Victoria Construction - #7

[m0nkyman]

Yup. And this will make a twenty just brutal to push through.

[The Great Scaper]

I am still really excited over this though. When has the city ever increased height limits?

And as for the whole.... "will the new 19 be the old 14" and will they eventually look stubby......

I think in Baby Steps.....

Baby steps for 14

Baby Steps to 19....

Baby Steps to 25....

heeheheheeee

That reminds me of that movie What about Bob....hey I am Bob!!!

[The Great Scaper]

Monkey Man...I didn't read your post till after I replied to Zoomer's. As for the push for twenty. Astoria is twenty, the Crystal View is currently twenty or 22 and The Hudson is at 24. So I still think in time we will get to the mid twenties. I hope.

[zoomer]

yah, baby steps...it is progress. As MM said though, interesting how it's still under that psychological barrier of 20!! Yet throughout the rest of greater Victoria there are tons of proposals in the 30 and 40 storey range!

Ideally I would like to see several mid 20's (and there will be one with the Hudson) downtown, then maybe a decade later some in the 30's.

[m0nkyman]

Fourteen was so silly that getting twenty was basically a gimme. Having had a blanket increase given makes a twenty storey a lot more politically difficult. Point blank, Crystal View ain't going to make it to twenty because of this IMNSHO.

I'd have much preferred to have seen a process or a set of requirements clearly laid out for what qualifies a project for a density bonus, instead of another hard limit we get to fight in a few years.

[The Great Scaper]

I would really like to see thirty story buildings too. Especially in Harris Green. And in time it will happen. But I still think this is the first step. Also don't forget that Westbank's Crystal Court project could come in at 22. They are going to be having a public booth at the Moss Street Market, with their latest rendering.

I also wonder if this new height variance will change the B.C.B.C. lot proposal? I hope so.

[zoomer]

Originally Posted by m0nkyman

I'd have much preferred to have seen a process or a set of requirements clearly laid out for what qualifies a project for a density bonus, instead of another hard limit we get to fight in a few years.

But that would have made sense and taken away some of the god like power from city councillors. Wouldn't want that now would we!!

[The Great Scaper]

Again I missed you post!!! hahahaa

First off what does IMNSHO mean?

And I still have faith that the Crystal View can make it too at least twenty. Astoria is twenty right across the road. However it's in Jamesbay too. But I still think it can make it through. It's a huge amenity package.

[m0nkyman]

In My Not So Humble Opinion.

And Crystal View is fucked. By specifically and publically restating the height limits, with higher limits in the north, it is now politically impossible to approve anything higher in the south without basically admitting that the limits mean nothing. JBNEA et al will not let that fly.

[The Great Scaper]

Bahahahaha....Zoomer buddy....that's too funny.

Politicians still have this fear that if they speak to boldly for this that they'll get voted out. It's funny My Mom who's in her fifties still likes the "Old English" charm or feel to Victoria. And is worried about all the changes. She says she is proud of me for my work and time donated to making changes I want to see happen downtown. But I know she's sad that I have my views!!! hahahaha....Where as my father and rest of my family completely agree with my take on mostly everything regarding downtown density etc.

My Brother however who is on the real estate board is very pesemistic on the changes ever happening. But it's happening now and I am so excited. Even if this is the first step.

[The Great Scaper]

I am not so sure about the Crystal View. The gift being given to the city is pretty huge. I also know that a good number of Councilors have a supporting view towards it. It will be interesting to see. Also Sonya won't be voting on it as she is going to be out on Maternity leave. So one no vote will be missing too.

Not all is lost. I hope not, I love what I have seen so far.

On the other hand I am concerned for Gateway Green. I have been told that the design has been frowned upon by a few people within City hall and being that it will be the tallest office building it should surpass the Sussex in quality and design. And even I don't think it does not even close...mind you the rendering is quite abstract.

[Phil McAvity]

Remember this picture guys?



You'll regret posting it very shortly.

Why? Well here we go. It was built by Oceanco which is a Dutch and South African company that builds very large yachts. How large you ask? Well, that 170 footer in the picture (called "Sunrise" by the way) is one of their smaller yachts. There has only been one other Oceanco to ever moor here. A couple of years ago "Lady Lola" stayed here for a few days, which was an average-sized Oceanco, at 205 feet long. It had a swimming pool, helicopter landing pad, waterfall and a golf driving range on it. That's right, the owner used to actually drive golf balls off the top of his yacht into the ocean. While Victoria has hosted larger yachts than Lady Lola, few have been more luxurious.

And no, i don't know who owns it. Nor do i care.

Twoface, you were right about both yachtmakers, but wrong about both yachts. The height-limit breaking sailboat is in fact an Alloy yacht, but smaller than 159 foot "Georgia" (which has also been here before). It is the 134 foot "Destination Fox Harb'r". As i've said, the motoryacht is Oceanco's 170 foot "Sunrise".

It's kind of ironic that we are having this big discussion about this yacht, since there have already been three yachts larger than it visit us this summer.

Holden, your repetitive use of the word yacht reminded me of what a bizarre language English is. Did you know that the cofounder of Microsoft has bought lots of yachts, although he has never been caught on a yacht with any pot. The pronunciation of these words is the exact same, in spite of their completely different spellings;

bought
pot
caught
lot
yacht

I'd say that's enough digressing for now.

[The Great Scaper]

Hey I forgot you were into boats!!! Cool.

Aastra, you still coming over this weekend?

[aastra]

I'm here now. I'll let you know what my schedule is like ASAP.

[The Great Scaper]

Cool, call me anytime! It'll be cool to hang out. I told Zoomer I'd call him as soon as I heard from you, also it's Dylan's Birthday this weekend too.

[The Great Scaper]

For photos like these, Check out the Victoria photo thread...I am going to start posting them all there now.....





Cheers

[gumgum]

I watched that big-ass orange mofo drive by as I was taking pictures of Parkside this morning.

[The Great Scaper]

For some reason this got double posted....hmm strange.

Gum Gum ....

That crane was massive. Really impressive!!!

I also got some awesome photos from Canada Day too. Wow what an awesome night! So much fun! I'm going to post them in the Vic photo thread.

[Phil McAvity]

Originally Posted by m0nkyman

Fourteen was so silly that getting twenty was basically a gimme. Having had a blanket increase given makes a twenty storey a lot more politically difficult. Point blank, Crystal View ain't going to make it to twenty because of this IMNSHO.

I'd have much preferred to have seen a process or a set of requirements clearly laid out for what qualifies a project for a density bonus, instead of another hard limit we get to fight in a few years.

Once again, i ask, why do we even have a height limit?

The only purpose i can see is to blackmail developers.

Who determined that 143 feet/43.5 metres was the "correct" maximum height for a building in Victoria? And how did they arrive at that figure? The only possible explanation i can think of, is that it is the height of George Vancouver on top of the legislature, and in order to not overshadow Georgy boy, (like the height limit in Ottawa to insure nothing overshadows Parliament) we have this limit. That makes a lot more sense to me than the official explanation-which is none. There is no official reason for it. Worse yet, it's not even really official, as many developers have skirted around the height limit over the years by paying off the socialist club (city council) in the form of public amenities. So, the only reason to have a height limit is basically to blackmail developers into providing public amenities they would probably rather not be on the hook for. City Hall should be providing public amenities, not developers. Why else are we paying billions in taxes, if not for the public good? As it is, each building gets considered on it's own merits before city council, so why have something as meaningless and arbitrary as a height limit?

And why are people so concerned with how tall buildings are in Victoria anyway? Why is it any of their business? I really don't think most people that are concerned about tall buildings are in the business of building them, nor are they in the market to buy a suite, so why do they care? Are they really so bored that they need to champion a cause, any cause?


Having said all that, i'm glad that the arbitrary number has been raised. It's a move in the right direction towards eventually eliminating it.

[The Great Scaper]

Phil McAvity:

Being an ultra Conservative I agree with you in theory. Though I am not against bonus density for the City negotiating extra amenities for it's self and the public. This to me is good business. Especially in Victoria where 12 other municipalities don't give a rats ass what happens downtown. For until they do I believe it's the only way the City will be able to provide such public amenities such as an art gallery or a performing arts center, since the City of Victoria (proper) holds just around 20 percent of the population of the CRD and doesn't have the tax base to it themselves. So if a developer wishes to build 25 stories then they can provide the city with a gift for the extra height and density. I also believe in a good design panel. I am extremely happy with the quality of buildings that are going up in Victoria. So with out some sort of City involvement over bonus density, design, land use, etc. development would be chaotic. The Falls is a perfect example, through the ADP the building in the end will be even that much better, with brass lighted art work in store entrance ways etc. Even Westbank agrees to this. However the process to get there was retarded. This all could have been achieved in one design panel meeting, not three. And the Falls should not have taken 2 years to complete a development process. The city needs to have a clear cut guideline to assist developers in their developments. Also they need to speed up the process. They also need to reward the developers who are upping the quality of projects and the ones who give good amenity packages for their proposals. Whether it's rebuilding buildings like the Bay, or the Janiun Building, or giving an Art Gallery, or a Performing arts center. The City needs to learn to work with the developer in a good partnership.

One thing I believe is that the city has come a long way from where they were five years ago. But they have a long way to go.