Most middle income areas are in the Midwest

[Docere]

No surprises here. The Midwest has the most middle income areas, the most high income are the usual suspects (Bay Area, DC, Fairfield County), and the most low income are mostly heavily Hispanic areas in the Southwest.

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank...come-families/

[Capsicum]

So, contrary to the stereotype of the loss of middle-class jobs in the "Rust Belt", the "Rust Belt" or population-losing Midwest as a region is actually quite middle class compared to the others (though I see Bloomington IN there in the low-income list)?

[Capsicum]

How much of the Midwestern middle class character comes from both the poorest leaving and the richest leaving?

[Docere]

Rust Belt Trump supporters are more middle than lower income.

[Capsicum]

Why is the SW more low-income than the Southeast/Deep South or even Appalachia (which isn't shown on the map/listed)?

Are the heavily Hispanic areas really that much poorer than the lower-income areas in the South that are heavily black/white?

[Docere]

Most of these Southwestern metros are overwhelmingly Hispanic, in some cases over 90%.

[skyscraperpage17]

Originally Posted by Capsicum

So, contrary to the stereotype of the loss of middle-class jobs in the "Rust Belt", the "Rust Belt" or population-losing Midwest as a region is actually quite middle class compared to the others (though I see Bloomington IN there in the low-income list)?

Originally Posted by Capsicum

How much of the Midwestern middle class character comes from both the poorest leaving and the richest leaving?

Originally Posted by Docere

Rust Belt Trump supporters are more middle than lower income.

Originally Posted by Capsicum

Why is the SW more low-income than the Southeast/Deep South or even Appalachia (which isn't shown on the map/listed)?

Are the heavily Hispanic areas really that much poorer than the lower-income areas in the South that are heavily black/white?

Who are you talking to?

[Sun Belt]

Originally Posted by Docere

Most of these Southwestern metros are overwhelmingly Hispanic, in some cases over 90%.

Yes and not only that, most of the "southwestern metros" are agricultural cities. Cities that focus on agriculture need laborers from Mexico/Central America.

Originally Posted by Pew article

The metropolitan areas with the largest shares of lower-income adults are located primarily in the Southwest, with several on the southern border, such as McAllen-Edinburg-Mission, TX, and include farming communities in central California, such as Fresno, CA. In Laredo, TX, about half of adults (49%) lived in lower-income households in 2016, the highest share in the country.

[Capsicum]

I guess I was expecting the really poor places to be like Mississippi, Arkansas, West Virginia which are lowest state-wise by household income, but then city-wide poverty isn't the same as state-wide (eg. California, Texas all have higher income areas and probably huge inequality).

I thought the rural south and Appalachia would still have a place in the top ten but maybe because those areas are where the poverty is more small town they'd not have a metro area represented.

Also, I didn't realize the poorest places tended to be Hispanic (I suppose Native American reservations also rank among the poorest but are not cities). Last time I checked, average household income for Hispanic and African American were pretty close (but there are places in the New South where African Americans are doing well and middle class). There are also poor white areas in Appalachia (like West Virginia which is 90+% white, but has been close to being the poorest state the past few years).

[Omaharocks]

There's something off with some of their numbers.

Bloomington, IN is not anywhere close to being one of the poorest cities in Indiana, let alone in the country.

And Las Cruces, NM? Same story. It's a mix of college students and middle-class retirees.

Maybe the large % of college students are skewing the numbers in those areas? Whatever the case, it isn't representative of the reality on the ground.

[BrownTown]

Originally Posted by Omaharocks

And Las Cruces, NM? Same story. It's a mix of college students and middle-class retirees.

So it's a mix of two groups that don't have jobs and you're surprised the incomes are low? Seems kind of obvious.

[10023]

Can we please stop conflating “middle class” and “middle income”? Especially when middle income is defined as the median income, which is definitely working class (semi-skilled labor, clerical jobs requiring low levels of educational attainment, etc).

[Docere]

Originally Posted by 10023

Can we please stop conflating “middle class” and “middle income”? Especially when middle income is defined as the median income, which is definitely working class (semi-skilled labor, clerical jobs requiring low levels of educational attainment, etc).

I agree.

[COtoOC]

Originally Posted by 10023

Can we please stop conflating “middle class” and “middle income”? Especially when middle income is defined as the median income, which is definitely working class (semi-skilled labor, clerical jobs requiring low levels of educational attainment, etc).

Yeah, according the their calculator, my household (2 kids, 2 parents w/college education and 6 figure incomes) is "upper class". But I feel like we live a "middle class" lifestyle. 2500 sq. ft. home, 2 cars (one is 11 years old and paid off), maxed out 401Ks, dumping as much as we can into college savings, and one decent vacay per year. We eat out once a week, max, and have to watch what we spend. So definitely not living the "upper class" lifestyle. We live in Denver, which is much more expensive (at least for housing) than most Midwestern cities.

[Docere]

Originally Posted by COtoOC

Yeah, according the their calculator, my household (2 kids, 2 parents w/college education and 6 figure incomes) is "upper class". But I feel like we live a "middle class" lifestyle. 2500 sq. ft. home, 2 cars (one is 11 years old and paid off), maxed out 401Ks, dumping as much as we can into college savings, and one decent vacay per year. We eat out once a week, max, and have to watch what we spend. So definitely not living the "upper class" lifestyle. We live in Denver, which is much more expensive (at least for housing) than most Midwestern cities.

The problem is that almost everybody in America thinks they are "middle class" - from the retail clerk to the neurosurgeon.

[JManc]

Originally Posted by COtoOC

Yeah, according the their calculator, my household (2 kids, 2 parents w/college education and 6 figure incomes) is "upper class". But I feel like we live a "middle class" lifestyle. 2500 sq. ft. home, 2 cars (one is 11 years old and paid off), maxed out 401Ks, dumping as much as we can into college savings, and one decent vacay per year. We eat out once a week, max, and have to watch what we spend. So definitely not living the "upper class" lifestyle. We live in Denver, which is much more expensive (at least for housing) than most Midwestern cities.

Upper income tier, not upper class. If you can max out 401k's, save for college and still live a comfortable life, you're doing better than most.

[10023]

Originally Posted by Docere

The problem is that almost everybody in America thinks they are "middle class" - from the retail clerk to the neurosurgeon.

Right. In political contexts there is a highly aspirational definition based on what how people want to consider themselves. But “working class” shouldn’t be considered derogatory. In broad strokes you need at least 4 tiers - the poor, the working class, the middle class and then the wealthy. The last are really capitalists; the second to last may have disposable income but are still working stiffs. The term arose to describe people like bankers and lawyers and shopkeepers who had some money but were not aristocrats.

[Docere]

If the choices are "poor", "middle" and "rich" then almost everyone ends up "in between."

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by 10023

In broad strokes you need at least 4 tiers - the poor, the working class, the middle class and then the wealthy.

in that case, the "middle class" needs to be renamed with some other term.

most people making roughly a median (or middle) income are going to self-identify with the class stratus with "middle" in the name.

if the middle class isn't in the middle as you purport, then it has a terribly confusing name.

[urbanlife]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

in that case, the "middle class" needs to be renamed with some other term.

most people making roughly a median (or middle) income are going to self-identify with the class stratus with "middle" in the name.

if the middle class isn't in the middle as you purport, then it has a terribly confusing name.

Upper middle class and lower middle class?