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View Poll Results: Which Canadian news network do you prefer?
CBC 54 60.67%
CTV 20 22.47%
Global 6 6.74%
Other 9 10.11%
Voters: 89. You may not vote on this poll

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  #81  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 8:36 PM
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One of my first truly political friends responded, shortly after we met, to my ''so you must be on the left, then?'', with a strong "No, I am not on the left, nor on the right. I judge each issue at face value".

This was about 25 years ago, and it took me just about that long to figure out how right he was. (He had other issues, but I won't get into that.)

But this idea that there is a package of more or else associated stuff you have to agree with on the one side, and another similarly disparate package on the other, and that your only option is a binary choice between the two, well...
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  #82  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 8:38 PM
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One of my first truly political friends responded, shortly after we met, to my ''so you must be on the left, then?'', with a strong "No, I am not on the left, nor on the right. I judge each issue at face value".

This was about 25 years ago, and it took me just about that long to figure out how right he was. (He had other issues, but I won't get into that.)

But this idea that there is a package of more or else associated stuff you have to agree with on the one side, and another similarly disparate package on the other, and that your only option is a binary choice between the two, well...
It works out to mostly true. The logic one uses to arrive at a progressive or regressive viewpoint affects their position on almost all issues.
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  #83  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 8:40 PM
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Thanks for that.

I don't care much about what goes on in the conservative camp, other than to keep an eye on them to make sure they don't do too much damage that will affect the rest of us.

But honestly, as someone who probably has similar leanings to mine, don't you find that it's increasingly difficult to be a reasonable lefty?

I mean,

I am racist just because I am not keen on the message that full face veils on women send to girls in our society?

I am a knuckle-dragging Trump deplorable because I don't think that the handling of illegal immigrants with kids by the U.S. in recent months is the EXACT SAME THING as Nazi concentration camps?
I dunno, maybe I don't get into discussions and/or arguments with people in real life enough, because the lefty people I know have the same reservations about burkas as I do.
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  #84  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 8:40 PM
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It works out to mostly true. The logic one uses to arrive at a progressive or regressive viewpoint affects their position on almost all issues.
Even when it shouldn't in some cases.
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  #85  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 8:40 PM
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Could you get around rules against gender discrimination by saying that women happen to be the only people who are qualified for a certain job?
On one hand we have rules against discrimination in hiring, but on the other hand there is relatively soft enforcement of same... there are "pink ghettos" that typically denote less desirable jobs where the overwhelming number of workers are women, but then there are also decent jobs like waitressing at places like Earls and other such casual dining restaurants. Students can make good money from tips alone at places like that, and those types of jobs are often the domain of young women.

Now as far as CBC and Nadia Kidwai go, I doubt they specifically set out to hire a hijab wearing brown woman with a Welsh accent. But I'm going to go out on a limb and say that knowing CBC, her personal characteristics were probably a factor, whether they admit it or not.
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  #86  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 8:44 PM
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Originally Posted by elly63 View Post
So instead of making a reasonable argument you insult, nice!
In light of the fact that the right wing crazies put a big orange crazy into the highest office in the land, in what universe does does the left have no boundaries while the right does?

You made an untenable claim that is obviously wrong.
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  #87  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 8:46 PM
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I dunno, maybe I don't get into discussions and/or arguments with people in real life enough, because the lefty people I know have the same reservations about burkas as I do.
But could this not be an indication of some type of slippage towards the right on their part?
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  #88  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 8:48 PM
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It's interesting how many (most?) examples of the crazy left inevitably veer to campus politics. Which, wait for it, has always been kind of crazy. Having heard first-hand accounts from some friends in academia (including someone with an office down the hall from JP!) it honestly doesn't seem much different than my time in school over a decade ago. The people making noise remain a small percentage but just have a bigger voice. The big game changers being social media and increased politicization monetization by groups that are very good at it. Things that should have never left campus newspapers are making national news.

On the whole the North American left is at a bit of a quandary right now - for too long there's been a focus on performative identity politics meanwhile actual economic policies remain solidly neoliberal with its associated erosion of social programs. Things are beginning to change now, or at least the writing is on the wall. It will be interesting to see how it shakes out in Canada.

CBC Radio is still the best but the pandering aspect can get obnoxious.
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  #89  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 8:49 PM
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But could this not be an indication of some type of slippage towards the right on their part?

Not necessarily. Rather a move away from a particular form of identity politics which isn't inherently right or left (yikes I sound like a broken record repeating that).
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  #90  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 8:52 PM
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But could this not be an indication of some type of slippage towards the right on their part?
I guess you would have to define what you mean by "right" in that case. I'm a centre-left person who is horrified by what the SJW identitarian left has become. But I'm far more concerned about our new idiot premier's right wing agenda for Ontario that will do real damage to the province than I am about pronoun-warriors.
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  #91  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 8:54 PM
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Originally Posted by niwell View Post
It's interesting how many (most?) examples of the crazy left inevitably veer to campus politics. Which, wait for it, has always been kind of crazy. Having heard first-hand accounts from some friends in academia (including someone with an office down the hall from JP!) it honestly doesn't seem much different than my time in school over a decade ago. The people making noise remain a small percentage but just have a bigger voice. The big game changers being social media and increased politicization monetization by groups that are very good at it. Things that should have never left campus newspapers are making national news.

On the whole the North American left is at a bit of a quandary right now - for too long there's been a focus on performative identity politics meanwhile actual economic policies remain solidly neoliberal with its associated erosion of social programs. Things are beginning to change now, or at least the writing is on the wall. It will be interesting to see how it shakes out in Canada.

CBC Radio is still the best but the pandering aspect can get obnoxious.
You made me think of an article I read some time ago by Montreal columnist Richard Martineau. He isa kind of a lapsed leftist urban hipster, and as a result is seen as a turncoat by many here in Sweden-on-the-St.-Lawrence.


Once upon a time the left used to be about defending the interests of labourers and working stiffs.

They’re now all about sexual, religious and ethnic minorities.

Why focus on working conditions on the shop floor when you can talk about much more critical stuff like bathrooms for transgender people, cultural appropriation or sexism in the French language? (Note from Acajack: French has genders for inanimate objects.)

In 2012, the left-wing think-tank Terra Nova told France’s Socialist Party just that: forget about the poor and workers – that leads us nowhere; anyway they’re all gonna vote for the right anyway, so…

Look instead to minorities and students. They’re gonna be your bread and butter!

It seems like many left wing organizations got the message…


The translation is by yours truly,

In case some of you can read French, here is the full column:

http://www.journaldemontreal.com/201...mal-aux-fesses

(Have fun with the title BTW.)
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  #92  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 8:56 PM
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Originally Posted by rousseau View Post
In light of the fact that the right wing crazies put a big orange crazy into the highest office in the land, in what universe does does the left have no boundaries while the right does?

You made an untenable claim that is obviously wrong.
What was my claim that was wrong? You insult instead of debate. Do you really believe half of the US public are right wing crazies? What does that tell you about the suitability of the other candidate?

Norm MacDonald had one Trump joke. He hates Trump jokes because only lazy comedians use them because they are low hanging fruit. Anyway he said people hated Hillary so much that they voted for someone they hated worse
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  #93  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 9:00 PM
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Originally Posted by esquire View Post
Now as far as CBC and Nadia Kidwai go, I doubt they specifically set out to hire a hijab wearing brown woman with a Welsh accent. But I'm going to go out on a limb and say that knowing CBC, her personal characteristics were probably a factor, whether they admit it or not.
Employment "equity" in federally regulated workplaces
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  #94  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 9:01 PM
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Even when it shouldn't in some cases.
There is definitely a tendency to tolerate intolerance that isn't white and Christian in origin on the left, which is depressing. Iranian women, as a rule, are especially aware of and bitter about this when it comes to western feminism. "So because I am born in Tehran then lukewarm rights are alright for me compared to a woman born in London?" Etc. It's a common topic of conversation, much like the Eastern European woman in with bleached blonde hair and a pink businesssuit looks at women in the West in shoulder pads and feels uncomfortable like they're wearing fake beards.
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  #95  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 9:34 PM
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The choice would have to be CBC, since the others are just pseudo American channels.
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  #96  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 9:40 PM
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Think about it: if you wrote a movie script ten years ago about buffoonish US president in which he comments on a Nazi/white nationalist rally in Virginia by saying "there are very fine people on both sides," it would have been turned down for being too far-fetched.
IIRC, the "there are fine people on both sides [of this debate]" was referring to the debate about whether or not we should eliminate statues of people whose legacies are now considered tainted.

I agree with Trump that, at first sight, there were probably fine and well-meaning Haligonians in either camp, the "let's take down that Edward Cornwallis statue" and the "let's leave it there". It's a legitimate debate to have, and reasonable people can have either position.

You're taking that quote out of context. (I'm not that surprised, honestly.)
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  #97  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 9:41 PM
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The local Edmonton CBC is pretty terrible, , so for morning news we watch CTV (The Global morning anchor is my S.O.'s mortal enemy since high school. It's dumb and funny at the same time) And if we do happen to watch the evening news it's Global. If I'm still awake at 10pm on the weekday I'll maybe tune in for the first part of the national

When in BC, it's pretty much BC1 all the time.
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  #98  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 9:44 PM
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Originally Posted by MonctonRad View Post
CBC is all social justice all the time.

CTV tends to be more balanced, and in the Maritimes, gives good regional coverage.

Global has a minimal presence in the Maritimes (news program for the Maritimes is based out of Toronto), but I find the Global National News to be surprisingly good.

Although I dislike the CBC television news (especially since the loss of Mansbridge), I really enjoy CBC radio for their news and public affairs coverage.
The social justice thing is a bit much. I am pretty left wing, and even I feel like it's brainwashing or unnecessary reinforcement of common ideals sometimes. CBC radio is quite good, but is guilty of these things as well. There really isn't any other non music radio.
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  #99  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 9:54 PM
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Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker View Post
It works out to mostly true. The logic one uses to arrive at a progressive or regressive viewpoint affects their position on almost all issues.
I take a little umbrage to your characterization that non-progressive viewpoints are necessarily "regressive".

A non-progressive viewpoint might simply be "conservative" in the sense that not all "progressive" change is good change. Progressive change can be disruptive and may accomplish little in the long run. Sometimes the status quo is preferable.

Many conservatives are not interested in winding the clock back. They just feel that most of the major changes necessary to promote equality and fairness have already been made. Additional change might actually tip the balance in the other direction. This viewpoint is not actively regressive. It is conservative in the sense you want to "conserve" the current situation.

Too much change can amount to unnecessary meddling.
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  #100  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2018, 9:55 PM
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CBC (unfortunately) for breaking Canadian news or national coverage, otherwise prefer reading the news online.

CP24 for local breaking news, otherwise prefer reading online.
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