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  #2621  
Old Posted Feb 6, 2016, 4:45 AM
CurtisVerbatim CurtisVerbatim is offline
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Originally Posted by aberdeen5698 View Post
Widening the Fraser Highway through Green Timbers in Surrey faces the same obstacle and opposition.

I think a cut and cover approach to bury the causeway through Stanley Park might make everyone happy.
Stanley park has much greater value than that patch of trees in Surrey. i'm all for widening Fraser highway but not for widening the causeway. Green Timbers isn't even technically a park. it's just a square mile of trees that would be a lot better if designated as a park.

And again, why would it make sense to force traffic destined for the north shore or beyond through the gridlock of Downtown? If given another option other than highway 1 most people would take it.
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  #2622  
Old Posted Feb 6, 2016, 4:41 PM
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aberdeen5698 aberdeen5698 is offline
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Originally Posted by CurtisVerbatim View Post
And again, why would it make sense to force traffic destined for the north shore or beyond through the gridlock of Downtown?
Because it's the cheapest option. So no, it doesn't make sense from a transport network point of view, but the lure of saving money is a strong one.
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  #2623  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2016, 1:44 AM
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Klazu Klazu is offline
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How aligned are North Shore municipalities on this problem and are they having much influence on provincial government? West Vancouver should be a wealthy municipality which should always help to prioritize a project.

I learned only this week that North Vancouver is actually not one city but two municipalities with the City and the District. How aligned are they on this problem?

Also, how much would a SeaBus route to Ambleside help the problem?
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  #2624  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2016, 5:52 AM
Pinion Pinion is offline
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No one seems to be talking about actual solutions - locals have somehow shifted the blame to condos rather than road/bridge/skytrain infrastructure, despite the fact that the north shore is already the most difficult place to get a condo approved.

Hwy 1 is federal so separate municipalities aren't an issue for Ironworkers. The bigger issue there is the fact that it goes through the reserve and therefore can't really be expanded or moved.

Lions Gate also goes through a reserve but expanding that was kiboshed by everyone in the 90s. If they had just made it six lanes then there'd be zero problems now.

In general DNV and CNV work together well, even West Van is on board in the case of gridlock because everyone knows how shitty it is. DNV is constantly talking about amalgamation but there's no benefit for the City so it won't happen. The District has a buttload of asbestos pipes to replace and the City won't even talk about it until after that's dealt with.

The main problem of course is Vancouver proper because they won't allow any more roads into their territory. Just like how Richmond is fighting the Massey bridge and New West is fighting a wider Pattullo. Except the north shore can't grow much bigger and people from Vancouver proper want to be able to go skiing/hiking/mountain biking too so you'd think there would be less resistance. But road expansion doesn't happen with Vision in power.

Today my wife and I cancelled plans to go downtown because Lions Gate traffic was too terrible. We sat in West Van/Marine traffic for 20 minutes then bailed when it didn't move at all. This is on the weekend at 6pm. I wouldn't be surprised if Lonsdale businesses are benefiting from the gridlock from people simply giving up on going anywhere off the north shore.

A seabus route to Ambleside would help a handful of babysitters/nannies/maids but the vast majority of West Vancouverites wouldn't demean themselves with peasant transportation. The eastern north shore's population is limited by mountains and reserve land so really this is all about central north shore.
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  #2625  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2016, 6:04 AM
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Thanks for the background on many issues, Pinion. Much appreciated in helping to understand the local politics a bit better.

Regarding West Vancouver, I lively remember seeing some Park+Ride signs along Highway 1 in West Vancouver heading east. What kind of bus connection that is (how frequent and where does it go) and how popular it is?
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  #2626  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2016, 6:53 AM
Pinion Pinion is offline
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Don't know much about them other than there are 3 on the north shore and they aren't that big except for the one out by eagle ridge. I might use the Park Royal one sometimes if I work downtown again (will be choosing a new site this week). Last time I worked downtown the extra long bus lanes to the bridge hadn't been built yet and they got stuck in traffic along with everyone else.
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  #2627  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2016, 7:30 AM
Infrequent Poster Infrequent Poster is offline
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Apologies for changing the subject but, does anyone know if there are any plans to resurface lougheed highway eastbound, in the area of government street?

Drove through there today and the road is such a bumpy uneven mess of patches and bulges, my coffee flew out of its holder (and all over my truck).

Been awhile since I drove that route. Don't remember it being like that before.
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  #2628  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2016, 11:12 PM
faston faston is offline
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Yes, it's terrible. They did major sewer replacement work in that section and just patched it up piecemeal as they went along. Perhaps now that it's done, they might re-pave the whole stretch.

There are still signs up saying speed limit of 40kph, so that lends some credence to the theory that they aren't done yet.
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  #2629  
Old Posted Feb 14, 2016, 5:22 AM
Pinion Pinion is offline
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Keith Road Lynn Creek bridge finally starting to look like a bridge

Keith Road Bridge, North Vancouver by chrisjohann, on Flickr
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  #2630  
Old Posted Feb 14, 2016, 5:27 AM
SOSS SOSS is offline
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The concrete deck is poured but the approaches still need work.
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  #2631  
Old Posted Feb 14, 2016, 5:48 AM
jollyburger jollyburger is offline
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It would be interesting to get more data to see how much ferry traffic impacts traffic flows on the North Shore. While West Vancouver doesn't want to see Horseshoe Bay's retail die, I wonder if the rest of the North Shore wants to deal with the traffic so they can sell fish and chips.

Speaking of fantasies, it might be fun to add another SeaBus and then create a dedicated HOV bus lane behind Park Royal via 1st Street over to Lonsdale or running parallel to the train tracks.
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  #2632  
Old Posted Feb 14, 2016, 8:26 AM
Pinion Pinion is offline
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Originally Posted by jollyburger View Post
It would be interesting to get more data to see how much ferry traffic impacts traffic flows on the North Shore. While West Vancouver doesn't want to see Horseshoe Bay's retail die, I wonder if the rest of the North Shore wants to deal with the traffic so they can sell fish and chips.

Speaking of fantasies, it might be fun to add another SeaBus and then create a dedicated HOV bus lane behind Park Royal via 1st Street over to Lonsdale or running parallel to the train tracks.
I was in Deep Cove today and the line at Honey's was out the door. That's on a day with pouring rain. If Horseshoe Bay could set up some good retail/restaurants it would be ok without the ferries.

As for a road behind Park Royal along the tracks to 1st, that's supposedly been the plan for about 10 years now. Only the northbound part through the village/Simons has been built. I use the existing zig zag route through the reserve more than Marine so I would welcome that.
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  #2633  
Old Posted Feb 14, 2016, 7:18 PM
SOSS SOSS is offline
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Is there a study or something that has Horseshoe Bay ferry terminal being decommissioned? Or is that a fantasy held by some?
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  #2634  
Old Posted Feb 14, 2016, 9:25 PM
Pinion Pinion is offline
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Is there a study or something that has Horseshoe Bay ferry terminal being decommissioned? Or is that a fantasy held by some?
Total closure is maybe fantasy but a considerable downsize eventually seems likely

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/britis...aimo-1.2823993

Quote:
A report by BC Ferries looking for efficiencies has raised questions about running ferry service between Horseshoe Bay and Nanaimo, suggesting that the route may become a passenger-only service or be re-routed entirely through Tsawwassen.

The report, which was submitted to the B.C. Ferries Commissioner at the end of September, outlines several options that could save the corporation money including consolidating the Horseshoe Bay-Nanaimo and Tsawwassen-Duke Point routes; consolidating just the Nanaimo and Duke Point terminals; using a passenger-only service for some trips; or shifting service to Vancouver Island from Horseshoe Bay to Tsawwassen, either in whole or in part.

The report argues that because of the significant capital costs involved in maintaining the Horseshoe Bay terminal infrastructure and the likely service interruption it would pose, it may make sense to have at least some of the Nanaimo-bound traffic use the Tsawwassen terminal.

BC Ferries is considering major changes to the routes between the Lower Mainland and Vancouver Island, according to a new report.

"It is contemplated that the Major Routes Strategy will challenge historically established notions of how BC Ferries' service is delivered to the mid-island corridor, and will require changes in customer behaviour," the report said.

Transportation Minister Todd Stone said trying to maintain routes and service levels as they are could result in a $200 million expense to maintain the Horseshoe Bay terminal over the next ten years.

"I can't envision a scenario where there would not be a ferry, passenger or vehicle service, from Nanaimo to Horseshoe Bay," he said. "But I think if we challenge the status quo of the type of vessel that goes in there, that could have the effect of reducing the capital upgrades that are required."

Stone said smaller ferries to Horseshoe Bay could be the answer, given that much of the traffic, and trucks in particular, now goes to Nanaimo via Tsawwassen because of the new South Fraser Perimeter Road.
Todd Stone backed down two days later after everyone freaked out but obviously it was in the plans.
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  #2635  
Old Posted Feb 16, 2016, 11:24 PM
Pinion Pinion is offline
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My new job is downtown and I actually chose graveyards because I'm so scared of commuting from the north shore now. At 11pm I can get there in 15 minutes like the old days.

Also being nocturnal/better pay helps.
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  #2636  
Old Posted Feb 17, 2016, 2:25 AM
cornholio cornholio is offline
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Originally Posted by Pinion View Post
Total closure is maybe fantasy but a considerable downsize eventually seems likely

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/britis...aimo-1.2823993



Todd Stone backed down two days later after everyone freaked out but obviously it was in the plans.
A fixed link to the Sunshine coast via Squamish / or higher up Howe sound would open up a ferry berth and take some pressure off the terminal. Its one of the reasons I am confident there will be a fixed link to the Sunshine coast via the Squamish area. Its likely one of the reasons it is being studied now, given that the whole Horseshoe bay issue has been studied by BC ferries internally for atleast a year now. A fixed link over land will probably be only in the 300 mill range. A good deal considering the situation.
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  #2637  
Old Posted Feb 17, 2016, 11:16 AM
BCPhil BCPhil is offline
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Don't take the studies on ferry operations to the island too seriously. The main objective of the reports is to act like a Sword of Damocles. Residents on the island complain a lot about the ferries, even though so few really need to use them all that frequently. Other than to watch the Canucks suck, there really isn't much you can't get done in Victoria or Nanaimo. But they still complain.

So these reports are just to remind everyone how good it is and how it could easily be much worse. "Oh yeah? you think it's bad now? How about we reduce sailings, move the terminals to places outside reasonable transit service, and add a half hour to sailing and driving time. See, the status quo ain't so bad, so STFU". At the same time, they also make the Government look like they care.

The Gabriola study just wrapped up and found a bridge would cost between $250-500 million, and the island is only a good golf shot away. They determined the cost outweighed the benefit by $113 million. But I bet they undershot the benefits by quite a bit, mainly because Gabriola is unincorporated. If it were part of the City of Nanaimo, a bridge would probably quadruple the population in a short time. I also think they are using assumptions of no tolls. So you could argue that the loss would be a lot less, and worth spending some money for the freedom and opportunity it gives residents (much like the Sunshine Coast).

But as it is, the province turned down a one time cash expenditure to unload a venture from BC ferries. So don't hold your breath on the Sunshine Coast.
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  #2638  
Old Posted Feb 25, 2016, 6:40 AM
SOSS SOSS is offline
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Went to Port Moody's open house on "TransPort Moody - Our Vision Forward" tonight. Very disappointed not to see the Clarke-Murray connector back on the city radar and in the OCP. The idea's in the information boards look at a new Mary Street overpass or expanded Moody Street overpass. Makes zero sense. Traffic is horrible because east-west traffic is forced to go north-south to weave through town. Build the Clarke-Murray connector and get that east-west traffic onto the Barnet. Port Moody's traffic issues are a regional problem and its as though they think PoMo is in an isolated bubble. I'm glad to see a push on sidewalks, bike paths and pedestrian/bike overpasses. But for cars... yikes. Maybe its time to work with regional partners like Coquitlam is working with Port Coquitlam for the Lincoln Bridge over Coquitlam River or the Freemont Connector. If only we had a regional government body that was involved in such issues.... oh wait. That's called Translink. Sorry for the rant guys but i'm just sick of seeing my cities traffic woes go from bad to worse and instead of talking longer term solutions they're talking band-aides. Seriously: new overpass at Mary Street or a wider Moody Street overpass. SMH.
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  #2639  
Old Posted Feb 25, 2016, 6:41 AM
SOSS SOSS is offline
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Oh, here is the link to the info boards and feedback forms; feel free to chime in.

http://www.portmoody.ca/index.aspx?page=1377
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  #2640  
Old Posted Feb 26, 2016, 3:26 PM
TransitJack TransitJack is offline
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The report mentions Stone saying he could see smaller ferries use HSB in the future. Ummm.... I think we tried that before and the Libs of the day were all over that not being a good idea.

Cough Cough, FastCats
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