What place is closest to being a microcosm of Canada?

[Pavlov]

Originally Posted by manny_santos

I believe Kingston is down to 5; the one at Princess and Sydenham closed last year. Unless a new one has opened that I'm not aware of. Balzac's has taken its place.

Starbucks in Kingston is so heavily dependent on Queen's students that one of their downtown locations operates on reduced hours from May-August. Which really sucks if you live there year-round and want someplace other than Boston Pizza or the Ale House to go to on a Friday evening.

There is a new Starbucks on Princess beside Farm Boy (although one might wonder whether days of the Starbucks inside Chapters across Princess might be numbered?)

Anyway, it's hard to believe that Starbucks was once seen as a badge of prestige or sophistication. That feels like a long time ago.

[Loco101]

In Timmins, there really isn't any competition for Tim's. The main industry in mining and most people drive to work. Even many people who work downtown who walk will stop in at Tim Hortons before and maybe after work. Until a few new locations opened within the last few years, there would be backups so long in some of the drive-thrus that the cars would be waiting on the road causing traffic backups. And I have to add that our population has been shrinking.

A lot of people don't know that Tim Horton (the person and hockey player) was from our region, originally from Cochrane.

[Loco101]

I may have mentioned on here before that Timmins is a pretty good microcosm of Canada. I would say that Sudbury and North Bay seem to be as well. I always think of North Bay as being the best microcosm of Ontario.

[wave46]

Originally Posted by Loco101

I may have mentioned on here before that Timmins is a pretty good microcosm of Canada. I would say that Sudbury and North Bay seem to be as well. I always think of North Bay as being the best microcosm of Ontario.

Sudbury might be considered a microcosm of Canada 30-40 years ago, but I think this country has changed too much from an immigration standpoint to say so today.

Same with North Bay for representing Ontario. It might do a reasonable facsimile of small-town Ontario, but it doesn't catch how the character of the GTA has changed over the years.

I'm not actually sure what city really is a microcosm of Ontario. Certain cities hit certain marks, but not all of them. I guess Ottawa might be closest for the same reason that I mentioned it as a microcosm of Canada, I suppose.

[Acajack]

Ottawa IMO is too French and too influenced by Quebec to be a microcosm city for Ontario.

Such a city may be difficult to find for that province.

[le calmar]

Originally Posted by Reesonov

(although one might wonder whether days of the Starbucks inside Chapters across Princess might be numbered?)

Somebody who works there told me they were going to close it, but I am not sure how accurate that information is since there is always a Starbucks inside Indigo/Chapters, it is kind of part of the package.

So correct me if I am wrong, but counting the Starbucks on Queens campus, there are currently 7 locations across the city.

[ssiguy]

In English Canada, London was always a big test market city. First cable in Canada, first downtown mall in NA, some of the first restaurant chains etc. despite it's reputation of being conservative, it has always been centre-left in people's daily lives and political leanings. London has always been a bastion of Liberal party support, federally and provincially. It, unlike Peterborough, is a mid-size city so better reflects urban Canada and is not as easily changed by local events or cultural issues lie Peterborough.

[Capsicum]

Originally Posted by Acajack

This "drift" of where the real Canada is (and of its symbols) reminds me of the fight over the name Macedonia!

It's not uncommon for discrepancies to arise between the historical name of a place and its current area. See: the discussion over the name of the United States (the first modern country in the Americas to declare independence) and the claim to the name "America" versus Latin American countries who prefer "America" to refer to the New World.

While some countries are named after historical entities larger or more expansive than their current areas, many countries are also named after areas previously much smaller than themselves. For example, Mexico the country was in a sense named after Mexico the city, as it was the capital and heartland of the Aztec empire.

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by manny_santos

I believe Kingston is down to 5; the one at Princess and Sydenham closed last year. Unless a new one has opened that I'm not aware of. Balzac's has taken its place.

Starbucks in Kingston is so heavily dependent on Queen's students that one of their downtown locations operates on reduced hours from May-August. Which really sucks if you live there year-round and want someplace other than Boston Pizza or the Ale House to go to on a Friday evening.

Yeah.. Kingston might be only city where independent/small-chain coffeehouses are driving Starbucks out of business, rather the other way around. Balzac's replaced Starbucks, and a independent cafe opened a few doors down around the same time.

Same thing with the book stores. Downtown Kingston used to have 4 bookstores--3 independents and an Indigo. It's the Indigo that closed while the independents are thriving.

[Loco101]

Originally Posted by wave46

Sudbury might be considered a microcosm of Canada 30-40 years ago, but I think this country has changed too much from an immigration standpoint to say so today.

Same with North Bay for representing Ontario. It might do a reasonable facsimile of small-town Ontario, but it doesn't catch how the character of the GTA has changed over the years.

I'm not actually sure what city really is a microcosm of Ontario. Certain cities hit certain marks, but not all of them. I guess Ottawa might be closest for the same reason that I mentioned it as a microcosm of Canada, I suppose.

Good points made there.

But I do have to say that Sudbury has seen a huge growth in its visible minority population. I believe there has also been a large increase for its Indigenous population as well. If anybody can provide a link to stats I would like to see the changes according to the last census in 2016.

I chose North Bay for Ontario not so much for demographics but other things. I lived there for a year and found that it has close connections with Toronto, Ottawa and Northern Ontario which doesn't seem to exist in any other city in the province. Politically it votes much like Ontario does as a whole. Maybe that's what made me think of it this way the most. I lived there when Mike Harris was Premier who represented the electoral district. I did not like him or the PCs and couldn't believe there was somewhere in Northern Ontario that voted that way, in fact it was the only Northern riding that voted PC.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by Capsicum

While some countries are named after historical entities larger or more expansive than their current areas, many countries are also named after areas previously much smaller than themselves. For example, Mexico the country was in a sense named after Mexico the city, as it was the capital and heartland of the Aztec empire.

France is also a good example. Originally, the term referred to a much smaller geographical area; the modern country got united much later.

[le calmar]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

Yeah.. Kingston might be only city where independent/small-chain coffeehouses are driving Starbucks out of business, rather the other way around. Balzac's replaced Starbucks, and a independent cafe opened a few doors down around the same time.

Same thing with the book stores. Downtown Kingston used to have 4 bookstores--3 independents and an Indigo. It's the Indigo that closed while the independents are thriving.

That's apparently the case in Gatineau too, two Second Cups and one Starbucks closed but the local chain Moca Loca is thriving.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Loco101

Good points made there.

But I do have to say that Sudbury has seen a huge growth in its visible minority population. I believe there has also been a large increase for its Indigenous population as well. If anybody can provide a link to stats I would like to see the changes according to the last census in 2016.

I chose North Bay for Ontario not so much for demographics but other things. I lived there for a year and found that it has close connections with Toronto, Ottawa and Northern Ontario which doesn't seem to exist in any other city in the province. Politically it votes much like Ontario does as a whole. Maybe that's what made me think of it this way the most. I lived there when Mike Harris was Premier who representing the electoral district. I did not like him or the PCs and couldn't believe there was somewhere in Northern Ontario that voted that way, in fact it was the only Northern riding that voted PC.

North Bay is less francophone than Timmins and Sudbury but IMO is still probably "too French" to be a representative city for the province of Ontario.

It's around 15% IIRC.

[niwell]

Originally Posted by The Macallan

I have read somewhere but cannot now locate, an article which stated that ad agencies use Peterborough as their sample Canadian city for tests and marketing etc. If it will fly in Peterborough... I don't know the thinking behind this.

Peterborough is likely the best microcosm of Anglo Canada IMO. It really does have aspects of everything: manufacturing working class base, decently sized University and all that entails, large government offices (MNRF) and the surrounding rural population.

But not Canada as a whole, of course! Which makes sense as agencies tend to treat Quebec as a separate market entirely.

London would be a good choice too, but maybe too white collar to be truly representative?

[Acajack]

I believe that for Quebec they use St-Hyacinthe or Drummondville as "typical". These cities are between Montreal and Quebec City.

They're almost 100% francophone which is useful for marketing studies, but for the microcosm city for Quebec I might pick Sherbrooke.

It's very predominantly francophone but has an anglo minority plus a decent immigrant population. A majority of francophones are unilingual but a sizeable minority of them can speak English to some degree (40%?).

Talking demographically only. Not architectural vernacular of course.

[Nashe]

Originally Posted by niwell

Peterborough is likely the best microcosm of Anglo Canada IMO. It really does have aspects of everything: manufacturing working class base, decently sized University and all that entails, large government offices (MNRF) and the surrounding rural population.

But not Canada as a whole, of course! Which makes sense as agencies tend to treat Quebec as a separate market entirely.

Which again is why I think Moncton is a great analogue... Although Dieppe (immediately adjacent Moncton to the East) is technically a separate city, it really isn't considered that by anyone other than a few "Dieppenemese" (I can't take credit for that, a councillor said it). A separate, Francophone city, but not REALLY a separate city... Sound familiar?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Vorkuta

Which again is why I think Moncton is a great analogue... Although Dieppe (immediately adjacent Moncton to the East) is technically a separate city, it really isn't considered that by anyone other than a few "Dieppenemese" (I can't take credit for that, a councillor said it). A separate, Francophone city, but not REALLY a separate city... Sound familiar?

Moncton is definitely arguable as a choice for Canada as a whole, but it's the only one in the running as the microcosm city for New Brunswick, that's for sure.

[le calmar]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I believe that for Quebec they use St-Hyacinthe or Drummondville as "typical". These cities are between Montreal and Quebec City.

I know several years ago (10-15 years) Sherbrooke and Saguenay were considered "typical" and were often used as sample cities for polls and various tests. The context has changed a lot and Saguenay is not quite as diverse are the major cities in southern Quebec are, so I am not sure that still stands today (for Saguenay at least).

[north 42]

Originally Posted by niwell

Peterborough is likely the best microcosm of Anglo Canada IMO. It really does have aspects of everything: manufacturing working class base, decently sized University and all that entails, large government offices (MNRF) and the surrounding rural population.

But not Canada as a whole, of course! Which makes sense as agencies tend to treat Quebec as a separate market entirely.

London would be a good choice too, but maybe too white collar to be truly representative?

London has a huge blue collar industrial base though, as well as a very large underclass. It's definately not just a white collar city, as London has always been a major manufacturing centre!


http://www.lfpress.com/2017/09/21/th...ing-or-looking

[Docere]

Originally Posted by niwell

Peterborough is likely the best microcosm of Anglo Canada IMO. It really does have aspects of everything: manufacturing working class base, decently sized University and all that entails, large government offices (MNRF) and the surrounding rural population.

But not Canada as a whole, of course! Which makes sense as agencies tend to treat Quebec as a separate market entirely.

London would be a good choice too, but maybe too white collar to be truly representative?

London is more blue collar than many people think.