mr. Merulla. "This is in the best interest of the stallholders, the city and the Ottawa Street BIA."

Mr. Merulla said there is an "agreement in principle" to relocate the estimated 15 stallholders from behind the Centre Mall, where they have sold their goods for 52 years, to a two-block strip on Ottawa Street from Edinburgh Avenue to Cannon Street.

He said a meeting held between farmers and the Centre Mall's representatives, Redcliff Realty Group, on Oct. 26, which is undergoing a $100 million renovation of the mall, resulted in "unanimous" consent from the estimated 15 stallholders to relocate the market to Ottawa Street. Mr. Merulla said the mall's owners are prepared to provide some "resources" to help the stallholders relocate.

The proposed location is a now closed city-owned parking lot, said Patty Despinic, the executive director of the Ottawa Street BIA.

"It will be a boost for both Ottawa Street, and for the market," she said. (The farmers) will benefit with a higher profile."

Ms. Despinic cautioned it's "still early" in finalizing the relocation plans of the market to Ottawa Street, with questions still to be asked and answered. Ms. Despinic acknowledged there are a number of "hurdles to be conquered" including installing washrooms, connecting hydro services, providing parking, and how to clean up after the market closes.

"We are on a learning curve," she said. "But where there is a will, there is a way."

Mr. Merulla said the city is proposed to transfer the lease arrangement with the stallholders to the city-owned property on Ottawa Street.

But Doug Fletcher, manager of the Farmer's Market, and owner of Fletcher Fruit Farms in Binbrook, said no final deal has been worked out.

"We need to have a large enough area to hold all of us," he said. "We haven't decided if we like that (Ottawa Street BIA) spot."

Mr. Fletcher said there are about 30 stallholders operating at the centre mall.

The stallholders have until the end of December before the market closes down, he said.

Mr. Fletcher said the meeting with the mall's representatives was a "total waste of time for us farmers." He said they wanted to continue operating the market at Centre Mall, but the mall's representatives refused to consider the idea.

Mr. Fletcher said any relocation would take place in January, during the market's slow month of operations where only two or three stallholders operate.

Ms. Despinic said it would be better for the Ottawa Street BIA to ease into organizing a farmers' market with only a limited number of stallholders to better understand their needs and operations.

The market operates from May to November on Wednesday, Friday and Saturday from 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. During the rest of the year the market operates on Friday and Saturday from 8 a.m. to 4 p.m.

She said a stakeholder meeting is scheduled for Nov. 1 to discuss the farmers' market relocation.

Mr. Merulla acknowledges there are some stallholders who are "cautious" about the relocation proposal. But he is emphatic the move would be in the best interest of the stallholders.

The stallholders were told early last month that the mall was kicking them out after over 50 years to accommodate the mammoth expansion. The mall is being redevelopment to 700,000 square feet and an additional 23 new stores will be built.

"This would be perfect for them," he said. "This had been a private issue, and I turned it into a city issue. This will be best for the east end of the city, and it will boost the number one tourist attraction in Hamilton along Ottawa Street."
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  #10  
Old Posted Nov 12, 2007, 1:44 PM
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Redcliff has the new site plan posted on their site now:

http://www.redcliffrealty.com/leasin...l).Sept-07.pdf

not unlike original site plan from 2005, except tenant names are now appearing. I notice no Sears on the map, the unnamed spot next to Zellers is the Real Canadian Superstore site (the reason why Farmers Market was not invited back)
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  #11  
Old Posted Nov 12, 2007, 1:59 PM
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^^ Wow that looks terrible!!

it seems like you couldn't even walk from store to store if you wanted to?! wow, I'm really dissapointed. Is this 100% the final land draft?
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  #12  
Old Posted Nov 12, 2007, 2:10 PM
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Here's from what I leaked out two years ago

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  #13  
Old Posted Nov 12, 2007, 2:20 PM
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We know that a power centre type development won't be ped friendly, but they still need more presence along Barton. Unfortunately I bet most of the buildings along Barton will not have entrances on Barton. They'll just be brick walls and you'll have to go around to get in the stores. Basically like the fake entrance on the Concession St Shoppers.
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  #14  
Old Posted Nov 12, 2007, 2:26 PM
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wow...brutal.
I was hoping they'd at least have the Barton St area all done in a continuous facade.
other than shoppers and canadian tire do they have any more tenants??
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  #15  
Old Posted Nov 12, 2007, 3:00 PM
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zellers, rbc, cibc, scotia
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  #16  
Old Posted Nov 12, 2007, 3:34 PM
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hopefully no drivethrus.
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Old Posted Nov 12, 2007, 4:33 PM
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From that site plan it looks like there is provision for 6 drive throughs (laneways circling the buildings)
-CIBC
-Royal Bank
-Scotia Bank
-TD
-Food Court Pavillion
-Retail Block S
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  #18  
Old Posted Nov 12, 2007, 4:36 PM
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^it wouldn't make sense without them.
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  #19  
Old Posted Nov 12, 2007, 5:48 PM
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it wouldn't be Hamilton without them too.
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  #20  
Old Posted Nov 12, 2007, 7:24 PM
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Everywhere has drive throughs not just Hamilton. This includes downtown Toronto.

A monkey laying a dung would have arranged a better site plan than that.
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