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  #7061  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2016, 1:44 AM
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Yup. I just did a report on Mary Peters and TxDOT's financial disaster for SH-130. Only one-third of projected traffic. People just won't pay tolls. Public-private partnerships died off during the 2008 recession. Other states have lost interest. Texas is building fewer traditional toll roads and considering eliminating tolls and raising taxes instead. South Carolina cancelled a public-private partnership route after the Texas disaster.

THANKFULLY, I sleep at night knowing infrastructure is state owned and not federally owned. Trump can't sell I-15 (Utah). Trump can't sell Frontrunner (UTA). Trump can't sell Salt Lake International (city).

Trump could cut federal funding. But I-15 CORE demonstrated that the people of Utah and the legislature and committed to funding quality transportation even if we have to pay for it ourselves as a state.
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  #7062  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2016, 3:58 AM
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Originally Posted by i-215 View Post


Yup. I just did a report on Mary Peters and TxDOT's financial disaster for SH-130. Only one-third of projected traffic. People just won't pay tolls. Public-private partnerships died off during the 2008 recession. Other states have lost interest. Texas is building fewer traditional toll roads and considering eliminating tolls and raising taxes instead. South Carolina cancelled a public-private partnership route after the Texas disaster.
The one time I had the opportunity to drive SH 130, I said screw the toll and just drove on the frontage roads. 65 MPH on the frontage and free.
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  #7063  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2016, 9:07 AM
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Trump’s big infrastructure plan? It’s a trap.
By Ronald A. Klain
Opinion
Washington Post
November 18

"First, Trump’s plan is not really an infrastructure plan. It’s a tax-cut plan for utility-industry and construction-sector investors, and a massive corporate welfare plan for contractors. The Trump plan doesn’t directly fund new roads, bridges, water systems or airports, as did Hillary Clinton’s 2016 infrastructure proposal. Instead, Trump’s plan provides tax breaks to private-sector investors who back profitable construction projects. These projects (such as electrical grid modernization or energy pipeline expansion) might already be planned or even underway. There’s no requirement that the tax breaks be used for incremental or otherwise expanded construction efforts; they could all go just to fatten the pockets of investors in previously planned projects....

Second, as a result of the above, Trump’s plan isn’t really a jobs plan, either. Because the plan subsidizes investors, not projects; because it funds tax breaks, not bridges; because there’s no requirement that the projects be otherwise unfunded, there is simply no guarantee that the plan will produce any net new hiring. Investors may simply shift capital from unsubsidized projects to subsidized ones and pocket the tax breaks on projects they would have funded anyway. Contractors have no obligation to hire new workers, or expand workers’ hours, to collect their $85 billion. To their credit, the plan’s authors don’t call it a jobs plan; ironically, it is Democrats looking to align with Trump who have given it that name. They should not fool themselves."

Source: wapo.com
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  #7064  
Old Posted Nov 22, 2016, 5:36 AM
Liberty Wellsian Liberty Wellsian is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stenar View Post
Trump’s big infrastructure plan? It’s a trap.
By Ronald A. Klain
Opinion
Washington Post
November 18

"First, Trump’s plan is not really an infrastructure plan. It’s a tax-cut plan for utility-industry and construction-sector investors, and a massive corporate welfare plan for contractors. The Trump plan doesn’t directly fund new roads, bridges, water systems or airports, as did Hillary Clinton’s 2016 infrastructure proposal. Instead, Trump’s plan provides tax breaks to private-sector investors who back profitable construction projects. These projects (such as electrical grid modernization or energy pipeline expansion) might already be planned or even underway. There’s no requirement that the tax breaks be used for incremental or otherwise expanded construction efforts; they could all go just to fatten the pockets of investors in previously planned projects....

Second, as a result of the above, Trump’s plan isn’t really a jobs plan, either. Because the plan subsidizes investors, not projects; because it funds tax breaks, not bridges; because there’s no requirement that the projects be otherwise unfunded, there is simply no guarantee that the plan will produce any net new hiring. Investors may simply shift capital from unsubsidized projects to subsidized ones and pocket the tax breaks on projects they would have funded anyway. Contractors have no obligation to hire new workers, or expand workers’ hours, to collect their $85 billion. To their credit, the plan’s authors don’t call it a jobs plan; ironically, it is Democrats looking to align with Trump who have given it that name. They should not fool themselves."

Source: wapo.com
Part of me wants federal infrastructure spending to fall hard. It seems to me that infrastructure spending has been code for subsidizing sprawling development for quite some time. I honestly wonder if our cities wouldn't be better off with much less federal infrastructure spending. Aren't we just taking jobs away from high rise construction and re-purposing them to build highways? Aren't we taking funds out of developed urban areas and reinvesting those funds in suburban meh?




Video Link

Last edited by Liberty Wellsian; Nov 22, 2016 at 6:28 AM.
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  #7065  
Old Posted Nov 23, 2016, 8:10 PM
ImaJem ImaJem is offline
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UDOT is having a scoping open house for adding an extra lane between SR201 and 123rd south next wednesday if anyone is interested in commenting. I'm concerned what affect this could have on the posibility (if it ever happens!) of a second track for FrontRunner. I'd much rather see UDOT help UTA push this forward. The other items in the project could help ease congestion near 72nd, but I worry it would only be temporary (or irrelevant once autonomous cars rule the world)
Quote:
UDOT is holding a Scoping Open House where residents, business and property owners, and motorists can provide feedback on the current project concept.

When:
Wed., Nov. 30, 2016
5-7 p.m.
Where:
Midvale Senior Center
7550 South Main Street
Midvale, UT 84047
More detail here:
https://www.udot.utah.gov/projectpages/f?p=250:2007:0:SUB:NO:RP,20072007_EPM_PROJ_XREF_NO,P2007_EPM_MASTER_PROJ_XREF_NO,P2007_PROJECT_TYPE_IND_FLAG:10071,10071,s

I must say I enjoyed that video, (although it put me into a rage for twenty minutes!) I am happy that states are realizing their mistakes and are putting more emphasis on transit, biking and walking, but there still is bias towards cars in our cities and states.
I looked back at the TIGER grant projects list and I felt a little better:
https://www.rideuta.com/-/media/File...426.ashx?la=en

[added]
While I'd love to see big rail projects, for now it's the little things that are making me happy (TIGER, strip maps, clearer communication to public, etc.)

Last edited by ImaJem; Nov 23, 2016 at 8:22 PM.
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  #7066  
Old Posted Nov 24, 2016, 12:05 AM
Liberty Wellsian Liberty Wellsian is offline
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  #7067  
Old Posted Nov 24, 2016, 1:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Liberty Wellsian View Post
I did it. I watched the whole thing. haha
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  #7068  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2016, 7:25 PM
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This is interesting, at least to me:
UTA to offer 10-minute Blue Line service for Christmas shoppers
Link:http://www.deseretnews.com/article/8...rs.html?pg=all

It is, unfortunately, only on Saturdays, after 4PM.

I've always wondered why UTA doesn't have a 4th 'change day' and schedule change just for the holiday season. I know a lot of people whose only experience with UTA is the annual train ride to Temple Square and downtown during December. It's UTA's prime time, and trains are regularly packed.
Have a new schedule begin on Black Friday and end New Year's Eve. Have it be the regular schedule for TRAX and FrontRunner, plus a heavily expanded evening schedule. Have FrontRunner run every half hour until 11:00 PM. Get at least the Blue Line, if not all of them, running the 10 minute schedule from the evening commute to midnight. Publish the schedule in a fun pamphlet that includes more information about riding UTA than regular schedules do, so that people will have something to take home and help them/remind them to take transit during the rest of the year.
Basically, just put on a good show while you're in the limelight. I've heard too many sad stories of people who have traveled into SLC on FrontRunner just fine to see the lights, but then get to the station on their way home to find that they just missed a train by 10 minutes, and because it is the last train of the night, which comes 90 minutes after the previous one, they have to wait an hour and 20 minutes on the cold concrete platform with their tired and hungry little kids - and then that last train was standing-room only because so many other people did the same thing...

This is one of those 'low hanging fruits,' where the return on investment is huge. Running more trains isn't that expensive, and the public support UTA can gain by demonstrating competency, efficiency, convenience, and style during the holidays can make the difference between ballot measures passing or failing.
So this is a good step, but I want MORE!
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  #7069  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2016, 8:31 PM
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Man just think. One day the major lines (Blue, Red, Green) will always run every 10 minutes and just the secondary lines (S, Black, Trolly) will be 20 minute intervals. Now that would be such a convenient system.
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  #7070  
Old Posted Nov 29, 2016, 9:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThePusherMan View Post
Man just think. One day the major lines (Blue, Red, Green) will always run every 10 minutes and just the secondary lines (S, Black, Trolly) will be 20 minute intervals. Now that would be such a convenient system.
So at that frequency Central Pointe, Ballpark, future 7th S and Courthouse would have a train every 3 1/2 minutes? Gallivan to Arena would have one every 5 minutes and every 3 1/2 minutes every other 10? I like it.

What about the frequency on the Orange line running west from Ballpark to the Granary and Central Station, the downtown Streetcar and the downtown loop?
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  #7071  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2016, 6:45 PM
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I umm... forwarded this to UTA (via Twitter) if you don't mind!
I think I might be beginning to push my luck with all of my ideas I've sent to them (Not really, they've been very gracious so far, I think my ideas might be a breath of fresh air compared to "@rideuta sucks I'm never riding your trains EVER AGAIN!" or something similar.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hatman View Post
This is interesting, at least to me:
UTA to offer 10-minute Blue Line service for Christmas shoppers
Link:http://www.deseretnews.com/article/8...rs.html?pg=all

It is, unfortunately, only on Saturdays, after 4PM.

I've always wondered why UTA doesn't have a 4th 'change day' and schedule change just for the holiday season. I know a lot of people whose only experience with UTA is the annual train ride to Temple Square and downtown during December. It's UTA's prime time, and trains are regularly packed.
Have a new schedule begin on Black Friday and end New Year's Eve. Have it be the regular schedule for TRAX and FrontRunner, plus a heavily expanded evening schedule. Have FrontRunner run every half hour until 11:00 PM. Get at least the Blue Line, if not all of them, running the 10 minute schedule from the evening commute to midnight. Publish the schedule in a fun pamphlet that includes more information about riding UTA than regular schedules do, so that people will have something to take home and help them/remind them to take transit during the rest of the year.
Basically, just put on a good show while you're in the limelight. I've heard too many sad stories of people who have traveled into SLC on FrontRunner just fine to see the lights, but then get to the station on their way home to find that they just missed a train by 10 minutes, and because it is the last train of the night, which comes 90 minutes after the previous one, they have to wait an hour and 20 minutes on the cold concrete platform with their tired and hungry little kids - and then that last train was standing-room only because so many other people did the same thing...

This is one of those 'low hanging fruits,' where the return on investment is huge. Running more trains isn't that expensive, and the public support UTA can gain by demonstrating competency, efficiency, convenience, and style during the holidays can make the difference between ballot measures passing or failing.
So this is a good step, but I want MORE!
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  #7072  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2016, 9:12 PM
ImaJem ImaJem is offline
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I got a DM from UTA (not sure who from UTA.)
Quote:
Interesting idea. We're often running all available TRAX trains this time of year, especially on evenings when we have multiple events. I'm not sure how much more we could ramp up TRAX service. Thirty-minute FrontRunner service is intriguing - but despite what the article claims, very expensive. Holiday ridership on our hourly evening service would need to increase to the point where we thought we'd see a return on a 30-minute service investment. I'd like to know from a rider perspective how much service frequency really impacts the decision to take the train downtown. Is 10-minute service really that much more appealing than 15-minute service? Feel free to chime in with your personal thoughts - I'd love to hear them.
I wrote this back:
Thanks, I’m mostly just trying to pass it along!
I figured extra FrontRunner service would be more expensive, but he does have a valid point that limited frontrunner service after the evening commuter time has a negative effect on these “seasonal” riders. I haven’t seen what he’s describing because I’ve always been in commuter times or just before the evening commute at around 3:30pm. Currently I don’t ride FrontRunner because I’m not in school anymore. Perhaps 30min could be on Fridays and Saturdays after the evening commute during this black friday-New year’s time.
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  #7073  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2016, 9:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImaJem View Post
I got a DM from UTA (not sure who from UTA.)


I wrote this back:
Thanks, I’m mostly just trying to pass it along!
I figured extra FrontRunner service would be more expensive, but he does have a valid point that limited frontrunner service after the evening commuter time has a negative effect on these “seasonal” riders. I haven’t seen what he’s describing because I’ve always been in commuter times or just before the evening commute at around 3:30pm. Currently I don’t ride FrontRunner because I’m not in school anymore. Perhaps 30min could be on Fridays and Saturdays after the evening commute during this black friday-New year’s time.

I think the FrontRunner service times is spot on. As stated, barely missing the train and having to wait 59 minutes in the cold for the next one could deter a lot of people from riding the train. As suggested the 30 minute intervals would do wonders for that, or they could install semi protected slightly heated shelters instead. These would turn off during non operating hours, as to not encourage overnight sleeping.

As for the 10 minute intervals, while that would be nice but I don't see that as as big of a deterrent as FrontRunner. Don't get me wrong the increase in frequency would be nice but having to wait 15 minutes isn't horrible.
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  #7074  
Old Posted Dec 1, 2016, 12:06 AM
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ThePusherMan ThePusherMan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImaJem View Post
I got a DM from UTA (not sure who from UTA.)


I wrote this back:
Thanks, I’m mostly just trying to pass it along!
I figured extra FrontRunner service would be more expensive, but he does have a valid point that limited frontrunner service after the evening commuter time has a negative effect on these “seasonal” riders. I haven’t seen what he’s describing because I’ve always been in commuter times or just before the evening commute at around 3:30pm. Currently I don’t ride FrontRunner because I’m not in school anymore. Perhaps 30min could be on Fridays and Saturdays after the evening commute during this black friday-New year’s time.
For a short time I was living in Layton and commuting to SLC and working at a restaurant. I can personally attest to how miserable it is to wait for an hour in the cold for a frontrunner train to come. Multiple times I would watch the Frontrunner leave the station as my train was pulling in. I think they have worked to fix some of these timing issues but having a full hour to sit and hate UTA is a long amount of time. Is 10 minutes that much better than 15, maybe not. But 30 minutes is absolutely much better than 60. That being said I think 10 minute intervals is a great goal to work towards for the trains. Most times you miss a train by a couple of minutes meaning when you walk onto the platform and see the next arrival time you will always see something in the single digits if we are running trains every ten rather than fifteen. I think that psychologically 11 minute wait seems much longer than an 8 or even 9 minute wait. Double digits just make your heart sink. Or at least it does for me.
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  #7075  
Old Posted Dec 1, 2016, 1:00 AM
ImaJem ImaJem is offline
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okay, she/he sent this back:
Quote:
It is worth considering. As a parent, I know that I'm less likely to take my child out on the train if we have a long wait for our connection home. I appreciate you passing the article along and will file it for consideration for the 2017 holiday season. Now we just need to get you back on FrontRunner !
Well I sure hope they do it!
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Last edited by ImaJem; Dec 1, 2016 at 4:55 PM.
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  #7076  
Old Posted Dec 1, 2016, 3:05 AM
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Thanks, ImaJem, for passing my posts along! I guess I've become far too comfortable in my role of "internet commenter screaming into the empty void", because it rarely occurs to me to actually do something about the ideas I have.

It's pretty cool that UTA has real people responding to people's concerns, even though I highly doubt those people have much influence on the changes we want actually happening.
I agree with the official response that FrontRunner trains are not cheap to run outright. But I will still argue that in terms of PR and public outreach, they are cheap. If UTA were to consider this extra service as 'public good-will making' rather than the strict commuters-per-dollar algorithms they usually use, I think they'd come to the same conclusions.

Great, now I've already got my hopes up for next year!
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  #7077  
Old Posted Dec 1, 2016, 3:05 PM
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You make a good point Hatman about UTA counting part of it as a PR expense. It could eventually be spun into trying to another ballot initiative, "Remember those 30 minute intervals during the 2017 holiday season? This ever so small tax increase or extension of an expiring one will allow UTA to convert it's entire Front Runner system into a double track system and afford to always run 30 minute trains, day and night. blah blah blah,l etc etc etc."

Jazz games could be the same way, and those run all winter not just during the season. Those are even harder to time because you never know exactly what time the games will be over. Again having to wait at a freezing platform 59 minutes because you didn't want to leave the game before it ended could really suck.

Maybe UTA needs to partner with the Jazz and Vivint Smart Home Arena in General and have a minor surcharge on each ticket sold that allows people attending events to ride UTA for free. Considering less than half will still ride I would expect that UTA will be ahead. I go to a few games every year and ride trax, but I'm in the free fare zone so I don't need to pay, but if $1-2 of every ticket went to UTA that wouldn't change my Jazz habits. It obviously made fiscal sense when they did that for Utah Football tickets, so why wouldn't the same thing make sense for Vivint, and maybe even Maverik Center and the RioT.
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  #7078  
Old Posted Dec 1, 2016, 8:05 PM
ImaJem ImaJem is offline
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Hey! there's an online public comment survey for the southbound i-15 added lane.
go here, say what you want/don't want:
https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/i15slcountyscoping

I also sent Hatman's and Future Mayor's additional comments over to UTA Social.
Response:
Quote:
Thanks. We are certainly going to pass the feedback along regarding 30-minute service. Regarding more frequent and/or free service to Vivint - the partnership with the U is very generously sponsored by the university. We've been in talks with other local sports teams regarding similar deals, but haven't been able to reach a consensus yet. Fingers crossed for the future.
[edit: I commented!]
[edit 2: Rats! I forgot to copy it... at least it sent!]
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Last edited by ImaJem; Dec 1, 2016 at 9:24 PM.
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  #7079  
Old Posted Dec 2, 2016, 9:19 PM
Liberty Wellsian Liberty Wellsian is offline
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What about a relief/night bus? UTA could supplement the Frontrunner with a "Frontbus". It could begin service to Frontrunner stations when the train transitions to hourly service running in the interval. It could continue to run around once an hour(It's going take a bit longer than the train between stations) all night long. Maybe this is an affordable way to decrease wait times and provide 24 hour service along the line.
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  #7080  
Old Posted Dec 10, 2016, 2:15 AM
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