DENVER | Cherry Creek Development Thread

[wong21fr]

Originally Posted by EngiNerd

100% agree with everything you just said, a direct fixed rail transit line to CC just makes too much sense.

But in the meantime I think that the City should totally get behind the efforts to "brand" the bus service between Downtown and Cherry Creek:

http://www.transolutions.org/wp-cont...ity-Study1.pdf

For an additional $1M/yr in operational costs and $5M (my guess) in capital costs you get frequent (7.5 minute peak/15 min off-peak) service, easily identifiable stations, and other improvements that would serve to link these two nodes now rather than in 20 years.

[Brainpathology]

Originally Posted by wong21fr

But in the meantime I think that the City should totally get behind the efforts to "brand" the bus service between Downtown and Cherry Creek:

http://www.transolutions.org/wp-cont...ity-Study1.pdf

For an additional $1M/yr in operational costs and $5M (my guess) in capital costs you get frequent (7.5 minute peak/15 min off-peak) service, easily identifiable stations, and other improvements that would serve to link these two nodes now rather than in 20 years.

wow was my mind ahead of reality... I thought that was decided already. I thought rail was the next logical step left.

[The Dirt]

Originally Posted by EngiNerd

100% agree with everything you just said, a direct fixed rail transit line to CC just makes too much sense.

Or for starters, a branded bus route between CC and civic center station.

Edit: agreeing with wong. I'd rather have a nice bus now than rail in 25 years.

[EngiNerd]

Originally Posted by The Dirt

Or for starters, a branded bus route between CC and civic center station.

Edit: agreeing with wong. I'd rather have a nice bus now than rail in 25 years.

Agreed, anything that is specialty branded would be better than what they have now and could be done relatively inexpensive...though the thought of someone taking the bus to go shop at Tiffany just doesn't seem that likely. But would be great for convention goers and others that are downtown without a vehicle.

If Boulder has the Hop, Skip and Jump, let's call this one the Sneak!

[Cirrus]

Originally Posted by Brainpathology

In a couple generations I believe Cherry Creek will be part of downtown Denver for all intents and purposes. There is no reason Downtown can't connect itself to Cherry Creek and just consider it its shopping district.

Nah. The Country Club neighborhood is too wealthy. It'll remain low-to-moderate density residential and forever separate downtown from Cherry Creek. That doesn't mean Cherry Creek won't be a great urban uptown district on its own terms. It'll just always be a different place.

It'll be like downtown San Francisco and downtown Oakland. Both good downtowns, but separated by the bay. In Denver's case, the "bay" will be Country Club.

[Cirrus]

Originally Posted by EngiNerd

If Boulder has the Hop, Skip and Jump, let's call this one the Sneak!

I like the Boulder model, but Boulder is small and it's already bumping up against the upper limit of how many routes you can give unique names to without it become too hard to remember them all. Denver is too big, IMO, unless the special names were constrained to no more than 2-3 routes.

For a city Denver's size, better to use one special brand name for the whole overlay network of priority routes. Like LA's MetroRapid. The MetroRide brand from the downtown circulator is good, if its hours were extended so people could start thinking of it as general transit instead of just a commuter shuttle.

[Brainpathology]

Originally Posted by Cirrus

Nah. The Country Club neighborhood is too wealthy. It'll remain low-to-moderate density residential and forever separate downtown from Cherry Creek. That doesn't mean Cherry Creek won't be a great urban uptown district on its own terms. It'll just always be a different place.

It'll be like downtown San Francisco and downtown Oakland. Both good downtowns, but separated by the bay. In Denver's case, the "bay" will be Country Club.

ah yes the country club... I didn't think about that . it could go right up to it and then pick back up though.. it's not that big. Or, which will/would take much longer, extending downtown type development along both 6th and Alameda. Probably the same problem with well rooted wealthy residential which isn't something that needs to be changed or fixed. I wouldn't mind the country club separating two nodes of downtown though. It would almost make it look like the country club was our Central Park...but more era appropriate to both the Boulderization of Denver and the country at large because only the "right" people could play there.

[Scottk]

Boulder has the hop, skip, jump, dash & stampede... am I missing any here? I agree that it is near the upper limit of having too many named routes. However, it really helps the average joe who only uses transit maybe a few times a month.


Anyhow, I rode the metroride the other day for the first time. And it was basically empty. Does anyone know how ridership has been?

Also, I thought the new bus station was supposed to have improved exhaust vents? It smelled pretty bad when I was waiting to get onto the bus

[wong21fr]

Originally Posted by Scottk

Anyhow, I rode the metroride the other day for the first time. And it was basically empty. Does anyone know how ridership has been?

What time did you ride it at? While it only operates during peak hours, anything after 800A or before 400P is going to be a ghost town.

[PLANSIT]

Haven't seen numbers yet, but I've seen it both packed and completely empty depending on the time.

[Cirrus]

Originally Posted by Scottk

Boulder has the hop, skip, jump, dash & stampede... am I missing any here? I agree that it is near the upper limit of having too many named routes. However, it really helps the average joe who only uses transit maybe a few times a month.

There's the BOLT and the HOP2. There used to be a NIGHT HOP and a LEAP, although by the looks of it those have been discontinued.

Anyhow, I rode the metroride the other day for the first time. And it was basically empty. Does anyone know how ridership has been?

No idea but I expect it will remain mostly empty until the rest of the FasTracks lines open. It's really only there to handle spill-over capacity from the 16th Street shuttle, so until the mall shuttle fills up too much, MetroRide will be lightly used.

[seventwenty]

Honestly, many of these naming issues could be alleviated by just naming the bus route after the street.

The 0 is no longer the 0. It's the "Broadway Bus". The 40 is the "Colorado Ave Bus". The 15 is the "Colfax Bus". It'd make connections super easy. "Take the Broadway Bus to Colfax, and change to the Colfax Bus."

Maybe make some of the smaller routes more unique but still logical names. That ART bus in Englewood? The Englewood Bus. A bus to CC Mall? I like the name Cherry Creek Sneak.

[navyweaxguy]

So, if you want a dedicated rail line, or street car or bus going straight back and forth to CC from downtown then what is the motivation for retailers to even worry about building anything other than business/tourist centric retail?

[wong21fr]

Originally Posted by navyweaxguy

So, if you want a dedicated rail line, or street car or bus going straight back and forth to CC from downtown then what is the motivation for retailers to even worry about building anything other than business/tourist centric retail?

That ship sailed, though you could cater to the tens of thousands of residents who will live downtown.

Just a thought.

[navyweaxguy]

I'm sure that's the plan. Just makes a case for living in Cherry Creek where you can walk to everything.

[The Dirt]

It's one thing to be able to afford to live in downtown Denver, it's a whole other ballpark in Cherry Creek.

[navyweaxguy]

Not really. I just looked at two 2 bedroom condos for 370/322 sq ft. I saw a 1 bed in Spire for 450/sq ft. It's just in what you want. As CC continues to densify it's only going to get better. Which is good for that area, but really sucks for downtown.

http://www.denvercondomania.com/cond...ERRY-CREEK.php

[bunt_q]

Originally Posted by wong21fr

That ship sailed, though you could cater to the tens of thousands of residents who will live downtown.

Just a thought.

I think most retailers assume the thousands of downtown residents will just drive the whopping 4 miles to cherry creek. Much less likely that all of the central neighborhood residents would drive downtown. Cherry creek is clearly superior for most retailers.

For the downtown purists who refuse, it's a $6 car2go ride, under 20 minutes.

[navyweaxguy]

Just need to burn down the mall lol

[Cirrus]

Have to drive 4 miles to buy underwear. And people wonder why we have a lot of traffic.

It doesn't bother me that the Nordstroms and Anthropologies of the world, or whatever, locate in Cherry Creek instead of downtown. But for downtown to function as a neighborhood it needs its own service retail. That Target we've been pining for for the past decade-plus won't help much if it shows up in Cherry Creek or on Colorado Blvd.