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  #641  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 5:50 PM
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Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy View Post
Montreal might be in play for Manziel though.
Contrary to popular belief, I think Manziel would play bigger with the fans in Montreal and be more use there than Toronto.
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  #642  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 6:27 PM
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Disagree of Franklin. He was brought in to be the future starter for the Argos. The timeline for regular play was simply fast forwarded by a year due to Ray's injury. I think he can be a great QB, it will just take some time.

Montreal might be in play for Manziel though.
Fair enough, maybe I was being too hard on Franklin. But I still think that if Manziel is going anywhere, it's to the west. BC is the team with a glaring hole on the QB depth chart... 25grapes mentioned Sask but if Collaros can avoid injuries he'll be OK there.

But what if Hamilton decides to keep him another year to back up Masoli? They can certainly afford it for the money Manziel is making, but I suppose at that point having him opt to sit out the season becomes a possibility. I know I said Manziel can't be a prima donna, but the prospect of two years with only garbage time reps is not going to do much to encourage being a team player for someone at his level. Anyhow, that might be a factor that the Ticats have to weigh against keeping him as the backup for this season and next.
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  #643  
Old Posted Jul 10, 2018, 1:19 PM
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... 25grapes mentioned Sask but if Collaros can avoid injuries he'll be OK there.
I actually think I have more confidence with Jennings than I do Collaros due to Jennings athleticism. True Collaros has been injury prone but after his come back from the 2 previous head injuries there is something about his play in the slot that doesn't look quite right to me. Now you add another head injury to that and I could see his confidence in the slot to really take a nose dive.
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  #644  
Old Posted Jul 10, 2018, 1:47 PM
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^ We'll see how Collaros looks once he's back but watching Jennings you get that same feeling as when you try to light a campfire in a rainstorm... you try and try but after a while you start to know it just isn't going to happen. At least probably not in BC. On that note, I wonder if Jennings could use a change of scenery at this point in his career.
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  #645  
Old Posted Jul 10, 2018, 1:51 PM
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Originally Posted by roccerfeller View Post
If someone is interested in a franchise there, that’s an independent process from the health of franchises in the big cities
Sure its an independent process however I still believe the league needs to shore up its current major markets.

The league has the final decision. Balsilee was interested in an NHL franchise in Hamilton. Just because an owner is interested doesn't mean the league can't say no.

The league has to take into consideration the quality of play and the Canadian ratio. Teams are already stretched thin on Canadian content and would be even more stretched with a 10th team, never mind 11th.

The league has to get its house in order in major TV markets like Van, MTL and Toronto prior to focusing its limited resources on a Quebec City expansion. Trading Quebec City for Toronto or MTL would surely eat into the tv contract which is one of the biggest sources of league revenue.
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  #646  
Old Posted Jul 10, 2018, 2:56 PM
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The league has to take into consideration the quality of play and the Canadian ratio. Teams are already stretched thin on Canadian content and would be even more stretched with a 10th team, never mind 11th.
Some people said this would be an issue with Ottawa back in the league but it sure doesn't look that way to me. Canadian talent in the CFL is pretty solid... I realize the depth isn't endless but there is arguably room to add more without diminishing the level of play.

Assuming that you'd need at least another 25 or so Canadian players to stock a roster (including PR guys) I think you could probably depend on U-Sports to churn out 15 to 20 of them, with Canadian NCAA players and junior players accounting for the rest.

Beyond 10 I concede that it might be less of a sure thing...
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  #647  
Old Posted Jul 10, 2018, 6:24 PM
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Some people said this would be an issue with Ottawa back in the league but it sure doesn't look that way to me. Canadian talent in the CFL is pretty solid... I realize the depth isn't endless but there is arguably room to add more without diminishing the level of play.

Assuming that you'd need at least another 25 or so Canadian players to stock a roster (including PR guys) I think you could probably depend on U-Sports to churn out 15 to 20 of them, with Canadian NCAA players and junior players accounting for the rest.

Beyond 10 I concede that it might be less of a sure thing...
I agree that 10 would be doable but an 11th in quick succession may cause a drop in quality which is another reason why(in additional to big city problems) I'm hesitant to see QC come on board soon after a potential Halifax expansion.
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  #648  
Old Posted Jul 10, 2018, 10:55 PM
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I agree that 10 would be doable but an 11th in quick succession may cause a drop in quality which is another reason why(in additional to big city problems) I'm hesitant to see QC come on board soon after a potential Halifax expansion.
I don't think it is high on the radar in QC, they seemed more focused on getting the NHL and seem happy with Laval Rouge et Or for their football fix.
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  #649  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2018, 1:00 AM
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Originally Posted by king10 View Post
Sure its an independent process however I still believe the league needs to shore up its current major markets.

The league has the final decision. Balsilee was interested in an NHL franchise in Hamilton. Just because an owner is interested doesn't mean the league can't say no.

The league has to take into consideration the quality of play and the Canadian ratio. Teams are already stretched thin on Canadian content and would be even more stretched with a 10th team, never mind 11th.

The league has to get its house in order in major TV markets like Van, MTL and Toronto prior to focusing its limited resources on a Quebec City expansion. Trading Quebec City for Toronto or MTL would surely eat into the tv contract which is one of the biggest sources of league revenue.
I don't disagree that the health of the big city clubs is important, especially Toronto (one could argue Montreal is reasonably well supported when they do well, the club has been a mess and is a mess right now, BC I also feel has stronger support when they do well; The Argos right now are a tough sell whether they do well or not...they just won a Grey Cup and they have the poorest seat sales)

All I said is if Halifax ends up landing a franchise, I hope that rekindles the interest that at one point somewhat existed for a Quebec City team. It was nothing more than tire kicking at the time. If it does end up becoming something that is taken seriously, beyond the toe-tapping of a tire, it would be far in the future. An Atlantic team is going to start a few years from now if it comes to fruition. Realistically, 2021. If someone pops up who shows a committed interest for Quebec City, and starts a stadium conversation going, it would take another 3-8 years until a hypothetical touch down would be thrown...so maybe 2025-2030. You'd need something along the lines of what happened in Ottawa, and there doesn't seem to be any signs of that as it currently stands at all.

What's wrong with hoping that it rekindles interest in Quebec City? The league's issues won't go away with Toronto overnight, or over one season. That is an ongoing process.

As far as the talent pool goes, that might be a fair comment. Those same statements were made to suggest why Ottawa 3.0 would diminish the league. However, the opposite has happened...having Ottawa back has not diluted the talent pool, it's given more jobs to more people, and its brought more CFL games to league, rebirthed a fanbase, and had a positive net effect on the league.

An Atlantic club would enhance the talent. Canadian talent is an issue, but Canadian talent may also end up becoming better as a result of more jobs available. Who knows how many athletes that never get their break or chance might come into their own, or who needed more development might end up getting the shot they needed.

I would argue a Quebec City team could also have a similar effect. Quebec City loves their Canadian Football, they support the CIS team extremely well (way better than I've seen a CIS team in the west be supported), it would instantly create rivalries with Ottawa and Montréal (and maybe a hypothetical Atlantic team), and would be overall good for the east in that regard...I could see the market being a success

The TV deals would be worth more. The revenue generated league wide could be more. The fact it "links" each major region together would make it a truly Canadian league, that might become better supported as a result (it becomes more "nationally aware")...it might take the salary cap to new heights that could increase the talent pool in other ways.


At this point, an Atlantic club isn't even a reality. At this point, a Quebec City club is a far fetched thought - the only interest in it in the past was fleeting at best.

But what's wrong with hoping for that sequence of events to occur?

The fact it is an independent process makes it conceivable and makes "getting the house in order first" a separate issue, the league has needed to "get the house in order" before both Ottawa 2.0 and 3.0 came to exist; those markets have their difficulties for reasons that are independent of additional franchises. "Getting the house in order" has no impact on what might happen...I simply said I hope it reignites interest in yet another feasble market, that is all.
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  #650  
Old Posted Jul 12, 2018, 10:07 PM
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Don't know why they take so long now, but Drew Edwards on 3downnation.com posted the TV numbers for last week

Week 4 ratings

Thursday
Hamilton at Saskatchewan: 741,400

Friday (TSN only does not include RDS)
Ottawa at Montreal: 393,900

Saturday (early)
Edmonton at Toronto: 477,900

Saturday (late)
B.C. at Winnipeg: 466,800
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  #651  
Old Posted Jul 12, 2018, 11:06 PM
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Originally Posted by cjones2451 View Post
Don't know why they take so long now, but Drew Edwards on 3downnation.com posted the TV numbers for last week

Week 4 ratings

Thursday
Hamilton at Saskatchewan: 741,400

Friday (TSN only does not include RDS)
Ottawa at Montreal: 393,900

Saturday (early)
Edmonton at Toronto: 477,900

Saturday (late)
B.C. at Winnipeg: 466,800
Not great, but TV viewership is declining across the board.

I wonder what the figures would be if the games were on CTV. It might be worth TSN's while to simulcast one game a week on CTV (maybe after there are 10 teams and 5 games a week) and use that to promote the TSN games.
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  #652  
Old Posted Jul 13, 2018, 12:09 AM
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Not great, but TV viewership is declining across the board.

I wonder what the figures would be if the games were on CTV. It might be worth TSN's while to simulcast one game a week on CTV (maybe after there are 10 teams and 5 games a week) and use that to promote the TSN games.
CTV has a 20% greater reach than TSN, in addition to that, cord cutters can receive CTV OTA but need cable to get TSN.

I remember they gave a reason why games weren't on CTV but I can't remember why aside from the TV contract. By not being on CTV they are really hurting the growth of the product and unfortunately helping the NFL.

The Montreal number would be much more respectable with the addition of RDS (near 100k).

Still, despite being far from it's heyday so is every other sport, it would be interesting to see the latest comparisons.

Also, there was some speculation that one of the reasons for Rogers buying into the Argos would be a change in the TV contract that would allow for a weekly game on Sportsnet. Just rumour and innuendo (so far) as the saying goes.

Last edited by elly63; Jul 13, 2018 at 12:25 AM.
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  #653  
Old Posted Jul 13, 2018, 12:43 AM
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Wow. Trevor Harris with one more completion than interception and Calgary leads 17-0. Hoping for a better half for Ottawa after the break.
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  #654  
Old Posted Jul 13, 2018, 12:55 AM
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I stand corrected. He now has two more completions than interceptions. Four to two. 4/9 for 17 yards. 14 yards rushing by Ottawa as well for 31 net yards of offense in the first half.

CFL record? How is Calgary only up 20-0?
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  #655  
Old Posted Jul 13, 2018, 1:46 AM
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Mayor feels 2020 timeline ‘very aggressive’ for CFL team in Halifax
3Down Staff July 12, 2018

Halifax Mayor Mike Savage believes the 2020 season is too soon for a CFL stadium to be built if the Atlantic region does proceed in getting a franchise and the undertaking of such a building.

“My sense is 2020 is very aggressive. I don’t think we’re going to have a stadium by 2020 under any circumstances. 2020, I don’t see that as a possibility,” Savage said on NEWS 95.7’s The Rick Howe Show.

The Maritime Football Limited group led by Anthony LeBlanc, Bruce Bowser and Gary Drummond are putting a stadium plan together and have narrowed the location to two spots.

“This is a private sector-led proposal. They’re under no obligation to disclose confidential information,” Savage said.

“We’ve been encouraging the consortium – which I think is a good one – that as soon as we can, we need to get some idea out to the public of where they want to put this, what it’s going to cost, what the city’s role would be, what the province’s role might be, what the private sector role might be.”

Savage admitted he’s heard 200 million dollars is the number, but wondered if a stadium could be built for 150 or 140 million depending on the sacrifices that would have to be made.

“Clearly the municipality and the province would have to pay for this is in some way, but there’s also different ways that we can look at it,” Savage said.

“There aren’t that many cities of our size certainly in Canada that don’t have a facility that can host large sporting events, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that we have to have it.”

The Halifax Mayor did share his view on where the best spot for a stadium.

“Where’s the best place for a stadium, in my view? Shannon Park,” Savage said.

“It’s on the water, it’s beautiful. But as the mayor and as the guardian of the public good here, my favourite location for a stadium is wherever the people who are prepared to make it happen decide that they want to put it.”
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  #656  
Old Posted Jul 13, 2018, 1:53 AM
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Halifax's mayor and deputy mayor weigh in on CFL stadium debate (update)
Mayor Mike Savage said he has a general sense of the plan but hasn't yet seen any solid numbers
Meghan Groff halifaxtoday.ca July 12, 2018

When council meets next week, it's expected a debate on a proposal to bring a CFL team to the city will be high in the agenda.

A potential stadium appears to be the largest stumbling block, but the man who will chair that meeting says there are still a lot of unknowns.

Mayor Mike Savage told NEWS 95.7's The Rick Howe Show, he has a general sense of the plan but hasn't yet seen any solid numbers.

"This is a private sector-led proposal," he explained. "They're under no obligation to disclose confidential information."

"We've been encouraging the consortium -- which I think is a good one -- that as soon as we can, we need to get some idea out to the public of where they want to put this, what it's going to cost, what the city's role would be, what the province's role might be, what the private sector role might be."

He said Tuesday's discussion will be on whether Halifax should delve deeper into the numbers to see if the plan makes sense for the municipality.

"Clearly the municipality and the province would have to pay for this is some way, but there's also different ways we that could look it it," said Savage.

He thinks some councillors are in favour of putting cash up front as opposed to paying for it over time with property tax revenues.

"There aren't that many cities of our size in Canada that don't have a facility that can host large sporting events, but that doesn't necessarily mean we have to have it."

Halifax's deputy mayor would like to see staff explore whether or not to it makes sense to in some way participate in funding the building of the facility.

"Right now we need our staff to come up with an analysis of the many different options of how the city could participate in paying for it," said Waye Mason.

He added what Halifax can afford to contribute may not be enough to make it worthwhile for the private operator.

Mason said HRM has a long term plan to possibly build a community stadium that would seat between 10,000 and 15,000 people, and perhaps that could be worked into the new CFL proposal.

"We have a notional amount of money of $20- to 35 million set aside for that, so if we could contribute that to a CFL stadium that somebody else built and operated, and we still had a community access plan so people could use the stadium for recreation needs, then that's something we could consider."

Both Mason and Savage believe a stadium would generate development in whichever part of the city it is potentially located, but that doesn't necessarily equate to having more stores, restaurants and residential buildings.

"A stadium may bring certain development, but it also may move development from somewhere else," said Savage. "That's not a net gain to the municipality."

The mayor added, because HRM wouldn't own the stadium, council wouldn't have any involvement in deciding where it would be built.

"Where's the best place for a stadium in my view? Shannon Park," he stated.

"It's on the water, it's beautiful ... but as the mayor and as the guardian for the public good here, my favourite location for a stadium is wherever the people who are prepared to make it happen decide that they want to put it."
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  #657  
Old Posted Jul 13, 2018, 2:02 AM
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Originally Posted by elly63 View Post
Mayor feels 2020 timeline ‘very aggressive’ for CFL team in Halifax
3Down Staff July 12, 2018

Halifax Mayor Mike Savage believes the 2020 season is too soon for a CFL stadium to be built if the Atlantic region does proceed in getting a franchise and the undertaking of such a building.

“My sense is 2020 is very aggressive. I don’t think we’re going to have a stadium by 2020 under any circumstances. 2020, I don’t see that as a possibility,” Savage said on NEWS 95.7’s The Rick Howe Show.
I believe that's why the ownership group and the CFL Commissioner were in Moncton last month speaking to the Premier of NB and the Mayor of Moncton.

They were exploring the possibility of the new Maritime franchise playing out of the Moncton Stadium for the first 1-2 seasons, while the Halifax stadium gets built.

The Moncton Stadium has 10,000 seats, but was expanded to over 20,000 for the prior Touchdown Atlantic games. If the stadium hosts a CFL team for a couple of full seasons however, I believe the city and province would be willing to add in cash for more permanent seats, corporate boxes and a concourse with washrooms and concessions.

This expansion would be useful if the Moncton Stadium were to land a CPL soccer franchise down the road..........
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  #658  
Old Posted Jul 13, 2018, 2:26 AM
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This expansion would be useful if the Moncton Stadium were to land a CPL soccer franchise down the road..........
CPL drawing 20k, really? Maybe 2k.
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  #659  
Old Posted Jul 13, 2018, 3:01 AM
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CPL drawing 20k, really? Maybe 2k.
I didn't say that. The Moncton Stadium currently has 10,000 permanent seats. If they did do a renovation for the stadium to act as a temporary home for the Maritime CFL franchise, I could see them adding a couple of thousand permeant seats and then temporary end zone seats to get the stadium up to 20,000 or so.

The CFL really wants corporate boxes (which would have to be added) and the stadium needs a permanent concourse in the east grandstand with washrooms and concessions. These upgrades could be made for the temporary CFL presence, but would be useful for a permanent CPL replacement.

I think a revamped Moncton Stadium might have 12,000 seats with upgraded amenities. As to how many people would show up for games, I have no idea, but apparent the break even attendance (for CPL) is somewhere in the 5,000-6,000 range.
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  #660  
Old Posted Jul 13, 2018, 3:22 AM
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I believe former Commissioner Cohon postulated that it would take 100 million to make the Moncton stadium ready for the CFL. Now, he meant if Moncton had a permanent team but he had to have gotten that figure from somewhere and I doubt it just popped into his head.

Any howser, it is still going to cost a pretty penny to just make the adjustments that you posted. Look at some of those BMO upgrades, 10 million doesn't get you very far these days.

Just to be a "permanent" temporary home is going to cost some major bucks.
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