How would you rank Canada's 5 most important cities?

[geotag277]

1. Montreal - Canada's city, without which nothing exists. Toronto may have more people and a larger economy largely propped up by finance and real estate, but Montreal will always be the heart of the country - economic, social, influence, and dynamism.

2. Quebec City (La Citadelle, need I say more?)

3. Port Moody BC - last stake in the railway which would take BC away from America (otherwise they would assuredly be calling Trump their president)

4. Port aux Basque, NFLD - the terminating point for the NFLD railway, which would be a perennial financial boondoggle that contributed to NFLD joining Canada

5. Fort Garry, MB - seat of the Legislative Assembly of Assiniboia, the resolution of which paved the way for all provinces between BC and Ontario.

[Pinion]

Originally Posted by Acajack

As I said, I am open to differing views but I have a low tolerance level for silliness.

Quebec is posting some of the best economic numbers in the country right now. But it would be silliness to claim that this makes us overtaking Ontario (even a remote) possibility at any point in the future.

Vancouver passing Montreal is similar silliness.

Vancouver passing Montreal is no sillier than you thinking Alberta will pass BC (both are possible). And you clearly aren't open to differing views and are taking this personally.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Pinion

Vancouver passing Montreal is no sillier than you thinking Alberta will pass BC (both are possible). And you clearly aren't open to differing views and are taking this personally.

BC has 500k on Alberta and Montreal has 1.5M on Vancouver.

Alberta's growth rate is almost 4 times that of BC.

Vancouver is growing faster than Montreal but the rate difference isn't even double.

Very different levels of silliness.

[Pinion]

Once again, I never said Vancouver beats Montreal economically. I only said I was having trouble comparing them due to Vancouver's 23 municipalities.

Are you getting Alberta's growth stats from before the oil crash?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Pinion

Once again, I never said Vancouver beats Montreal economically. I only said I was having trouble comparing them due to Vancouver's 23 municipalities.

Are you getting Alberta's growth stats from before the oil crash?

Their population has (surprisingly) not been affected that much by the downturn. Maybe there is a delay in how such things affect migration patterns.

[speedog]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Stuff like a long historic legacy of dominating national politics does matter. Montreal is also an intensely politicized city whereas Toronto is far less so and is more preoccupied with other matters.

Montreal is also closer to Ottawa in addition to being much more bilingual which also make Montrealers more natural "fits" for federal politics.

Where are all the PMs from Toronto over the past 50 years? The last true Torontonian to live at 24 Sussex was Lester B. Pearson.

Really?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by geotag277

1. Montreal - Canada's city, without which nothing exists. Toronto may have more people and a larger economy largely propped up by finance and real estate, but Montreal will always be the heart of the country - economic, social, influence, and dynamism.

.

This is absolutely how things feel to me, but I resist truly coming to that conclusion as I realize my view is tainted by being a francophone living in Quebec. Though it's true that some people from outside Quebec also share this view.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by speedog

Really?

Care to name any others? Do you want to claim (give away) Stephen Harper for Toronto?

[speedog]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Care to name any others? Do you want to claim (give away) Stephen Harper for Toronto?

What does where a PM might have been born or came from have to do with a city's importance?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by speedog

What does where a PM might have been born or came from have to do with a city's importance?

Uhh he's the most powerful person politically in the country...

If we are talking political importance that matters quite a bit. It also goes beyond politics arguably.

[Ramako]

Originally Posted by geotag277

1. Montreal - Canada's city, without which nothing exists. Toronto may have more people and a larger economy largely propped up by finance and real estate, but Montreal will always be the heart of the country - economic, social, influence, and dynamism.

Originally Posted by Acajack

This is absolutely how things feel to me, but I resist truly coming to that conclusion as I realize my view is tainted by being a francophone living in Quebec. Though it's true that some people from outside Quebec also share this view.

Objectively speaking, how could Montreal possibly be social heart of the country and more influential than Toronto when its culture and language is distinct from most of the country? You really think the average person in Vancouver, Calgary or Halifax has more connections with Montreal than Toronto?

And I don't know how anyone could even begin to argue that Montreal is more important economically than Toronto. There are countless objective metrics that would contradict that.

Originally Posted by Acajack

Where are all the PMs from Toronto over the past 50 years? The last true Torontonian to live at 24 Sussex was Lester B. Pearson.

That's your metric? Here's a more important consideration; no Prime Minister can be elected without support from the GTA. That can't be said of Montreal:

[Architype]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Uhh he's the most powerful person politically in the country...

If we are talking political importance that matters quite a bit. It also goes beyond politics arguably.

But in the US very few presidents have come from New York City, only two.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Ramako

Objectively speaking, how could Montreal possibly be social heart of the country and more influential than Toronto when its culture and language is distinct from most of the country? You really think the average person in Vancouver, Calgary or Halifax has more connections with Montreal than Toronto?

And I don't know how anyone could even begin to argue that Montreal is more important economically than Toronto. There are countless objective metrics that would contradict that.





That's your metric? Here's a more important consideration; no Prime Minister can be elected without support from the GTA. That can't be said of Montreal:

I said that there were intangibles that made Montréal pull even with Toronto in political influence. Not that Montreal was ahead of Toronto on this metric.

I also admitted that I was probably biased wrt to what geotag said.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Stuff like a long historic legacy of dominating national politics does matter. Montreal is also an intensely politicized city whereas Toronto is far less so and is more preoccupied with other matters.

Montreal is also closer to Ottawa in addition to being much more bilingual which also make Montrealers more natural "fits" for federal politics.

Where are all the PMs from Toronto over the past 50 years? The last true Torontonian to live at 24 Sussex was Lester B. Pearson.

As long as the PM does what Toronto tells him to do, there's little incentive for Torontonians to actually move to Ottawa (shudder!).

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Architype

But in the US very few presidents have come from New York City, only two.

No US city produces modern-day presidents like Montréal produces Canadian PMs.

[Architype]

The importance of a city within a country or internationally can really only be measured in terms of GDP or population, things like political or cultural influence are subjective and cannot really be measured accurately.

1. Toronto
2. Montreal
3. Vancouver
4. Calgary
5. Ottawa

(no surprises)

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

As long as the PM does what Toronto tells him to do, there's little incentive for Torontonians to actually move to Ottawa (shudder!).

This is quite true, even if there is always a bit of give and take.

[Architype]

Originally Posted by Acajack

No US city produces modern-day presidents like Montréal produces Canadian PMs.

It has more to do with the French Canadian vote being politically important in Canada than the importance of Montreal as a city. That Montreal is no. 2 anyway is of little consequence.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Architype

The importance of a city within a country or internationally can really only be measured in terms of GDP or population, things like political or cultural influence are subjective and cannot really be measured accurately.

1. Toronto
2. Montreal
3. Vancouver
4. Calgary
5. Ottawa

This is quite right. We are just debating the question as framed.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by Acajack

This is quite true, even if there is always a bit of give and take.

Indeed. Bay St gives it* and Canada's PM generally grins and takes it. And nobody's any the wiser.

* "it" being his marching orders, if that wasn't clear.