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  #2081  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 12:54 AM
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Only 0.4 cents? It is 0.6-something in Ontario. It was 0.81. A company in Thunder Bay just held an open house today, they want to build 5 solar farms in the city. We already have 3.
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  #2082  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 1:34 AM
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Ah. Sorry riverman.

Hydro pays a flat rate of something like $70/MWh for wind power and sells it for around $40.....and the worst is they pay it even if they are spilling water.

I have no idea why the Tories didn't make a big deal about this instead of which side of the lake the stupid lines run down. Nobody cares about that.
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  #2083  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 2:27 AM
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Originally Posted by trueviking View Post
I have no idea why the Tories didn't make a big deal about this instead of which side of the lake the stupid lines run down. Nobody cares about that.
Lots of people care about where the lines go, just not city people. Do you realize it will take the entire production of one of the northern dams to make up for the power losses of the longer route? It seems nobody cares about that.

ALL "green" power is like this, it can't exist without massive subsidies. Same with ethanol production. Truly there is nothing green about any of it. Thank goodness we have a federal government that recognizes this.
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  #2084  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 3:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Riverman View Post
ALL "green" power is like this, it can't exist without massive subsidies. Same with ethanol production. Truly there is nothing green about any of it. Thank goodness we have a federal government that recognizes this.
Wouldn't hydro be considered "green" power too?

But I'm not sure why green idustry is singled out for subsidies. Interestingly enough, the oil and gas industry receives more in subsidies than any wind or solar farms. Much of that is directly from the federal government as well...
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  #2085  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 3:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Riverman View Post
ALL "green" power is like this, it can't exist without massive subsidies. Same with ethanol production. Truly there is nothing green about any of it. Thank goodness we have a federal government that recognizes this.
yeah cutting green energy funding and replacing it with more investment in antiquated energy sources is visionary leadership....the rest of the world seems to make green energy work.

the conservatives are huge supporters of ethanol....and pretty much any other half-assed environmental strategy that keeps the money flowing into alberta.....'clean' coal technology, oil sands carbon capture technologies....ethanol...all lipstick on a very dirty pig.


Canada Keeps Ethanol Subsidies
The Conservative Government has been a strong supporter of the use of biofuels, particularly Ethanol, which is produced from corn. In the 2007 budget the Conservatives introduced a $2 billion subsidy for biofuels, most of which went to the ethanol industry. The Conservatives also amended the Canadian Environmental Protection Act to require refiners to add 5% ethanol to their gasoline.
http://forourgrandchildren.ca/?p=952


Ethanol subsidies won by corporate lobbyists
http://www.harperindex.ca/ViewArticle.cfm?Ref=00151


and lookey here, they even support wind farms...i wonder how oil is connected to it.

Harper Government Funds Nova Scotia Clean-Energy Wind Farm
http://www.techvibes.com/blog/harper...arm-2011-03-02

Last edited by trueviking; Dec 14, 2011 at 4:56 AM.
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  #2086  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 3:27 AM
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But I'm not sure why green idustry is singled out for subsidies. Interestingly enough, the oil and gas industry receives more in subsidies than any wind or solar farms. Much of that is directly from the federal government as well...
good point
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  #2087  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 3:29 AM
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The oil and gas industries pay enormous royalties to the government which more than makes up for the investments the government makes in them. Wind, solar etc. just continue to cost with no chance of return for the subsidies they receive.
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  #2088  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 3:33 AM
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Originally Posted by trueviking View Post
Canada Keeps Ethanol Subsidies
The Conservative Government has been a strong supporter of the use of biofuels, particularly Ethanol, which is produced from corn. In the 2007 budget the Conservatives introduced a $2 billion subsidy for biofuels, most of which went to the ethanol industry. The Conservatives also amended the Canadian Environmental Protection Act to require refiners to add 5% ethanol to their gasoline.
http://forourgrandchildren.ca/?p=952
Most likely due to the minority position they were in, however this was never implemented. Fuel is still available everywhere without ethanol.
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  #2089  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 3:36 AM
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....the rest of the world seems to make green energy work.
Please provide an example of a profitable wind or solar operation.
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  #2090  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 3:44 AM
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Please provide an example of a profitable wind or solar operation.
The Sahara would make EXCELLENT profits and job opporitunities for Africa, and power for Europe
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  #2091  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 4:00 AM
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I'm very interested in alternative energy and believe we should be working on it, but presently it does, as TV said, exist only for political optics.

My student's latest project - 80 horsepower electric sportbike.



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  #2092  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 4:26 AM
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Please provide an example of a profitable wind or solar operation.
In countries where conventional power is sold for more than 40c kWh.
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  #2093  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 4:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Riverman View Post
I'm very interested in alternative energy and believe we should be working on it, but presently it does, as TV said, exist only for political optics.

My student's latest project - 80 horsepower electric sportbike.
http://www.wired.com/autopia/2011/12/brd-redshift-sm/
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  #2094  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 4:56 AM
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The oil and gas industries pay enormous royalties to the government which more than makes up for the investments the government makes in them. Wind, solar etc. just continue to cost with no chance of return for the subsidies they receive.
i bet the hitchin' post industry was pretty lucrative in 1880...wouldnt have have been so smart for the government to pour money into hitchin' post research though.
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  #2095  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 5:00 AM
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Most likely due to the minority position they were in, however this was never implemented. Fuel is still available everywhere without ethanol.
the harper government has not backed off one bit in its support for ethanol....its political environmentalism that appeases both the farm and oil lobby...win win for the cons.

oil royalties are great for now, but that ship will beach itself one day and the countries that moved the world forward will be the winners, not the ones who milked industrial revolution energy sources for as long as they could.
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  #2096  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 5:35 AM
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80 HP? damn that thing looks cool.
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  #2097  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 2:32 PM
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Originally Posted by trueviking View Post

I have no idea why the Tories didn't make a big deal about this instead of which side of the lake the stupid lines run down. Nobody cares about that.
Plenty of people care about which side, probably one of the Province's hottest public debate topics since it was anounced. Oh and Hugh didn't make a big deal about anything, not for a lack of issues, imo that was his downfall.
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  #2098  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 2:37 PM
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Originally Posted by trueviking View Post
oil royalties are great for now, but that ship will beach itself one day and the countries that moved the world forward will be the winners, not the ones who milked industrial revolution energy sources for as long as they could.
That's funny. Do you think oil is only used for turning on lights? Every single industry on the earth is completely dependent on oil. Every tool you touch or use, everything you eat, every building material is all made with oil. Not to mention how all those goods got to you. Electric transport trucks? Electric airliners?

Hitching post my ass. Oil is needed for everything and to not develop our resources would be idiotic.
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  #2099  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 2:40 PM
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80 HP? damn that thing looks cool.
It is cool! Only one motor is hooked up and it lights the tire instantly, the amount of torque it has is indescribable. I can't wait to ride it in the spring.
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  #2100  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2011, 3:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Riverman View Post
That's funny. Do you think oil is only used for turning on lights? Every single industry on the earth is completely dependent on oil. Every tool you touch or use, everything you eat, every building material is all made with oil. Not to mention how all those goods got to you. Electric transport trucks? Electric airliners?

Hitching post my ass. Oil is needed for everything and to not develop our resources would be idiotic.
But wouldn't it make sense to find some alternatives before they've all run out or been effected by some sort of event? Someone's gotta spend some extra money to get these alternatives going. You can argue whose job that is, whether governments, businesses or individuals, but wouldn't it be nice to be able to utilize multiple sources for resources, now or in the future?
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