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  #43101  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2017, 1:33 AM
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One more thing...


I find this a little hard to believe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by "ethereal_reality"
In 2002, the engineers found that the extra support had been installed with a full inch of space between it and the actual bridge.
For 90 years, the pillar never actually supported the structure at all." -South Pasadena Patch
The quote seems to imply the one inch gap was planned.

If it was planned, did the designers expect the bridge to settle onto the extra pillar?
Did the extra pillar settle instead?
Were the bridge and pillar touching when the pillar was first installed?



Last edited by ethereal_reality; Aug 13, 2017 at 1:50 AM.
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  #43102  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2017, 2:05 AM
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A couple snapshots recently found on ebay.

"Irma and Bill at Venice 1936"


ebay



_______



The seller also had this one.

"1930's Steve's Eats sign LOS ANGELES-VENICE CA"


ebay

poor Steve looks a little worn out..
__

Last edited by ethereal_reality; Aug 13, 2017 at 2:21 AM.
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  #43103  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2017, 4:29 AM
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Mystery Building

This photo is titled, "Los Angeles residence across the street from the Pio Pico House." However, the frame of the photo (which I
cut off) is stamped "Plaza Photograph Gallery, Opposite Pico House," so the photo's title is a misinterpretation of that information.
The building looks to me like a small hotel, but I have no idea where it was. Does anyone recognize it?



UCLA/Islandora


Here's an enlargement of the tower, presumably part of the same building that's in front:




Here are the men gathered around the entrance:

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  #43104  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2017, 5:27 AM
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More Oaklawn Bridge

Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality View Post
I don't believe the Oaklawn Bridge has made an appearance NLA.

It linked the South Pasadena Oaklawn housing development to the main thoroughfare, Fair Oaks Avenue. The graceful reinforced concrete structure
spanned the Atchison, Topeka and Santa Fe rail line, a cycleway (some say it was the elevated cycleway), and a private roadway. The bridge
consisted of five gently arcing shallow-radius spans totaling 340 feet.


http://greeneandgreene.usc.edu/251.html

Built in 1906, it is the only bridge designed by Greene & Greene.

But the bridge developed cracks almost immediately after completion. The railroads demanded that another pillar be added to ensure structural integrity.
The Greenes insisted that the structure was sound exactly the way it was, but the railroads prevailed and a very inelegant pillar was installed." -J. Jakobson

Oh, and one last thing, it turns out the Greene & Greene brothers were correct about the bridge's structural integrity.

In 2002, when the City of South Pasadena undertook the painstaking task of repairing and restoring the historic bridge, engineers finally vindicated
what the Greenes had known all along: the unsightly pillar had been unnecessary. In fact, when engineers examined the construction, they found
that the support had been installed with a full inch of space between it and the actual bridge. In 90 years, the pillar had been an eyesore,
but never actually supported the structure at all."
-South Pasadena Patch

Thanks to J. Jakobson

__
Thank you for showing us this marvelous old bridge, e_r. The cracks shown in the photo of the bridge below might
have been "enhanced" by the art department a bit, but obviously there was concern at the time about the bridge:





March 15, 1907, Los Angeles Times @ ProQuest via LAPL


I could not find a later article that talked about the added pillar. Maybe someone else might have better luck.
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  #43105  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2017, 6:29 AM
Lorendoc Lorendoc is offline
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Temple St. housing

Here is a view of tenements at "477 Temple St" in Los Angeles per Calisphere.

calisphere.org

The Hall of Justice and the City Hall look down disapprovingly.

A little digging with Sanborn maps shows there was no 477 Temple, but there was a 447 W Temple that lined up with the Hall of Justice and City Hall as seen in the photo. Today these slums have been replaced with the Queen of Angels campus.

Last edited by Lorendoc; Aug 13, 2017 at 6:40 AM.
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  #43106  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2017, 1:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality View Post


http://dpg.lib.berkeley.edu/webdb/gg...C-Oaklawn-7134

"Deflection 1/8", I wonder what that means?
I assume that the arch of the bridge moved by 1/8" under load.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality View Post

...

The quote seems to imply the one inch gap was planned.

If it was planned, did the designers expect the bridge to settle onto the extra pillar?
Did the extra pillar settle instead?
Were the bridge and pillar touching when the pillar was first installed?
Maybe the designers of the support had heard about Sir Christopher Wren's architectural "joke" at the 1690 Guildhall in Windsor, England. From inel.wordpress.com:
On close inspection you will notice that the central columns do not touch the ceiling and tradition has it that the councillors of the time, against Wren’s wishes, insisted on the columns in the interest of safety. Wren, not to be outdone, left the columns an inch short of the ceiling.
The building's still standing over 300 years later, although fillets have apparently now been added in the gaps.
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  #43107  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2017, 3:25 PM
Tourmaline Tourmaline is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorendoc View Post
Here is a view of tenements at "477 Temple St" in Los Angeles per Calisphere.

calisphere.org

The Hall of Justice and the City Hall look down disapprovingly.

A little digging with Sanborn maps shows there was no 477 Temple, but there was a 447 W Temple that lined up with the Hall of Justice and City Hall as seen in the photo. Today these slums have been replaced with the Queen of Angels campus.



Although I can't immediately locate it, I believe we have seen a larger version of this image (attributed to Ansel Adams) on NLA.


Similar?
http://jpg2.lapl.org/spnb1/00017229.jpg




How about an undated images of "Fickett Hollow?"

http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics28/00033665.jpghttp://



More Fickett Hollow
http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics28/00033662.jpg


Fickett Hollow Honorable Mention
http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics28/00033660.jpg



Undated
Quote:
The McKinney Court with debris strewn in the public area
http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics44/00041963.jpg


Undated
Quote:
Exterior view of wooden slum homes on City land, called "The Colony."
http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics28/00033615.jpg



Undated
Quote:
Slum housing on the site of the future Aliso Village Housing Project, with the Federal Building visible in the background
http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics30/00034569.jpg




Undated
Quote:
A young boy in leather cap and jacket leans against a weather-beaten house. Puddles surround him. The window screen is torn and "Dopey Pepe" is carved into the siding.
http://jpg3.lapl.org/pics34/00066543.jpg




Hewitt Street Apartment
http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics28/00033724.jpg



http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics28/00033684.jpg



1944 [Way] Out house
http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics28/00033563.jpg



Quote:
Father O'Doyle leads a slum tour for the Council of Catholic Women. An Orthodox church abuts wooden frame houses in a poor neighborhood in Los Angeles
1940's
http://jpg3.lapl.org/pics34/00066562.jpg




1948 Seismically relaxed construction
http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics28/00033640.jpg



1948 Image is described as "Lean-to slum housing in the San Fernando City Dump." Unclear exactly what is depicted.
http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics28/00033717.jpg



1948
Quote:
Interior view of slum dwelling (appears to be a trailer) of Simon P. Mendoza. Address is given by photographer as the San Fernando City Dump.
(Could this have been a repurposed street car?)
http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics28/00033718.jpg



1950
Quote:
Matching Victorian houses used as slum dwellings on Bunker Hill
http://jpg2.lapl.org/spnb1/00017238.jpg
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  #43108  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2017, 3:51 PM
Tourmaline Tourmaline is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality View Post
Several more of the demolition of the courthouse in 1936-1937.



usc digital archive


Below: This building was massive.....notice the workmen on the roof and the truncated tower.



usc digital archive

1936 Workmen dismantle old courthouse


http://digitallibrary.usc.edu/cdm/co...oll44/id/64061
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  #43109  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2017, 5:03 PM
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Oaklawn Bridge comparison

Contemporary Bing Maps photo looking south (Fair Oaks is on the left):





August 9, 1937, looking south (Fair Oaks is again on the left). I think we see the added pillar between the tracks:



Flight C_4666, Frame 51 @ UCSB
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  #43110  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2017, 6:10 PM
Martin Pal Martin Pal is offline
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I enjoyed this 3 1/2 minute video I happened upon:

Legendary Hollywood location scout Lori Balton shares her favorite hidden Los Angeles gems,
some of which aren't available to the everyday public.


http://www.cnn.com/videos/travel/201...orth-watching/


Includes: Pico House, Palace Theatre, Clifton's Cafeteria, Heritage Square
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  #43111  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2017, 7:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyingwedge View Post
August 9, 1937, looking south (Fair Oaks is on the left). I think we see the added pillar between the tracks:



Flight C_4666, Frame 51 @ UCSB
Fantastic find Flyingwedge! You, my friend, have a very good eye.

Doesn't it seem odd that the Oaklawn Bridge isn't more well known considering it's famous designers.
I seriously don't know how it flew under my radar (and I'm a big fan of Greene & Greene)

__


Oh, and one more thing...


http://www.columbia.edu/cu/lweb/eres...DA89-F764.html Greene & Greene drawing #13


Do you suppose this lamp designed for the Oaklawn Bridge was intended for the top of the tall pylon shown below?



gsv from Fair Oaks Ave.


If you look closely there is a metal rod sticking out of the cement where the lamp would have been placed.


gsv detail

_

Last edited by ethereal_reality; Aug 14, 2017 at 12:21 AM.
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  #43112  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2017, 8:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyingwedge View Post
Contemporary Bing Maps photo looking south (Fair Oaks is on the left):





August 9, 1937, looking south (Fair Oaks is again on the left). I think we see the added pillar between the tracks:




Flight C_4666, Frame 51 @ UCSB
Here we see the shadow, in this 1953 aerial, of the added support column which has now been removed. Looking north.


https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4364/...a9f752_o_d.jpg

Last edited by CityBoyDoug; Aug 13, 2017 at 11:03 PM.
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  #43113  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2017, 8:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality View Post
Fantastic find Flyingwedge! You, my friend, have a very good eye.


__


Oh, and one more thing...


http://www.columbia.edu/cu/lweb/eres...DA89-F764.html Greene & Greene drawing #13


Do you suppose this lamp designed for the Oaklawn Bridge was intended for the top of the tall pylon shown below?



gsv from Fair Oaks Ave.


If you look closely there is a metal rod sticking out of the cement where the lamp would have been placed.


gsv detail

_
Yes ER, there used to be a lamp on the pedestal and its been stolen.....that's my theory.
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  #43114  
Old Posted Aug 13, 2017, 10:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tourmaline View Post




1948 (Could this have been a repurposed street car?)
http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics28/00033718.jpg
Yes. It looks to be a former Los Angeles Railway Standard. These were called "California" cars because they had a closed section in the center and an open section at each end. The latter made possible by our "mild" California weather.

The photographer is standing in what was one of the open sections and is shooting into the closed section, note the rudimentary effort to board up the a portion of the open section on the left using cardboard. These were all wooden cars and groups of older examples were phased out as newer, all steel cars were acquired. The bodies made inexpensive diners, summer cottages and chicken coops.

The photo below is one of two LARY Standards that for almost a half century were part of the "Cafe Dining Cars" restaurant on U.S. 101 in Buellton, CA.

[IMG][/IMG]

Cheers,
Jack

Last edited by Wig-Wag; Aug 13, 2017 at 10:16 PM.
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  #43115  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2017, 12:45 AM
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One of my email accounts finally got back on its feet after several days (I think the provider was under cyber-attack), and I find--funneled through my publisher--the following message which I'll quote nearly in full because it compliments me (me? Narcissistic? What could you be thinking?):

"I am looking for Brent C. Dickerson, who wrote a fabulous piece on Downtown Los Angeles, street by street, building by building. We are looking for some history on a tunnel that is not on record called the Frank C. Court Tunnel aka “Angelus Court.” And there was a walkway from the Angelus Hotel (which he writes about), which on the 3rd floor bridged over to the building to the north, now demolished H.A. Stack Building and Mason Building. I wanted to reach out to him and see if he knew anything about the underground tunnel, or bridge from one building to another."

Do the wise and learned Noirishers, wiser than myself, have any information on the Frank C. Court Tunnel and/or walkway with which I can regale my querier?
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  #43116  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2017, 3:05 AM
ProphetM ProphetM is offline
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Being a Route 66 buff, I was aware of the Oaklawn Bridge as one of the historic structures along the route (Fair Oaks Ave.) and I stopped by in March 2015 to take a bunch of pics. These pics begin in my Picasa archive here:

https://get.google.com/albumarchive/...qctnq5p3yWw8_Y

Here are a few of them.


Pacific Electric waiting station, now a bus shelter.


It was built as a car bridge but is rather steep and narrow for that purpose so it is pedestrian-only today.


The War Memorial Building is adjacent.




You can clearly see the soot under which one set of tracks ran, then the white space nearer to camera where the extra support once stood. The other segment of sooty underside is obscured by some attached girders and mesh, which I believe are meant to guard the electrified wires of the Gold Line against ne'er-do-well pedestrians on the bridge.


There is also some lovely drainage construction nearby - not sure if it's original but the river rock construction certainly matches the waiting station.


These benches underneath the bridge also match.

Last edited by ProphetM; Aug 20, 2017 at 4:27 AM.
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  #43117  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2017, 6:16 AM
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Great pix, ProphetM!

_________________________________________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by odinthor View Post
One of my email accounts finally got back on its feet after several days (I think the provider was under cyber-attack), and I find--funneled through my publisher--the following message which I'll quote nearly in full because it compliments me (me? Narcissistic? What could you be thinking?):

"I am looking for Brent C. Dickerson, who wrote a fabulous piece on Downtown Los Angeles, street by street, building by building. We are looking for some history on a tunnel that is not on record called the Frank C. Court Tunnel aka “Angelus Court.” And there was a walkway from the Angelus Hotel (which he writes about), which on the 3rd floor bridged over to the building to the north, now demolished H.A. Stack Building and Mason Building. I wanted to reach out to him and see if he knew anything about the underground tunnel, or bridge from one building to another."

Do the wise and learned Noirishers, wiser than myself, have any information on the Frank C. Court Tunnel and/or walkway with which I can regale my querier?

Well, I don't know about "wise and learned," but I can offer some information that may be of interest to your querier.

Below, from right to left, we have the five-story H. D. Stack Building (formerly the Mason Building) at the SE corner of
4th and Broadway, then the three-story Hulda Block, then 20-foot-wide Frank Court (an alley), then the Angelus Hotel
on the SW corner of 4th and Spring:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyingwedge View Post

4th Street east from Broadway, no date but probably mid-50s:

Huntington Digital Library -- http://hdl.huntington.org/cdm/single.../id/8687/rec/6
Here is the 1906 Sanborn Map, showing the Mason (later Stack) and Hulda buildings, Frank Court (unnamed here but the
1950 Sanborn uses the name, as does Google Map today), and the Angelus. You can see the third-floor inclosed passage
across Frank Court ("INCL. PASSAGE") between the Angelus and the rear of the Hulda. The Angelus has an underground
boiler room (sticking out into Frank Court on the map), and the Mason Building is marked "HEAT FROM ANGELUS HOTEL,"
so there was probably at least a steam tunnel connecting the two buildings. That's 4th Street running along the right edge:



1906 Sanborn @ ProQuest via LAPL


The Hulda Block was built by Mrs. Hulda Behrendt. The building permit was issued on May 20, 1896:



May 21, 1896, Los Angeles Times @ ProQuest via LAPL


By the time she sold her building in 1903, the upper two stories were leased by the Angelus as an annex.
That explains the passage between the two buildings, which is absent from the 1950 Sanborn Map:



April 22, 1903, Los Angeles Times @ ProQuest via LAPL


Here's some more history on the Hulda Block:



August 25, 1957, Los Angeles Times @ ProQuest via LAPL


As interesting as the preceding article may be, please note that 1) the three-story Hulda Building was never LA's tallest, and
2) the city jail on Second Street ("[the] jail, where the Mirror-News Building is now located") closed on August 26, 1896, so
it seems unlikely that gamblers were taken from the Hulda -- which didn't get its BP until May 20, 1896 -- to that jail.


Late Update: There is a June 2, 1932, building permit for the Hulda Block at 218 W. 4th St. to "Brick up opening on third floor
at alley," so that's got to be the end of the passage over Frank Court to the Angelus Hotel.

Last edited by Flyingwedge; Aug 14, 2017 at 6:29 AM. Reason: Add late update
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  #43118  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2017, 6:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProphetM View Post
Being a Route 66 buff, I was aware of the Oaklawn Bridge as one of the historic structures along the route (Fair Oaks Ave.) and I stopped by in March 2015 to take a bunch of pics. These pics begin in my Picasa archive here:

https://photos.google.com/album/AF1Q...qctnq5p3yWw8_Y

.
.....great photos but can't get your album link to work.

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  #43119  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2017, 2:08 PM
Tourmaline Tourmaline is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wig-Wag View Post
Yes. It looks to be a former Los Angeles Railway Standard. These were called "California" cars because they had a closed section in the center and an open section at each end. The latter made possible by our "mild" California weather.

The photographer is standing in what was one of the open sections and is shooting into the closed section, note the rudimentary effort to board up the a portion of the open section on the left using cardboard. These were all wooden cars and groups of older examples were phased out as newer, all steel cars were acquired. The bodies made inexpensive diners, summer cottages and chicken coops.
A change box would have been a nice addition, even as a piggy bank.




Quote:
The old semi-convertible trailer car had been used for 28 years as a dinner in Van Nuys. The Orange Empire Traction Co. bought the trailer car for $500
1959
http://jpg1.lapl.org/00083/00083745.jpg


Um. Yes, some images are not new to NLA


1945 - 2200 block of East Seventh Street
http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics43/00041342.jpg


Undated.
Quote:
Garden of the month winner at Pacific Park, a veterans' trailer park
Familiar landmark in background.
http://jpg2.lapl.org/pics33/00051184.jpg


Undated.
Quote:
Mr. and Mrs. Davis pose with their children in front of their trailer home at Pacific Park.
http://jpg2.lapl.org/pics33/00051182.jpg


1937 Unknown location.
http://jpg2.lapl.org/pics49/00059409.jpg



Quote:
In the 1930s writer Erle Stanley Gardner [Perry Mason] owned a land yacht, a gypsy caravan and a cover[ed] wagon trailer.
http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics50/00044867.jpg



Quote:
A unique city within a city, a trailer park recently set up in Los Angeles is shown at Temple and Alvarado streets on October 18, 1937.
http://jpg1.lapl.org/pics50/00044920.jpg




Quote:
Perky Sharon Swetnam jumps with joy, announcing 'West's biggest mobile home exposition.' Set for Jan. 29 to Feb. 1 at the Great Western Exhibit Center, Santa Ana Freeway and Atlantic boulevard
1958
http://jpg1.lapl.org/00117/00117003.jpg



"Trailer Royalty"
1963
Quote:
Vicki Biss, 20, and Dorothy Shewey, 22, will reign over the 11th annual Mobile Home and Travel Trailer Show. Miss Biss is Miss Travel Trailer and Miss Shewey is Miss Mobile Home
http://jpg1.lapl.org/00126/00126992.jpg
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  #43120  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2017, 2:10 PM
Tourmaline Tourmaline is offline
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