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  #1601  
Old Posted Dec 10, 2017, 2:09 PM
skyscraper skyscraper is offline
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Originally Posted by Domer2019 View Post

Philadelphia: ...Pitt and Carnegie Mellon a hop/skip away
NYC and DC universities are all way closer than those.
Oh, and Princeton too.
     
     
  #1602  
Old Posted Dec 10, 2017, 2:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Domer2019 View Post
Philadelphia: Penn, Villanova, Temple, PSU, Drexel; Pitt and Carnegie Mellon a hop/skip away
Pitt and Carnegie Mellon are not a hop skip and a jump away from Philly (5 hours or so). Unfortunately for both cities there is not much of a symbiosis between the cities, culturally or economically. PSU is also pretty far (3.5 hour drive) but so many of it's students come from the Philadelphia area that it should be on any list here.

There are many other really good schools that are within an hour or so of Philadelphia though, Princeton, Lehigh, University of Delaware, Rutgers to name a few, and a ton more if you expand the area to a 3 hour drive. Amazon, being a pretty highly sought after employer, would have no problem recruiting in Philadelphia or anywhere in the Bos-Wash corridor for that matter.
     
     
  #1603  
Old Posted Dec 10, 2017, 3:13 PM
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Does anybody on here not want HQ2 in their city?
     
     
  #1604  
Old Posted Dec 10, 2017, 3:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Sun Belt View Post
Does anybody on here not want HQ2 in their city?
I think it would be horrible for where I live (Brooklyn). I'm optimistic about what it would do for where I am from (Detroit).
     
     
  #1605  
Old Posted Dec 10, 2017, 5:20 PM
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I want Amazon to consider Miami or Atlanta just to lead to more economic diversity for the former and denser urban growth for both. Amazon seemed responsible for helping Seattle grow, why not give another city not usually in the limelight a chance? I would even vouch for Detroit, Chicago, or a Canadian city.

I really don't want them to consider an already expensive city like NYC or Boston. That would be adding insult to injury
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  #1606  
Old Posted Dec 10, 2017, 5:30 PM
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Can y'all at least ignore the thread for a day and go enjoy the snow outside?
     
     
  #1607  
Old Posted Dec 10, 2017, 8:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Sun Belt View Post
Does anybody on here not want HQ2 in their city?
A couple people here from the Bay Area have said they do not want it.
     
     
  #1608  
Old Posted Dec 10, 2017, 9:28 PM
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Originally Posted by James Bond Agent 007 View Post
A couple people here from the Bay Area have said they do not want it.
I would imagine they know its not a possibility.
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  #1609  
Old Posted Dec 10, 2017, 10:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Sun Belt View Post
Does anybody on here not want HQ2 in their city?
I don't........

As I stated earlier in this thread pages upon pages ago, Denver is booming enough as it is without Amazon, and will probably continue without Amazon. Having them come here will just turn everything up a notch and it will become next to impossible for some of us to ever own anything in the city.
     
     
  #1610  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2017, 1:27 AM
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I don't want it in Flagstaff because we've got enough problems as it is with Californians moving in (mostly college kids causing a housing crisis for those of us who live here year-round) but I doubt Flagstaff was ever in the running, much less submitted a proposal.
     
     
  #1611  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2017, 2:50 AM
skyscraperpage17 skyscraperpage17 is offline
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RE: The Gulch in Atlanta

The developers did confirm the recent details released about their plans for the site (completion is expected by 2027), including the $10 million impact study, are related to Amazon HQ2.

https://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/...orward-as.html
     
     
  #1612  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2017, 6:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sun Belt View Post
Does anybody on here not want HQ2 in their city?
I know a lot of people in the Twin Cities don't want it (including me).

On a side note, I totally don't get why Denver (with it's very high quality of life and excellent, growing transit system) is not mentioned more often as a major contender.
     
     
  #1613  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2017, 6:06 PM
IrishIllini IrishIllini is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skyscraperpage17 View Post
RE: The Gulch in Atlanta

The developers did confirm the recent details released about their plans for the site (completion is expected by 2027), including the $10 million impact study, are related to Amazon HQ2.

https://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/...orward-as.html
Your post makes it seem like Amazon has chosen this site and the developer is pursuing entitlements on their behalf. The site is being pitched to Amazon. Amazon has not selected the site for HQ2.

How would this site work for the first wave of jobs? Isn't Amazon looking for 500k SF of space immediately?
     
     
  #1614  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2017, 6:33 PM
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Originally Posted by creamcityleo79 View Post
I know a lot of people in the Twin Cities don't want it (including me).

On a side note, I totally don't get why Denver (with it's very high quality of life and excellent, growing transit system) is not mentioned more often as a major contender.
Yeah Denver seems to make sense. Big airport with a rail connection, growing Light Rail network, known for it's healthy lifestyle, tons and tons of land along the front range that could absorb 50,000 new workers.
     
     
  #1615  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2017, 8:06 PM
IrishIllini IrishIllini is offline
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Originally Posted by Sun Belt View Post
Yeah Denver seems to make sense. Big airport with a rail connection, growing Light Rail network, known for it's healthy lifestyle, tons and tons of land along the front range that could absorb 50,000 new workers.
I think Denver is too small. I think that people need to really look at how great a force of change Amazon was for Seattle. Denver's MSA is 1,000,000 people smaller than Seattle's. Denver already has housing affordability issues.

https://www.bizjournals.com/denver/n...ooking-to.html.

Traffic congestion is worsening. These are the exact issues that Amazon is looking to avoid. Denver is more conducive for building new housing than Seattle, but it's not adding the kind of housing (MF - and LOTS of it) to keep pace with the current demand plus the demand of 50,000+ new residents. Denver has transit, but it's not at the level it could or should be. Newer office towers in downtown Denver have been built with onsite parking. It's an uphill battle to get Americans to ditch their cars even when parking is not super convenient. It's impossible when you're catering to drivers by offering onsite parking in most of your downtown office towers.

We're over 1,600 posts into this thread. By this point, we've heard everyone's piece. From the research I have done, I believe Chicago, Philadelphia, and Atlanta to be the three front runners. I think Chicago and Philadelphia have the edge over Atlanta when looking exclusively at the RFP. They're affordable with room the grow while remaining so, lots of available talent, and have excellent transit networks within their cities and between their cores and suburbs. I haven't looked much into Philadelphia and Atlanta's incentive packages, but I'm sure the three cities are competitive with one another. Atlanta's recent boom and built environment make it the least capable of my three front runners of absorbing 50,000+ new employees.
     
     
  #1616  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2017, 8:23 PM
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Originally Posted by IrishIllini View Post
I think Denver is too small. I think that people need to really look at how great a force of change Amazon was for Seattle. Denver's MSA is 1,000,000 people smaller than Seattle's. Denver already has housing affordability issues.
It could be too small, (it does have a bigly airport) but everything about Denver seems to be going in the right direction and it's still far more affordable than the coasts, although that is changing rather quickly.


Quote:
We're over 1,600 posts into this thread. By this point, we've heard everyone's piece. From the research I have done, I believe Chicago, Philadelphia, and Atlanta to be the three front runners.
All good cities IMO. How were you able to eliminate Dallas or other TX cities or even Raleigh/Durham? Or if you had a top 5, would they be in there at 4 and 5?
     
     
  #1617  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2017, 10:51 PM
IrishIllini IrishIllini is offline
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I think we're putting too big an emphasis on airports. Atlanta, Chicago, Dallas, and Philadelphia have bigger/better connected airports and significantly larger populations. I believe Denver is the most expensive non-coastal real estate market in the country. It's definitely more expensive than Atlanta, Chicago, Dallas, and Philadelphia.

I think Denver's transit is just okay. It's better than some other US systems out there, but it's far from great. I doubt we'll ever know a world where RTD is a peer of MTA/CTA/SEPTA/DC Metro. Does anyone know what the timetables are like for Denver's light rail? Do the trains run 10-15 minutes apart?

Dallas would definitely be in my top 5. It's certainly my first out for top 3. From my perspective, Dallas has all the issues Atlanta does. There is an existing unmet demand for housing, transit is effectively nonexistent, and traffic congestion has worsened considerably. Adding 50,000+ employees to the mix would make a poor planning situation worse. I also feel that Dallas/anywhere in TX outside of Austin isn't a great cultural fit for Amazon. This is off topic, but I'm interested to see what course Dallas charts moving forward now that it's facing the affordability issues of more established metros. Two of my closest friends are currently in Dallas and will likely be moving back to Chicago within the next few years. They found themselves in Dallas due to a job transfer, but were open to the idea of raising a family there because they believed the housing was dirt cheap. They've now realized housing is no cheaper in Dallas and they have no support network for when they ultimately do have kids.

Raleigh and Durham are too small. At a minimum, Amazon needs to be in a region that is just as large as Seattle. They'd be wiser to go bigger IMO.
     
     
  #1618  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2017, 11:02 PM
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Raleigh and Durham are too small. At a minimum, Amazon needs to be in a region that is just as large as Seattle. They'd be wiser to go bigger IMO.
That was a good reply, this is the only follow up I have. Why would Amazon necessarily need to be in a region that is currently larger than Seattle? NC has been on a high growth rate that could match other metros within the next few decades.
     
     
  #1619  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2017, 11:03 PM
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Denver's transit is far from perfect, but it's grown a lot in recent years. The train from the airport can get you to Union Station in downtown in 35-40 minutes and runs every 15 minutes. Light rail runs every 10-15 min through various parts of the metro. The bus service that runs from Union Station to Boulder runs every 15 min, which 10 minute interval express services during rush hours.

Denver's airport has a TON of room for expansion. In fact, there are plans in the works to expand our airport from 101? gates to nearly 140 gates. Our cost of living is definitely on the upswing though......
     
     
  #1620  
Old Posted Dec 12, 2017, 1:23 AM
IrishIllini IrishIllini is offline
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Originally Posted by Sun Belt View Post
That was a good reply, this is the only follow up I have. Why would Amazon necessarily need to be in a region that is currently larger than Seattle?
Hiring people is not easy IME. Amazon won't have an issue getting people to relocate for them, but being in a city with a larger population would likely make the launch run more smoothly. There would be a larger pool of candidates to apply enabling Amazon to offer fewer relocation packages, which would potentially save $$$ on recruitment while also avoiding staffing the new HQ with tens of thousands of fresh transplants. A new job, at a new HQ, in a new city is a big change. The turnover risks are going to be even more elevated than they would otherwise.

Amazon also avoids becoming the "town factory" if they choose a larger city. 50,000 jobs in Raleigh has got to make them the largest employer in North Carolina. I assume that's also true of Colorado should they locate in Denver.

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NC has been on a high growth rate that could match other metros within the next few decades.
Nothing last forever. US population growth is slowing. Immigration is slowing. Birth rates are below replacement. We're getting old. Fast. There are also indications that people, specifically young people, are less mobile than in the past.

There was discussion a while back in one of the Chicago threads about domestic migration. Illinois' population has declined something like 0.5% since 2013 and there was some discussion as to why. Someone (I believe Marothisu?) did some digging and what he found was interesting to me.

People born in Illinois were statistically less likely to leave their home state than the national average. Illinois' out migration numbers are high because Chicagoland is a port of entry for many immigrants. Immigrants are more mobile than Americans and are more likely to explore opportunities out of state. In the past, there were enough births to offset outbound migrants and deaths. In recent years, births have not been able to keep pace with outbound migrants and rising deaths. Illinois isn't often a net gainer of domestic migrants, but that gap has been exasperated by the fact that Americans are less mobile, resulting in small declines in population for a graying state like Illinois and eventually country like the US. Unless we see a massive spike in birth rates (unlikely) or bring in more immigrants (more plausible, still unlikely), the US will likely go in to population decline in the near-ish future. Given we're becoming increasingly rooted and on the precipice of population decline, hitting double digit growth YoY is going to be a lot more challenging. With fewer births and people less willing to relocate, it may not be realistic that Raleigh grow to become a metro of 5m+.

Last edited by IrishIllini; Dec 12, 2017 at 1:46 AM.
     
     
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