Trans Canada Highway Twinning: Segments U/C

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

^ that one really bothers me. Making that distinction is important, even on a high level of navigation as freeways have such huge time advantages over regular highways. Distinguishing 4 lane roads isn't as important.

I think I am of the same view.

Here is the view of my part of the world in Google Maps.

https://www.google.com/maps/@45.5183...2612891,10.72z

To your random Chinese, Russian or even American or Albertan guy who doesn't know the highway numbering hierarchy in Ontario and Quebec, how can you tell from this that the 417 is four lanes divided controlled access, the 50 is all controlled access, with portions four lane divided and others super-2, and the 17 and 148 are two lane rural highways? They can't unless they zoom in quite a bit.

[Acajack]

Even in the U.S. I find online electronic maps are not always intuitive.

Obviously if you see an Interstate shield on a map you know what you're getting into, but in some cases there are U.S. highways (one level down from Interstates) or even state routes that are multi-lane divided controlled access, and as fast as Interstates. But the way they're shown on maps you often don't know what they are and they could be two-lane rural highways with lots of stoplights and lots of passing lanes, for all you know.

Another thing is that it's not always practical to zoom into the entire route you're gonna follow. If you zoom in on the A-50 in eastern Gatineau it appears as four lane divided controlled access. If you zoom in a bit further around the Montebello area it's the same but you miss the fact there are fairly long sections on your route that are undivided super-2.

So colour coding and even a different design depending on the nature of the route would be great. Just like in the good old days.

Maybe not as complicated as this, but it gives a good idea:

http://www.cartotalk.com/uploads/mon...1247967045.png

[Glacier]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

By 2+1 I mean the following configuration:
Median barrier to separate both directions,
2 lanes in one direction, but only 1 in the other,
Alternating every now and then so both directions have equal passing opportunity.

Ah, I see. I have driven the Sea to Sky recently and I don't remember seeing a 2+1 divided highway. The only place I can think of off the top of my head where I've seen that is a short section of highway 97 north 100 Mile House... https://www.google.ca/maps/@51.67642...7i13312!8i6656

[hipster duck]

Google Maps doesn't distinguish between types of 4-lane roads from a far distance because Google Maps isn't intended to be used like a conventional roadmap where you scan the lines on paper and trace your route.

You're supposed to punch in your destination and have the algorithm determine the optimal route for you based on traffic conditions gathered from the GPS on the phones of millions of users (possibly you!).

For old school map buffs, there's the excellent, user-generated OpenStreetMap.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by hipster duck

Google Maps doesn't distinguish between types of 4-lane roads from a far distance because Google Maps isn't intended to be used like a conventional roadmap where you scan the lines on paper and trace your route.

You're supposed to punch in your destination and have the algorithm determine the optimal route for you based on traffic conditions gathered from the GPS on the phones of millions of users (possibly you!).

For old school map buffs, there's the excellent, user-generated OpenStreetMap.

A thing of beauty that is!

[Taeolas]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Another thing is that it's not always practical to zoom into the entire route you're gonna follow. If you zoom in on the A-50 in eastern Gatineau it appears as four lane divided controlled access. If you zoom in a bit further around the Montebello area it's the same but you miss the fact there are fairly long sections on your route that are undivided super-2.

So colour coding and even a different design depending on the nature of the route would be great. Just like in the good old days.

Count me as one person who was fooled by A-50. For Canada Day 150, I went up to Ottawa, and for some variety, I figured I would take the Quebec route instead of the Ontario route. I looked on Google Maps and scouted A-50 a little, basically checking Gatineau and Montreal, and saw it was 4 lane divided (I zoomed in enough to see the 2 lines), and figured it was fully divided along the entire route.

Imagine my surprise when I actually got there and the 4 lane went down to a 2 lane 2 way highway outside Montreal and for most of the distance.

Still, it's a beautiful drive and I don't regret taking it; but it was surprising since I figured a major route between two major cities would be fully twinned.

[le calmar]

Originally Posted by Taeolas

Still, it's a beautiful drive and I don't regret taking it; but it was surprising since I figured a major route between two major cities would be fully twinned.

The 50 is only practical if you happen to be in the east end of Gatineau or if your destination is the north shore of Montreal, Laval or beyond. It will be fully twinned in the near future so it might become a slightly more interesting alternative eventually.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by le calmar

The 50 is only practical if you happen to be in the east end of Gatineau or if your destination is the north shore of Montreal, Laval or beyond. It will be fully twinned in the near future so it might become a slightly more interesting alternative eventually.

I find it depends what time you have to cross inner Ottawa between one of the bridges and the 417. Getting to the 417 via Vanier Parkway or King Edward or Nicholas is often a huge pain.

I live near Montée Paiement in near-eastern Gatineau and almost always take the A-50 when going to Montreal. Even to downtown Montreal.

Even if leaving from Hull I'll take the A-50 if I think there will be traffic in Ottawa along the routes to the 417.

Also, the A-50 (to A-15 route) also dumps you east of Décarie in Montreal, so you avoid that mess as well.

Anyway, this is probably too much detail for this thread!

[Dengler Avenue]

Speaking of Québec, Route 117 is technically part of Route Transcanadienne as well (via Abitibi-Témiscamingue). Any update on the twinning between Labelle and Rivière Rouge? People there have been fighting for an upgrade to as far as Mont Laurier for a while. That route has also seen a lot of bizarre accidents over the year.

I suppose this is a much lesser known route to most people (unless they drive trucks) because it sends them to Val-d’Or (after traversing through the wilderness of Vérendrye for a goooood while) instead of Ottawa.

[le calmar]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I find it depends what time you have to cross inner Ottawa between one of the bridges and the 417. Getting to the 417 via Vanier Parkway or King Edward or Nicholas is often a huge pain.

Yes, taking the 50 if you are not too far away (Byward market, Sussex) can save you some time during rush hour. I agree that getting to the 417 can be a pain, especially if you want to go east from King Edward, since the (permanent?) on-ramp closure on Lees it has become difficult to go east from there. There is always the option of getting off the 50 at Grenville-sur-la-Rouge, going through Hawksbury and then getting back onto the 417. It adds an extra 10 min to the trip but I did it a few times.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by le calmar

Yes, taking the 50 if you are not too far away (Byward market, Sussex) can save you some time during rush hour. I agree that getting to the 417 can be a pain, especially if you want to go east from King Edward, since the (permanent?) on-ramp closure on Lees it has become difficult to go east from there. .

I was thinking more of leaving from the Quebec side, though this could make sense if you're very close to the bridges in that part of Ottawa. Though you don't have to get very far from the river for it to make more sense to make the trudge to the 417.

Before they finished the southern A-30 bypass around Montreal, many relatives and friends of mine who lived in eastern Ottawa bound for Quevec City or the Maritimes would cross at the Masson-Cumberland ferry, then take the A-50, A-15, A-640 and A-40 going east.

Originally Posted by le calmar

There is always the option of getting off the 50 at Grenville-sur-la-Rouge, going through Hawksbury and then getting back onto the 417. It adds an extra 10 min to the trip but I did it a few times.

I do this too sometimes. About a month ago I took this route to get to the A-10 (via the A-30).

[red-paladin]

Here are the lists of completed and currently under construction or planning Highway 1 twinning projects in BC between Kamloops and Alberta.

Note that the green segments are in national parks and would have to be upgraded by the federal government.

Phase 4 of the Kicking Horse Pass project along is $450 million.

[FrAnKs]

So, the goal is really to have a non-stop Expressway linking Vancouver to Calgary ? Do you see it being totally completely in a near future?

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by FrAnKs

So, the goal is really to have a non-stop Expressway linking Vancouver to Calgary ? Do you see it being totally completely in a near future?

BC has only said they will 4-lane it, and even that is on a super long timescale. There will still be lights anywhere there is a town on the BC side as well as at grade intersections.

[tayser]

Originally Posted by FFX-ME

Actually, I just found these cool maps that map the number of lanes of major roads as well as speed limit:

http://product.itoworld.com/map/179?...1.43948&zoom=4

Pretty cool stuff. Seems most of it is twinned other than eastern BC, most of northern Ontario and NL and parts of NS.

Can't find a way to filter out the pesky red roads which are 2 lanes though.

Great map. And sweet Jesus Mary and Joseph, Canada is a long way ahead of AU in duplicating/twinning interstate routes.

Only major contiguous duplicated highway/freeway is between Melbourne & Sydney - Hume HWY/FWY (M31 -only just recently was the last traffic light removed/bypassed). I think Sydney-Brisbane will be complete in a few years - Pacific HWY/FWY (A1/M1). The Western HWY/FWY from Melbourne to Adelaide (within Victoria) is now duplicated about 200km to the west of Melbourne and planning is ongoing for major town bypasses. From the Adelaide end, about 100km is duplicated/freeway - but who knows how long it will take / if they're going to duplicate the entire 700km route.

[Innsertnamehere]

The distances between major cities in Australia is a lot further - which means less people probably drive it. Even post freeway, it'll probably be a 9 hour drive between Sydney and Brisbane. That's a long way to go between two major cities. Toronto to Montreal is more like 5-6 hours by comparison.

[red-paladin]

Originally Posted by FrAnKs

So, the goal is really to have a non-stop Expressway linking Vancouver to Calgary ? Do you see it being totally completely in a near future?

It will always have traffic lights outside the cities.

The reason I brought up the $450 million for phase four of the Kicking Horse Pass project was to illustrate how difficult and expensive this road is to rebuild. In some places it's currently 2 lanes hugging a cliff wall on one side and a cliff drop on the other. It will cost many billions of dollars to eventually complete.

[craner]

Originally Posted by FrAnKs

So, the goal is really to have a non-stop Expressway linking Vancouver to Calgary ? Do you see it being totally completely in a near future?

Flying cars will happen before it's done.

[Dengler Avenue]

I wonder if flying cars necessarily make divided 4-lane freeways on the ground obsolete in the military sense. If it does, then, in hindsight, TCH is the highway where either we should have got it done right the first time or we shouldn’t have bothered with it afterwards.

Also check http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...90293&page=357 #7132.

[Dengler Avenue]

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...90293&page=358 #7141
Question: What will it take for the federal government to commit funding for TCH twinning, instead of just sprinkling money every now and then? TCH Act was rescinded almost a decade ago.