Lister Block | ? | 6 fl | Renovation

[BrianE]

Oh I don't know, over at Raisethehammer.org their latest blog points out that Heritage Watch Hamilton wanted to preserve the facade. For some reason they wanted the stone around the windows, although why a new building would replicate such small and mishaped windows is beyond me...

And I must disagree with you that this building matched the street scape and that any new building won't fit in. I guess that may be true only in the sense that a new building won't be using 80 year old bricks.

I would propose that the only reason this building matched the streetscape in the first place is because it was built around the same time as the other buildings and was in similar state of disrepair. The abrupt changes in architectural styling between floors and that one column of windows I find to be quite jarring and unatractive to my eyes.

Using an example of the new buildings going up on King St in the international Village, I think a new building can fit in with the existing street scape and maybe even in a better way that the old building did. Since in my opinion it didn't fit the streetscape in the first place.

[SteelTown]

For the condo buildings (I suppose 12 storey is a tower) on King William I envision a 4-storey red/brownish brick building with the same upper window trim, a replica. The rest a setback like St Deny’s. Basically a carbon copy of St Deny’s.

[HAMRetrofit]

What Hamilton policy makers need to do is go out into these areas and collect an inventory of potential historic buildings. Then rank them based on their actual historic value. The database would need to collect information on particular features of interest, their potential longevity, the condition of the structure, date of construction etc. Collect as many attributes as possible. After collecting all of this information rank them for their disability for preservation. Create a transparent document that everyone has access too. This way when developers are interested in developing a building that could have some historic value there is more certainty for the ways that the project could proceed. I think one of the real problems with developing in downtown Hamilton is that no one knows what to expect and do not want the added risk of stepping on a hornets nest.

This will help Hamilton impose standards on these properties and ensure that they are safe. Unsafe buildings need to dealt with immediately. If they are unsecured they need to be either supported or demolished. Demolition of properties that are not stable and preservable is a reality that will need to be dealt with.

[SteelTown]

There is an inventory list, about 200 buildings listed for the City of Hamilton. The list was included when a motion was presented to stop neglect for demolition which council voted down.

[HAMRetrofit]

How deep does the information go on this list? and is this document available to the public?

[hmagazine]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZgNDC1pej0

[highwater]

Originally Posted by HAMRetrofit

How deep does the information go on this list? and is this document available to the public?

http://www.myhamilton.ca/myhamilton/...ing/Resources/

[hmagazine]

Heritage in Hamilton was dealt a major blow last week. The Balfour
Building is gone. While there are any number of areas of concern
related to its destruction, one that is perhaps most troubling is the
lack of leadership shown by our elected officials including ,and
perhaps most particularly, Mayor Eisenberger.

The building is gone, but the leaders of this city remain.

Will you please agree to attend the City Council meeting on Wednesday
night to show our disappointment with our current leaders? A large
showing of engaged but angry citizens from all walks of life and from
all parts of the city is an important image for Councillors and the
Mayor to see.

This is not a plan generated by radicals. It is a considered action
taken by people who are tired of Hamilton's heritage being destroyed
as a result of a lack of leadership. We trust that you agree.

We will convene outside of the Albion Room on the second floor of the
Hamilton Convention Centre at 6:55 pm. The Council meeting begins at
7:00 pm. We anticipate that your participation will not need to extend
beyond 7:15.

[HAMRetrofit]

^ is this group of concerned citizens investing any of their own money to preserve heritage? Thats where it starts when business leaders start turning heritage into opportunity. No one mentioned a thing about this building until it started to collapse. Now everyone is up in arms, bewildered by the fact that old buildings, unoccupied for decades are falling down. It should not have collapsed like this. Someone could have been killed.

I have gone over those heritage reports. The information they provide to the public regarding the state of each heritage property can be described as sparse. What are the heritage features? What is the type of construction? What condition is the building in? What are the policies on its modification or restoration?

[itsbryan]

Originally Posted by realcity

Think about this and if it's not leading to sabotage

- The yellow caution tape that went up the same day
- The smell of gas (urban explorers wouldn't tinker with gas pipes) Why was the gas still connected? If I don't pay my gas bill it's shut off in month (is this public record? perhaps if a investigation is going to happen then someone should examine the gas bills, was it turned-off? recently connected? I doubt the city will investigate, can citizens ask for an investigation?)
- The speed at which it gets torn down, so that no fire investigators will examine
- The firefighters were prevented from entering the building at the time of explosion. Not even to see if people were inside.
- Bratina asked staff to investigate the building that day, scheduled inspection the next day -- but it was too late
- the many 'mysterious' fires inside Lister

and the biggest reason....
- MOTIVE, the fact that LIUNA and HI RISE have been wanting to tear down these buildings for years.

As a big of a fan as I am of conspiracy theories, and as much as I do hate LIUNA/HiRise (almost, maybe even more than you).. the only thing they're guilty of is the aforementioned "demolition by neglect".

Letting a building sit for 8 years after you buy it, when it's clear that you want nothing more than for the building to be gone, is a sure way to demolish it.. and as long as you keep the public's concerns at bay by saying it's secure and safe.. all it takes it time. Considering the buildings were vacant, and cheap on taxes, they had all the time in the world.

Contrast to Lister, the building wasn't constructed with a tank-like frame. It's wood and brick base couldn't take the neglect shown for the past 15 or so years that the Block has been abandoned.

The biggest questionable (and devious) tactic that LIUNA played was the fact they boarded up every window on the Block in December of 2006. Within weeks, the air quality went to hell, as the ventilation provided by the 100+ open windows was now sealed off, and the moisture caused the already present mold spores to sprout and prosper. In addition, the moisture was now trapped inside, causing the plaster to easily rot and drop off.

When CH News was granted a video tour in January of 2008 (I think.. it may have been 2007).. all the public saw was Lister Block in the worst state it has ever been in.. as opposed to prior of the sealing up, where Lister Block's air was crisp, with a slight smell of wood, and the plaster still firmly in place.

As for structural influence the boards had, it's a theory (nothing more) that the all of the moisture the boards kept in during the past two spring thaws, significantly weaken the wood/brick base in the building.. causing the decay of the wood to speed up drastically.

Regarding the fires in Lister: You have to understand that the negligent low-lives that occupied that Lister during her vacancy were the homeless, and junkies. The fire was undoubtedly caused by one of the two (most likely the latter). Thankfully, Lister is practically fireproof, and the damage was minimal.

[hmagazine]

Originally Posted by HAMRetrofit

^ is this group of concerned citizens investing any of their own money to preserve heritage?

I can give you a personal tour of the over dozen heritage buildings that belong to this group of concerned citizens and have been lovingly taken care of and restored for new uses...

This argument always comes up when talking about the Lister debacle. We and many others are investing in downtown and are getting tired of the absentee landlords, renegade owners and heritage buildings that deserve more than sitting empty.

Now - let's talk about what you plan to do to get our city council to show some leadership on this issue!

[FairHamilton]

Originally Posted by HAMRetrofit

^ is this group of concerned citizens investing any of their own money to preserve heritage?

I'm not part of the group, but I'm interested in learning more.

And I already have invested my own money in preserving a private residence. I'm preserving local Hamilton heritage by spending thousands, and thousands of dollars restoring a home that had been left to deteriorate over the years.

Not too much deterioration, but enough the 1920's (or earlier, I intend to learn more on it's history) home was on a definite downward slope.

Now, only if the owner of the vacant home a couple of house down the street would get their act together and do something (anything).........

[Goldfinger]

Originally Posted by hmagazine

Heritage in Hamilton was dealt a major blow last week. The Balfour
Building is gone. While there are any number of areas of concern
related to its destruction, one that is perhaps most troubling is the
lack of leadership shown by our elected officials including ,and
perhaps most particularly, Mayor Eisenberger.

The building is gone, but the leaders of this city remain.

Will you please agree to attend the City Council meeting on Wednesday
night to show our disappointment with our current leaders? A large
showing of engaged but angry citizens from all walks of life and from
all parts of the city is an important image for Councillors and the
Mayor to see.

This is not a plan generated by radicals. It is a considered action
taken by people who are tired of Hamilton's heritage being destroyed
as a result of a lack of leadership. We trust that you agree.

We will convene outside of the Albion Room on the second floor of the
Hamilton Convention Centre at 6:55 pm. The Council meeting begins at
7:00 pm. We anticipate that your participation will not need to extend
beyond 7:15.

That's it folks, keep up the intimidation and soon you will have a core of rotten hollowed out buildings all over the city that you can't even give away.

[hmagazine]

Explain to me - why we should cower in fear? This city has been silent enough about this inept city council.

[raisethehammer]

Originally Posted by Goldfinger

That's it folks, keep up the intimidation and soon you will have a core of rotten hollowed out buildings all over the city that you can't even give away.

unlike you, many folks believe in Hamilton and are tired of slum landlords allowing our heritage to rot.
Considering how much you always yap on here, defending these criminals, I'd hate to see your own property.

[SteelTown]

Originally Posted by hmagazine

• Video Link

Scary and sad stuff to see.

[NuclearNerd]

I'm going to open myself up to a lot of flak here, but fuck the heritage fight. Liuna had a plan to rebuild Lister three years ago. Then Bratina (who I normally respect) and the Heritage comittee got involved and had the plan shut down with the help of an emergency call to the province. Now look what that got us: Lister is still a festering wound, and its foundations are crumbling.

It turns out renovating the old girl is way more expensive than rebuilding - many times the going office-space rate. We should have taken Liuna's original deal and moved on.

[NuclearNerd]

I'm sure that shady landlords are a big reason for the sorry state of many of our downtown buildings, but take a step back for a moment. The only reason these buildings are owned by cheap "criminals" is that no one else wants them. Our real estate values are near zero. We obviously aren't doing enough to encourage investment (yes I know about the downtown loan program, and no, I don't have any answers either.)

[Goldfinger]

Originally Posted by NuclearNerd

I'm going to open myself up to a lot of flak here, but fuck the heritage fight. Liuna had a plan to rebuild Lister three years ago. Then Bratina (who I normally respect) and the Heritage comittee got involved and had the plan shut down with the help of an emergency call to the province. Now look what that got us: Lister is still a festering wound, and its foundations are crumbling.

It turns out renovating the old girl is way more expensive than rebuilding - many times the going office-space rate. We should have taken Liuna's original deal and moved on.

Bravo! Common sense trumps the loud mouth activist.

[raisethehammer]

Originally Posted by Goldfinger

Bravo! Common sense trumps the loud mouth activist.

so not only do you support these criminal slumlords, but you also loved the idea of filling their bank account with millions of your (and my) dollars with a rotten plan that didn't work in the building???
You're the last person who should be on here talking about 'common sense'.