Proposal - Hwy 10 Freeway

[Punkster]

[QUOTE=jhausner;3707222]
I could never live in Vancouver and work South of the Fraser. It's stupid unless you take the bus.
QUOTE]

Hrmm, I think that's the point of trying to keep the congestion tho
I'd like to see a boundary rd bridge tho. I know I've seen it before in planning documents. As for a replacement for the Queensboro, the current improvements to the loop at the north bridgehead, the extension of 10th ave, and the Howes overpass were supposed to be the soloution to congestion there. The looked at twinning the bridge or building a new one sort of where wal-mart is there but the cost-benefit analysis killed them. It's in the MoT website documents section.

I'd like to see a bridge or more feasibly a tunnel, that somehow connects north surrey more easily to Richmond and Annacis Island, somewhere near the Surrey-Fraser docks and continues straight ahead to the east-west connector. I think it would open up a lot of transit option as well, considering how many jobs are in Richmond. A train from Richmond through to abbotsford would be awesome.

[VancouverOfTheFuture]

i realize this is pretty old, but i was wondering if anyone has a map for what the alignment for a serpentine freeway would be. the picture in the 1st post is no longer available. i am curious about what this would look like.

[Daguy]

^^^

https://maps.google.ca/maps/ms?msa=0...bb7c8ebd3b6340

[makr3trkr]

Originally Posted by Punkster

As for a replacement for the Queensboro, the current improvements to the loop at the north bridgehead, the extension of 10th ave, and the Howes overpass were supposed to be the soloution to congestion there.

New Westminster refused a flyover that MoT offered directly to/from 20th St.

Originally Posted by Punkster

The looked at twinning the bridge or building a new one sort of where wal-mart is there but the cost-benefit analysis killed them. It's in the MoT website documents section.

In fact, the cost-benefit was overwhelmingly positive:

"Concept 1A was the widening of Highway 91A to six lanes ... At $126 million, this was the least expensive Concept for crossing the Fraser River. It provided additional capacity, increased mobility, decreased travel times, improved safety, and improved conditions for HOVs, inter-regional trips, trucking, cycling and pedestrians. Neighbourhood impacts were relatively modest. The Concept had a strong NPV of $186 million."

http://www.th.gov.bc.ca/publications...est/level3.htm

Originally Posted by Punkster

I'd like to see a bridge or more feasibly a tunnel, that somehow connects north surrey more easily to Richmond and Annacis Island, somewhere near the Surrey-Fraser docks and continues straight ahead to the east-west connector.

There are references to a 96th Ave crossing in North Delta planning documents, I would assume that because the bridge would have to be high-level it was deemed too expensive.

[tybuilding]

Originally Posted by Daguy

^^^

https://maps.google.ca/maps/ms?msa=0...bb7c8ebd3b6340

Pretty pointless now that the SFPR is in and upgrades to Hwy 15

[ssiguy]

I hope Surrey has the Serpentine Freeway in it's long term planned because there is huge development along HWY#10 and I would hate to have them loose the corridor but it wouldn't surprise me if they did.

HHWY#!0 is incredibly busy and what makes it even worse is that much of that traffic is transport heading to wither the Ferry or the Port. People in Vancouver who don't like freeways don't seem to comprehend that those groceries and supplies that they enjoy actually come from trucks and those trucks have to get around. HWY #10 has probably done more harm than good as it has forced transport trucks onto roads that go right thru the heart of communities like 10 corridor Surrey/Cloverdale and Langley. The Langley By-pass is no such thing any longer, akin to calling the Kingsway a Burnaby by-pass.

Many transport and certainly regular traffic avoid highway 10 and try to use every local route imaginable so down here in S.Surrey we have huge amounts of transport traffic on regular 2 lane roads that were not designed for them. These same roads have no sidewalks or bike paths so it is quite dangerous.

They should have built the Serpentine instead of the SFPH but alas it will now be a long time before it happens.

[moosejaw]

I doubt we will see anything like this and the corridor will get built up and it will be too late. Besides the uninformed public will be up in arms that another highway will be built without public transit input (Skytrain/RapidBus etc...).

Also where would they get the money to build this? BCMOT couldn't afford a proper intersection at the busiest choke point on the SFPR? And the only reason they didn't put a grade separated intersection was bc it wasn't shown on any media documents.

In any event the Serpentine Freeway if it gets approval will most definitely will be tolled. And even if they did build this road, how long before the same nitwit that waved his magic wand at the SFPR turns all the interchanges into stoplights?

[GMasterAres]

I don't think it will be built not for any of the reasons mentioned but because of all the ALR it cuts through, far more than the SFPR. People get their panties in a knot when someone builds a fence on ALR land let alone a freeway.

[DKaz]

Have you driven Hwy 10 recently? Truck traffic is substantially down since the SFPR opened. It's still very busy with all the passenger vehicles.

[dmuzika]

Is there a potential corridor that could extend east and south of Langley? As a general loop, could it run from Hwy 1 at the 232/248 Street area and link with Hwy 99 around 24 Ave?

I also recall seeing a proposal to construct a freeway along 16 Ave between Abbotsford and White Rock.

[Metro-One]

There is really no use even talking about this, such a corridor is so far down on any highway wish list for the province.

Before this I would like to see:

The 99 upgraded with the new bridge.
All intersections along the SFPR to be upgraded to interchanges.
The #1 up to full freeway standards to Alberta.
A true freeway / expressway built through / around Kelowna
The 97 upgraded to 4 lanes via a new by-pass around Peachland
The Okanagan connector completed, even if that means simply upgrading the western end to freeway standards via interchanges.
The Malahat upgraded to full expressway standards to Nanaimo. This could be an entirely new 4 lane freeway with tolls.
The 17 upgraded to full freeway from the ferry to where it currently ends in Victoria.
The Island highway upgraded to full freeway (especially around Nanaimo).
The Mary Hill Bypass upgraded to freeway standards.
A new bridge built to replace the Lions Gate (around Main is my idea).
The Cariboo Connector upgraded to 4 lanes full length.
The #1 from 200th to Chilliwack upgraded to 6 lanes.
And of course, the 72nd traffic light removed

After all that is done (along with the Broadway skytrain, Surrey skytrain, LRT in Victoria, commuter rail to Abbotsford, and possibly even an LRT line in Kelowna), then we could waste money on this dream freeway

[GMasterAres]

Originally Posted by DKaz

Have you driven Hwy 10 recently? Truck traffic is substantially down since the SFPR opened. It's still very busy with all the passenger vehicles.

The worse stretch of HWY10 is between 176th and 200th. You just crawl through Cloverdale because the lights are horribly timed, and then 200th is probably one of the worse intersections for delays and bad timings in Metro-Van (next to a few in Coquitlam). Outside of that, you're spot on that the SFPR has reduced truck traffic considerably and it isn't that bad now.

176th though heading eastbound still can back up for a long ways even with the SFPR open. I've seen it still backed up as far as 168th and it can take 15-20 minutes to get from there to beyond 176th, a stretch that with no traffic takes 2 minutes.

[dharper]

Originally Posted by dmuzika

I also recall seeing a proposal to construct a freeway along 16 Ave between Abbotsford and White Rock.

Well here is an article from the Langley Times last week. http://www.langleytimes.com/news/321796501.html



The Township of Langley has been polling residents about a proposal to send more traffic down busy 16 Avenue.
The King Road connector is an Abbotsford plan that would connect Highway 1 to 16 Avenue.
It would link King Road, at Bradner Road, with Mt. Lehman Road at Marshall Road.
The Abbotsford municipal website says the road link “will provide an important transportation connection between Abbotsford and Langley/Surrey through the 16th Avenue corridor and will reduce traffic volume on Fraser Highway and 8th Avenue.”
Abbotsford held a public consultation meeting about the King Road connector of local residents in that city on Tuesday, April 14.
A report is due in September.
Langley Township posted an online poll about King Road and other proposed changes to 16 Avenue on the municipal website in July. It asked residents to rate their concerns about safety and traffic congestion issues along 16 avenue.
The Township also wanted respondents to review proposed short, medium and long-term options for the designated truck route.
Short-term plans, defined as the next five years, could include pull-outs along the mostly two-lane road to allow drivers to get around slower-moving vehicles and permit police to pull people over.
Medium-term, defined as a 10-year-period that follows, would see 16 Avenue become a four-lane route west of 176 Street with a median barrier. There would be more left-turn lanes and five intersections in Langley, and Abbotsford would get traffic lights: 208, 232, 272, Lefeuvre and Bradner.
The medium-term plan includes construction of the “King Road Connector” by Abbotsford.
Long-term plans, 15 years or more from now, would add still more left-turn lanes and widen the road to four lanes east of 176. The intersections at 224 and 240 would get traffic lights.
The proposals are listed in a recently-completed study of 16 Avenue by Surrey, Langley Township and Abbotsford, along with the Ministry of Transportation and Infrastructure, ICBC and TransLink.
The study notes that the 16 Avenue corridor “has a history of safety and traffic operation issues” and “speeding is reportedly a problem.”
It also notes the route is currently running 13 to 16 per cent truck traffic, compared to the “average arterial” which carries five to 10 per cent trucks.
Langley Township would pay more than the other two municipalities combined if all the proposed changes were made — $133.5 million compared to $72.5 million for Surrey and $20.5 million for Abbotsford.
The Greater Langley and Abbotsford Chambers of Commerce have both called for improvements to 16 Avenue, in a joint statement that said the “inefficiency of the current transportation network causes a major barrier to business and investment” and calls on the province to designate 16 Avenue a provincial highway.
“This connector would relieve the bottle neck of traffic between Langley and Abbotsford (and) facilitate increased efficiency in the movement of people, goods and services” the chambers’ statement said.

[go_leafs_go02]

Originally Posted by dharper

Well here is an article from the Langley Times last week. http://www.langleytimes.com/news/321796501.html



The Township of Langley has been polling residents about a proposal to send more traffic down busy 16 Avenue.
The King Road connector is an Abbotsford plan that would connect Highway 1 to 16 Avenue.
It would link King Road, at Bradner Road, with Mt. Lehman Road at Marshall Road.
The Abbotsford municipal website says the road link “will provide an important transportation connection between Abbotsford and Langley/Surrey through the 16th Avenue corridor and will reduce traffic volume on Fraser Highway and 8th Avenue.”
Abbotsford held a public consultation meeting about the King Road connector of local residents in that city on Tuesday, April 14.
A report is due in September.
Langley Township posted an online poll about King Road and other proposed changes to 16 Avenue on the municipal website in July. It asked residents to rate their concerns about safety and traffic congestion issues along 16 avenue.
The Township also wanted respondents to review proposed short, medium and long-term options for the designated truck route.
Short-term plans, defined as the next five years, could include pull-outs along the mostly two-lane road to allow drivers to get around slower-moving vehicles and permit police to pull people over.
Medium-term, defined as a 10-year-period that follows, would see 16 Avenue become a four-lane route west of 176 Street with a median barrier. There would be more left-turn lanes and five intersections in Langley, and Abbotsford would get traffic lights: 208, 232, 272, Lefeuvre and Bradner.
The medium-term plan includes construction of the “King Road Connector” by Abbotsford.
Long-term plans, 15 years or more from now, would add still more left-turn lanes and widen the road to four lanes east of 176. The intersections at 224 and 240 would get traffic lights.
The proposals are listed in a recently-completed study of 16 Avenue by Surrey, Langley Township and Abbotsford, along with the Ministry of Transportation and Infrastructure, ICBC and TransLink.
The study notes that the 16 Avenue corridor “has a history of safety and traffic operation issues” and “speeding is reportedly a problem.”
It also notes the route is currently running 13 to 16 per cent truck traffic, compared to the “average arterial” which carries five to 10 per cent trucks.
Langley Township would pay more than the other two municipalities combined if all the proposed changes were made — $133.5 million compared to $72.5 million for Surrey and $20.5 million for Abbotsford.
The Greater Langley and Abbotsford Chambers of Commerce have both called for improvements to 16 Avenue, in a joint statement that said the “inefficiency of the current transportation network causes a major barrier to business and investment” and calls on the province to designate 16 Avenue a provincial highway.
“This connector would relieve the bottle neck of traffic between Langley and Abbotsford (and) facilitate increased efficiency in the movement of people, goods and services” the chambers’ statement said.

"Speeding" is only a problem because someone decided 60 km/h for a rural arterial roadway through farmland made sense. Change it to 80 km/h, which people are already going and all of a sudden "speeding" doesn't exist.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Metro-One

There is really no use even talking about this, such a corridor is so far down on any highway wish list for the province.

Before this I would like to see:

The 99 upgraded with the new bridge.
All intersections along the SFPR to be upgraded to interchanges.
The #1 up to full freeway standards to Alberta.
A true freeway / expressway built through / around Kelowna
The 97 upgraded to 4 lanes via a new by-pass around Peachland
The Okanagan connector completed, even if that means simply upgrading the western end to freeway standards via interchanges.
The Malahat upgraded to full expressway standards to Nanaimo. This could be an entirely new 4 lane freeway with tolls.
The 17 upgraded to full freeway from the ferry to where it currently ends in Victoria.
The Island highway upgraded to full freeway (especially around Nanaimo).
The Mary Hill Bypass upgraded to freeway standards.
A new bridge built to replace the Lions Gate (around Main is my idea).
The Cariboo Connector upgraded to 4 lanes full length.
The #1 from 200th to Chilliwack upgraded to 6 lanes.
And of course, the 72nd traffic light removed

After all that is done (along with the Broadway skytrain, Surrey skytrain, LRT in Victoria, commuter rail to Abbotsford, and possibly even an LRT line in Kelowna), then we could waste money on this dream freeway

I agree with you on all the points I'm familiar with, in particular with the Lion's Bridge replacement (just make it 6 lanes, not 4, and/or include space for rrt), but hark!! This would be the bloodiest heritage battle in city history.

[Cypherus]

Originally Posted by Daguy

^^^

https://maps.google.ca/maps/ms?msa=0...bb7c8ebd3b6340

Cool map. But as tybuilding mentioned, this is a pointless arterial road now that we have the SFPR. What we really need is to take truck traffic off Hwy 1 between Surrey and Abbotsford. On any given day, including Sundays, there is just a line of trucks in the slow lane, with some trucks taking chances in the fast lane to pass their slower compatriots. A highway down the 16th avenue corridor would free up Hwy 1 between Surrey and Abbotsford and allow truck traffic entering from the states to head East to bypass much of Surrey and Langley.

[dharper]

That map must be close to 20 years old. I am very familiar with it as it was going to go through my back yard. It was a possible approach route for the Golden Ears Bridge, back when HWY 15(176th st) was only 2 lanes. They of coarse decided on the shorter Golden Ears Way, over to HWY 15, which has since been widened to 4 lanes.

[fredinno]

Originally Posted by twoNeurons

A bridge at Boundary could lighten the load off of Oak and Knight for people trying to bypass or head North on the #1 (North Shore/Squamish/Whistler...)

That's really the only feasible route as a connector. Boundary is tricky. It "Could" be widened with some expropriation north of Kingsway. South of Kingsway you'd have to eat into Central Park (or tunnel it around there) and then build retaining walls on the Burnaby side, making a bunch of streets dead ends similar to the #1 between 1st ave and Hastings.

Technically, this freeway would only be "half" in Vancouver... and it would offer a quick connect between Freeways... however, I'm not sure it's needed.

edit: a map

Wonder if a Main Street and Oak St Bridge (at False Creek) to ease some of the traffic pressure once 99 is expanded.


I'm more interested in a highway tunnel through Alderbridge, extending the 91 to YVR. Getting into YVR from Bridgeport Rd. is a mess.

Originally Posted by Stingray2004

It's a freeway corridor that would commence near the King George Hwy interchange with Hwy 99 and heads eastward until around 184th St. whereby it jogs southward until around 16th Ave.

From there, on an alignment just north of 16th Ave, it would continue eastward until it connects Hwy 1 near the Abbotsford International Airport.

Originally Posted by ssiguy

I hope Surrey has the Serpentine Freeway in it's long term planned because there is huge development along HWY#10 and I would hate to have them loose the corridor but it wouldn't surprise me if they did.

HHWY#!0 is incredibly busy and what makes it even worse is that much of that traffic is transport heading to wither the Ferry or the Port. People in Vancouver who don't like freeways don't seem to comprehend that those groceries and supplies that they enjoy actually come from trucks and those trucks have to get around. HWY #10 has probably done more harm than good as it has forced transport trucks onto roads that go right thru the heart of communities like 10 corridor Surrey/Cloverdale and Langley. The Langley By-pass is no such thing any longer, akin to calling the Kingsway a Burnaby by-pass.

Many transport and certainly regular traffic avoid highway 10 and try to use every local route imaginable so down here in S.Surrey we have huge amounts of transport traffic on regular 2 lane roads that were not designed for them. These same roads have no sidewalks or bike paths so it is quite dangerous.

They should have built the Serpentine instead of the SFPH but alas it will now be a long time before it happens.

Langley Bypass is still a bypass in the sense it's much faster than going through the city center

But yeah, SFPR cut the need for this highway- I actually think a Hwy 15 expressway makes just as much sense right now, possibly with a "Cloverdale Bypass" that takes some of the Serpentine Hwy's Corridor.