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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 3:27 AM
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Québec's influence elsewhere in Canada and around the world

We often discuss differences between Quebec and the rest of Canada. But how is Quebec in general seen by you, by the people where you live and what influence does the province have on you and where you live?

The influence could be cultural, artistic, political, economic, business, societal and more. I'd like to hear from others before I answer.

If you live in Quebec, tell us what others thought of you or how you were treated when travelling in the rest of Canada or in another country when you said you are from Québec.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 3:36 AM
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Amos 5:13
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 3:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Loco101 View Post
We often discuss differences between Quebec and the rest of Canada. But how is Quebec in general seen by you, by the people where you live and what influence does the province have on you and where you live?

The influence could be cultural, artistic, political, economic, business, societal and more. I'd like to hear from others before I answer.

If you live in Quebec, tell us what others thought of you or how you were treated when travelling in the rest of Canada or in another country when you said you are from Québec.
Based on the west coast. I do business with a number of Montreal based businesses. Generally I say a bit more relaxed than Toronto, in many ways more of a west coast business style with a french flare to it.

I notice many creative people (Software developers among others) on the west coast view Montreal as "the other option" of where to go and work/live. Generally view is it is more artistic and culturally interesting that the rest of Eastern Canada. Especially the case with millennials.

Some people view Quebec as a bit spoiled, asking for more than its fair share financially. No one questions Quebec has some unique cultural and linguistic considerations that as a society it is free to encourage and develop. They question why it should get more money than other regions of the country or the federal government gets dragged into academic constitutional discussion when there are other concrete issues that impact the lives of Canadians in and outside of Quebec.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 3:45 AM
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Originally Posted by kwoldtimer View Post
Amos 5:13
very funny.

I love going to Quebec, have been in all regions there except Nunavik (far-North) so I'm not trying to encourage negativity or hateful remarks. I'm hoping to read many positive comments and don't consider this thread to be a taboo subject.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 3:46 AM
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Based on the west coast. I do business with a number of Montreal based businesses. Generally I say a bit more relaxed than Toronto, in many ways more of a west coast business style with a french flare to it.

I notice many creative people (Software developers among others) on the west coast view Montreal as "the other option" of where to go and work/live. Generally view is it is more artistic and culturally interesting that the rest of Eastern Canada. Especially the case with millennials.

Some people view Quebec as a bit spoiled, asking for more than its fair share financially. No one questions Quebec has some unique cultural and linguistic considerations that as a society it is free to encourage and develop. They question why it should get more money than other regions of the country or the federal government gets dragged into academic constitutional discussion when there are other concrete issues that impact the lives of Canadians in and outside of Quebec.
Thanks for your comment. I really enjoyed reading your view from a personal/business perspective.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 3:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Loco101 View Post
We often discuss differences between Quebec and the rest of Canada. But how is Quebec in general seen by you, by the people where you live and what influence does the province have on you and where you live?

The influence could be cultural, artistic, political, economic, business, societal and more. I'd like to hear from others before I answer.

If you live in Quebec, tell us what others thought of you or how you were treated when travelling in the rest of Canada or in another country when you said you are from Québec.
Vancouver-area: Quebec is a source of ski bums, "dirtbag climbers" and outdoorsy young people who don't have steady jobs.

Toronto inner city: Montreal is a cool place to go for the weekend on Porter. You have friends who moved [back] there and work in something art-related. You went there and you marveled at the size of their apartment. Your knowledge of Quebec falls off the map east of St. Denis Blvd.

Toronto suburbs: Montreal is where some members of your Italian/Jewish/Arab/Greek family live, also in suburbs.

There's a Quebecois manager at your work who interfaces with Quebec/French-speaking clients. He's a fiscal conservative, buttoned down type who drives a leased Audi SUV to work and lives in a white collar subdivision in Aurora. He embodies even more of a Toronto corporate stereotype than Anglo Torontonians ever could.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 3:54 AM
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Quebec is so close to Ottawa that It is safe to say it is part of the identity of this city. I’ve been in Ontario long enough that I started feeling more at home in Ontario than in Quebec for quite some time now.

If asked, I will tell people I grew up in Quebec (some people think I am Franco ontarian). Other than that I never really talk about it. I don’t see why I would really. And it doesn’t make a difference if people know I grew up there, nobody ever made a sneaky remark about it.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 3:56 AM
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I don't expect Quebec to be influential in the US or in Europe. Maybe in Vermont or in France, but that's it. I would say, maybe Montréal, but not Quebec as a whole. in a video about why he chose Montréal instead, some guy even said, ''I didn't move to Canada, I moved to Montréal.''

Last edited by GreaterMontréal; Nov 29, 2017 at 4:13 AM.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 5:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Loco101 View Post
If you live in Quebec, tell us what others thought of you or how you were treated when travelling in [...] another country when you said you are from Québec.
It's been years, but in Western continental Europe people considered Quebec and Canada were the exact same thing, so, no difference. "I'm from Canada" and "I'm from Quebec" got you treated 100% the same way.

Note that I can't guarantee this is still true, in this day and age of ever-increading awareness of other places in our global village.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 5:12 AM
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I have lived in Quebec City in the past, so I imagine I have quite a different perspective than many Albertans. There's quite a generational divide as well with younger Albertans being a lot more positive about Quebec, je pense.

Many "traditional" Albertans (older or work in oil and gas) still see Quebec as leaching off of Alberta. It's not uncommon to hear people bringing up transfer payments. This is especially true at times when there's some controversy around the oil industry. IE. Coderre celebrating the cancellation of Energy East project. It is seen as an attack on their identity and are less receptive to anything from Quebec.

Almost nobody speaks French here and many don't understand why the language thing is an issue. Moreover I know a lot of people out west who are frustrated that a lot of federal jobs require one to be bilingual, but it's very tough to become bilingual out here.

Sometimes Quebec is lumped into a "Down East" identity that includes all of Ontario and Quebec. IE. "It doesn't matter how we vote... the bastards down east will decide the election." It's an us vs. them mentality that's not unlike "Quebec vs. ROC".

On a more positive note, lots of people who have visited to Quebec have a different appreciation for the province. I must know 15 people in their 20s that have done the Explore Program who speak super positively of it. Montreal is typically considered as the most fun city.
I think that generally the influence of Quebec is increasing in Alberta chiefly because young people are more open-minded in general than their parents.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 5:14 AM
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A northern NH landowner I got in contact with was prejudiced against me due to his being majorly pissed off at Hydro-Quebec about Northern Pass, that's about the entirety of my negative experiences. I suppose this might also happen in Newfoundland if I visited (being mad at me, an individual, because of that one crown corporation of ours), but I couldn't guess the odds.

I think they're going to bury the lines now, so the opposition is probably a lot less angry than back then.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 5:18 AM
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I would say Quebec's influence west of Ottawa has declined to relative insignificance which makes sense due to its falling share of the national economy and population, as well as its increased insularity since the 70s. Globally, Canada has virtually no influence so how could Quebec. I would imagine that impressions of Quebec would be more common in Europe than elsewhere. In Asia (and Australia), Canada is mostly thought of in terms of British Columbia with small amounts of Banff, Calgary and Toronto. That being said, Disneyland or Vegas probably hold more interest in Asia (and Australia) than would all of Canada.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 5:45 AM
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Quebec's influence has declined in Nova Scotia. For a long time Montreal was the big city young people moved to to 'discover themselves'. People still go there but more now go to Toronto. There were changes on other fronts too. Nova Scotia Expos fans became Blue Jays fans when Montreal lost its team.

Quebec still holds a lot of sway in NS but it's not as strong as it used to be.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 6:09 AM
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Quebec's influence has greatly declined continually since the early 90s.

By the 90s there was no longer a battle about what city was Canada's most dominant, Toronto had solidified it's power at Montreal's expense. Also as other provinces made large gains in population and hence House seats, Quebec's 75 seats were, in relative terms, less significant.

The biggest reason however is also the biggest irony............the separatist movement that was suppose to increase Quebec's power had the opposite effect. It split the vote in Quebec so the days of the Liberals getting every single seat in the province were over and they were represented in the House by a 4th party with little say in the national government of the time. This rang true when Harper got elected with only a handful of Quebec seats..........Quebec was no longer needed to get a majority government.

Also Canadians outside Quebec were feeling much more secure in their own identiy and hence after 2 separation votes it had left a very bad taste in an increasingly confident Canada. The first referendum had the rest of the country in a panic wondering if we could survive without Quebec but not the second. Canadians generally wanted Quebec to stay but no longer at any price and let Quebec know that there would be way more than just financial consequences and Canada was going to play hardball.

That was a watershed moment because for the first time in half a century Quebec's constant threat of separation no longer had any meaning. When your threats become hollow they no longer mean anything and are viewed as more of a childish rant than an ultimatum.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 6:24 AM
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Originally Posted by ChillN View Post
I have lived in Quebec City in the past, so I imagine I have quite a different perspective than many Albertans. There's quite a generational divide as well with younger Albertans being a lot more positive about Quebec, je pense.

Many "traditional" Albertans (older or work in oil and gas) still see Quebec as leaching off of Alberta. It's not uncommon to hear people bringing up transfer payments. This is especially true at times when there's some controversy around the oil industry. IE. Coderre celebrating the cancellation of Energy East project. It is seen as an attack on their identity and are less receptive to anything from Quebec.

Almost nobody speaks French here and many don't understand why the language thing is an issue. Moreover I know a lot of people out west who are frustrated that a lot of federal jobs require one to be bilingual, but it's very tough to become bilingual out here.

Sometimes Quebec is lumped into a "Down East" identity that includes all of Ontario and Quebec. IE. "It doesn't matter how we vote... the bastards down east will decide the election." It's an us vs. them mentality that's not unlike "Quebec vs. ROC".

On a more positive note, lots of people who have visited to Quebec have a different appreciation for the province. I must know 15 people in their 20s that have done the Explore Program who speak super positively of it. Montreal is typically considered as the most fun city.
I think that generally the influence of Quebec is increasing in Alberta chiefly because young people are more open-minded in general than their parents.
Agreed.

Young people in Alberta are generally quite positive, or at least open, to Quebec. Montreal is definitely seen as the "cool city", especially compared to Toronto (though there are young circles that rave about TO too, they tend to be less artsy or hipster-ish). They go there for immersion programs, Osheaga, or just to see the city and I've only met one person who's had a negative experience. Usually the experience ends at Montreal, but some have made it to Quebec City, and also rave about it. It's probably more likely your average Edmontonian has been to Halifax than Quebec City, though.

You nailed the older cohort well, who tend to be more negative about anything east of Winnipeg, but the more "liberal" of the older generations have similar views to millennials/gen Z Albertans. They view Quebec as imposing its values (eg French classes in grade school) on us and have the attitude of "well, if they don't wanna be here, then go!"

There is also the Franco-Albertan community, which includes an enclave of Edmonton around Bonnie Doon and Campus Saint-Jean, who obviously have a good impression of Quebec and French Canada. They tend to have visited Quebec and France and like that they can speak their language more freely.

Quebecois food, especially poutine, has made serious inroads here, also.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 6:28 AM
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Interesting and respectful discussion going on. I like what I read.
My POV : a Québécois born in a region not so far from Montréal, beginning of his 30s.

I'd say that since I started travelling on my own, back in 2003, I've been surprised to see that, sometimes, Québec seems to be better understood in the francosphere than at many places in Canada. I had the chance to travel in some anglo-saxon countries (Germany, UK, NZ, Netherlands, etc.) and to some franco/phone/phile countries (Maroc, France, Suisse, Belgique, Luxembourg, Liban...), amongst others.

In France, where I have a chance to live 6/7 months a year since a couple of years, Québec (and to some extent Acadia) is(are) everywhere. And very few people don't know about it. But I'm stating the obvious. The Maison Québécoise in Saint-Malo, Bretagne ; the Office franco-québécois pour la jeunesse ; the multiple Québec bookstores in Paris ; the Frite Alors ! restaurants opening in French cities ; Street names ; Historical plaques in many cities, villages.

The most obvious link is pop culture. Singers or bands such as Garou, Natasha St-Pier, Lynda Lemay, Claude Dubois, Bruno Pelletier, Misteur Valaire, Alex Nevsky, Peter Peter, Céline Dion, Roch Voisine, Félix Leclerc, Vigneault... People like Gilbert Rozon (sigh), Julie Snyder, Stéphane Rousseau, Wajdi Mouawad, Dany Laferrière, Anne Hébert... Shows such as Le Cirque du Soleil, Les Têtes à Claques, Un gars Une fille, Caméra Café... Theatre in general, a field where Québec is prolific... All of this and much more is just as big in France as their equivalent French counterparts. I've already had arguments with some French about the fact that Un gars Une fille was a Québec concept. I've had arguments with a Moroccan who was born and raised with the humour of François Pérusse, and who believed that Pérusse was Moroccan. Some cultural productions that had a major impact all over the francosphere were the fruit of a France-Québec collaboration, musicals especially : Notre-Dame-de-Paris, StarMania... Movies like CRAZY or Les invasions barbares or Le déclin de l'Empire américain were seen by millions of French. Recently, Xavier Dolan and his movies are everywhere. And some French assume that actors Marc-André Grondin or Marie-Josée Croze are one of them. The singer France Gall (Ella, elle l'a) was born in Montréal, though she became a French 90s pop icon... And the reverse relationship is also observed (French culture in QC). I just had an amazing roadtrip with my Swiss friends in Switzerland back in October, and all along we sang the whole Céline discography, and a lot of Les Cowboys Fringants too. My friend who organizes Les Nuits de Fourvières every year in Lyon is really fond of Nevsky, Salomé Leclerc and others. Les Francofolies. Juste pour rire (sigh). So much to say or to relate.

On the other hand, and like other may have mentioned, when I briefly lived in Germany in 2003-2004, people there generally knew that there was a 'french' and an 'english' Canada. But they assumed that I was english-born. They thought more than often that we had to learn French in school. Same reasoning came up with some of my lebanese acquaintances, to whom I had to explain the basics of canadian geopolitics (as they thought I was an francophile anglo).

When I live in France, I don't feel that 'foreign'. I feel linked by culture, but different due to my obvious "north americanity". And when I go see my extended family in New Brunswick, I feel linked to them by my "north americanity", but not by much else (at least on the Sewell family side).

Last edited by Laceoflight; Nov 29, 2017 at 6:39 AM.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 8:40 AM
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Quebec is more and more visible in France as a study- and emigration-destination.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 10:39 AM
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Quebec's influence here is abstract - I imagine we don't recognize much of it as coming from that province. Unfortunately, the impression of Quebec - while mixed - is, in my estimation, still predominantly negative.

It's almost become a trope for the Opposition in our House of Assembly to accuse the governing party of holding secret discussions with Quebec on some issue. Half the public roll their eyes at the accusation, the other half wonder if it's true, but it is universally understood to be a threatening, negative action were it actually happening.



It's easy to blame on Churchill Falls, but to be honest it seems to have been a common thread throughout our history, especially since the 1600s when the French occupied St. John's and destroyed most of the English and Irish settlements along the Avalon Peninsula. I knew about that before learning it in high school, just through some kind of osmosis. Culturally, we tend to focus on and venerate every loss, humiliation, etc. and Quebec is at the centre of several of them today.

During the Confederation campaign in the 1940s, Confederates tried to minimize Canada's French character, while Nationalists tried to emphasize it. Confederates referred to joining Canada as "British Union", and said Newfoundland's Catholics would see the country a Republic out of the Commonwealth given half a chance. Like FRANCE (the horror). Nationalists replied with posters saying things like, "British Union? With FRENCH Canada?" Prejudiced, probably racist in intent, terms were common at that time. In newspapers, songs, etc. Canadians were referred to as patois, pidgins, creoles, etc. Kind of hilariously ironic given the impression of our accents at that time.


(MUN Archives)

Then there was Churchill Falls. When Danny Williams was elected - our first Premier since joining Canada who actually came from St. John's, and had the city's nationalist views - Canadian newspapers were a little taken aback by it. They were surprised when he floated the idea of making the tricolour our official flag, pulled down the Canadian flag from all provincial government buildings, and openly called Quebec a "bad neighbour", or accused it of "highway robbery", "predatory behaviour", hypocrisy", etc. But all of this has been the norm in St. John's for generations.

And it goes both ways. In polls, Quebec consistently is the province with the most negative view of Newfoundland and Labrador. For example, this one from 2012 - 62% of Canadians had a very or somewhat favourable impression of us, while Quebec was just 38%.

All that said, it is genuinely mixed. People love St-Pierre et Miquelon and, although they turn up their noses a little at Quebec, it's still a positive relationship between us and French people. Montreal has a very good impression. People are proud to say if their clothes or housewares came from there, for example. Visits to other Canadian cities are generally considered more utilitarian, they have to go for work, or healthcare, or some store that isn't here - but Montreal has a romance. It's probably the only province in Canada that attracts urban tourists from Newfoundland (who mainly, of course, go to Europe) - the rest gets adventure, outdoorsy, or sports tourists.

Last week, for example, several coworkers had to go to the Maritimes for a meeting and the one I was wishing a safe trip to wasn't excited to go. "There's nothing I can do there that I can't here." and I said, "Sure load up at IKEA!" and she said "I already went over last month for that." And then she said she'd rather they were meeting in "Montreal or even Toronto." I think that describes the general impression accurately.

Quebec tourists seem to have a good impression. The ones that end up here are generally young, curious, and stay for a while to work in the service industry before returning home. There is definitely an appreciation for Quebec as an influential buffer against much of mainland Canada's right-wing tendencies. There's an appreciation for any devolution Quebec manages to force, but a fierce backlash a la Meech Lake to any perceived special treatment ("They weren't even a country the way we were.", etc.)

People love poutine and know who Roch Voisine, Celine Dion, Cirque Soleil, etc. are. Some of Quebec's history is viewed as instructional here. You'll often see flashes of it in certain things, for example, our government's Speech from the Throne:

2007:

Quote:
Our people are proud nationalists who believe it is only by affirming our identity as Newfoundlanders and Labradorians that we will realize our goal of economic equality within the federation.

Our people are ready to take charge of our future and, under the Premier's leadership, our province will achieve self-reliance by becoming masters of our own house.
2012:

Quote:
Our experience in Confederation with Canada has included some challenges: the stigma of being the poorest province in the union, the bitterness of the Upper Churchill injustice, the resentment of a decimated fishery and the anger of not having our voice heard within the federation.

However, today represents a significant shift in our relationship with the federal government. We are now a full partner in the federation of Canada.
So that's some significant influence.
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 12:48 PM
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Unfortunately, all of my experience with Quebec in the 80s were of strippers from Montreal that populated all of the strip clubs down here. We had so many clubs, because of having Detroit right across the border, and most of the strippers were from Montreal, both gay and straight! One of my best friends back then was from Montreal, and she was a stripper.

Nowadays I appreciate Montreal for the amazing city that it is, and I have visited many times in the past two decades!
Quebec City is popular around here too, but not as much as Montreal, and the skiing destinations are also very popular, like Mont Tremblant and Mont St. Anne!

All in all, Quebec and Montreal are looked upon favourably by most in this area!
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Old Posted Nov 29, 2017, 2:11 PM
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That being said, Disneyland or Vegas probably hold more interest in Asia (and Australia) than would all of Canada.
If you prefer ersatz culture, then yes Disneyland is more interesting than Canada.
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