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eman · #**5221** Posted **Sep 15, 2018, 11:30 AM**

Losing the 10% affordable units should have been a deal breaker. In NYC,, developers hate having to provide affordable units because it brings down the value of the high end units. What they do to fix it is put the affordable units on low floors with separate elevators and entrances. I don't really agree,, but thats what they do sometimes.

Gentrification,, where are the advocates that should have been fighting for this?

The developers got off easy,, it hardly made the news at all.

I am guessing 300 Main won't have any either. 300 Assiniboine? None right? When was the last affordable unit built? Portage Place?

Spocket · #**5222** Posted **Sep 15, 2018, 4:31 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by eman

Losing the 10% affordable units should have been a deal breaker. In NYC,, developers hate having to provide affordable units because it brings down the value of the high end units. What they do to fix it is put the affordable units on low floors with separate elevators and entrances. I don't really agree,, but thats what they do sometimes.

Gentrification,, where are the advocates that should have been fighting for this?

The developers got off easy,, it hardly made the news at all.

I am guessing 300 Main won't have any either. 300 Assiniboine? None right? When was the last affordable unit built? Portage Place?

Affordable doesn't mean luxury at a discount. People pay top dollar for units higher up so of course the developers aren't going to sacrifice their cash cow for units they'll take a loss on.
One logical way for a developer to mitigate the cost of having affordable units is to make the building seem like two separate buildings. All psychological but it would seem to have the desired effect. Makes perfect sense.

As far as gentrification goes...? What does gentrification have to do with virtually anything built in the downtown core? That's the idea, after all.

And with all that said, the entire city is built out of affordable units. There's no shortage of places for people looking for a homestead on the cheap in Winnipeg. In fact, our problem seems to be a lack of luxury units.

We're not New York city and if we ever get the problems they have there then Winnipeg won't be anything like the city it is now anyway. I certainly don't lament the lack of cheap housing in a brand new build.

buzzg · #**5223** Posted **Sep 15, 2018, 4:52 PM**

I am all for some subsidies and see the real value of the gov's supporting this in the long run... but $45m is almost 10% of the entire project. That is massive. I do agree that losing the 10% affordable is the real killer here – if the government is going to invest this much, that should have been a non-negotiable. If you don't want affordable units, I'm cool with that – but don't ask for government assistance.

I think the govs just made a huge mistake by lumping in their support of "upgrades to the surrounding area" in with these numbers though. Graham, Carlton, Hargrave, have barely been touched in 25 years and need massive investment – they shouldn't have said that money is for TNS, because it's for everyone, and needed. PR 101.

Wpg_Guy · #**5224** Posted **Sep 15, 2018, 9:41 PM**

New page

Quote:

Originally Posted by Authentic_City

Let's not forget why we're here

Wpg_Guy · #**5225** Posted **Sep 15, 2018, 9:42 PM**

Trevor Clearwater (@trevor17mtsnet) on Instagram

esquire · #**5226** Posted **Sep 17, 2018, 1:01 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by buzzg

I am all for some subsidies and see the real value of the gov's supporting this in the long run... but $45m is almost 10% of the entire project. That is massive. I do agree that losing the 10% affordable is the real killer here – if the government is going to invest this much, that should have been a non-negotiable. If you don't want affordable units, I'm cool with that – but don't ask for government assistance.

I think I could somehow rationalize either the increased subsidy or the loss of affordable housing, but having to accept both makes it feel like the public is getting screwed here.

It's like showing up to take delivery of a new car and the salesman telling you "oh by the way, we're all out of the trim you ordered so we're going to give you a base model instead. and there's an extra $3,000 in 'fees' you need to pay us".

Jeremy6 · #**5227** Posted **Sep 17, 2018, 1:02 PM**

I don't know how to post this picture, but check out those LED strips in the plaza. I was not aware of this feature but I love it already!

https://imgur.com/a/fsPExyJ

rkspec · #**5228** Posted **Sep 17, 2018, 3:39 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeremy6

I don't know how to post this picture, but check out those LED strips in the plaza. I was not aware of this feature but I love it already!

https://imgur.com/a/fsPExyJ

Here's your pic:

buzzg · #**5229** Posted **Sep 17, 2018, 6:22 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

I think I could somehow rationalize either the increased subsidy or the loss of affordable housing, but having to accept both makes it feel like the public is getting screwed here.

It's like showing up to take delivery of a new car and the salesman telling you "oh by the way, we're all out of the trim you ordered so we're going to give you a base model instead. and there's an extra $3,000 in 'fees' you need to pay us".

Totally agreed. If you're getting that much public subsidy, cool – put then there needs to be more public benefit from it.

14NM · #**5230** Posted **Sep 17, 2018, 6:33 PM**

Can we also talk about how most of the plywood boards are being replaced by actual windows? It's a minor detail but it's actually lengthening the tower in a beautiful way.

esquire · #**5231** Posted **Sep 17, 2018, 6:51 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by 14NM

Can we also talk about how most of the plywood boards are being replaced by actual windows? It's a minor detail but it's actually lengthening the tower in a beautiful way.

I agree, the tower is certainly looking nice and somehow taller with all the glass coming in.

I do have to balance that by saying that after hoping the screen at the top of the office tower (surrounding the elevator core) would grow on me, it hasn't. Why didn't they use something solid instead of that screen?

Jets4Life · #**5232** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 12:40 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wpg_Guy

Trevor Clearwater (@trevor17mtsnet) on Instagram

Nice pic. When is the taller TNS building scheduled for completion?

optimusREIM · #**5233** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 1:02 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jets4Life

Nice pic. When is the taller TNS building scheduled for completion?

Next spring apparently

Wpg_Guy · #**5234** Posted **Sep 18, 2018, 11:38 PM**

@EDWinnipeg Twitter https://twitter.com/EDWinnipeg
We stopped by the site of @truenorthsquare this morning to check in on the construction. Looks stunning! We're excited about this downtown mega-project, the largest private mixed-use development in Winnipeg history.

Andy6 · #**5235** Posted **Sep 19, 2018, 1:12 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spocket

Affordable doesn't mean luxury at a discount. People pay top dollar for units higher up so of course the developers aren't going to sacrifice their cash cow for units they'll take a loss on.
One logical way for a developer to mitigate the cost of having affordable units is to make the building seem like two separate buildings. All psychological but it would seem to have the desired effect. Makes perfect sense.

As far as gentrification goes...? What does gentrification have to do with virtually anything built in the downtown core? That's the idea, after all.

And with all that said, the entire city is built out of affordable units. There's no shortage of places for people looking for a homestead on the cheap in Winnipeg. In fact, our problem seems to be a lack of luxury units.

I would wonder if anyone ever looks at exactly who is getting the "affordable" units and how/if society actually benefits from the existence of these requirements.

bomberjet · #**5236** Posted **Sep 20, 2018, 8:37 PM**

PCL is back on the roof of the church along the south edge of the office tower. Scaffolding up on Hargarve and they're laying out plywood protecting the roof.

Maybe getting ready to install the Scotiabank signage.

Wolf13 · #**5237** Posted **Sep 20, 2018, 10:04 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by eman

Losing the 10% affordable units should have been a deal breaker. In NYC,, developers hate having to provide affordable units because it brings down the value of the high end units. What they do to fix it is put the affordable units on low floors with separate elevators and entrances. I don't really agree,, but thats what they do sometimes.

Gentrification,, where are the advocates that should have been fighting for this?

The developers got off easy,, it hardly made the news at all.

I am guessing 300 Main won't have any either. 300 Assiniboine? None right? When was the last affordable unit built? Portage Place?

It's obscene that they get these funds without the 10%.

In NYC they might not like that, perhaps not in Toronto or downtown Vancouver, but it's perfectly normal in most other places. Considering how contentious some approval processes are, it's not uncommon for cities to encourage these.

300 Main however will have 10% affordable units, but that just caps the rent at lower amounts, but not poverty levels. In anything short of a luxury market, there's no need for separate elevators and the like. I'd imagine that all the new grads or interns in nearby offices would swallow these up instantly.

LilZebra · #**5238** Posted **Sep 20, 2018, 10:30 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by eman

Losing the 10% affordable units should have been a deal breaker. In NYC,, developers hate having to provide affordable units because it brings down the value of the high end units. What they do to fix it is put the affordable units on low floors with separate elevators and entrances. I don't really agree,, but thats what they do sometimes.

Gentrification,, where are the advocates that should have been fighting for this?

The developers got off easy,, it hardly made the news at all.

I am guessing 300 Main won't have any either. 300 Assiniboine? None right? When was the last affordable unit built? Portage Place?

Just came across a related article on Wednesday...

ReadyToRent (BC) - Walking Through the Poor Door

Quote:

Then there are so-called ‘poor doors’. ‘Poor doors’ are separate entrances that are being utilized by some developers when they are required to include social, low-market or subsidized housing to get re-zoning or planning permission; one door for subsidized housing and a different door for the market units. This has recently come into the news in the West End, Vancouver, for an approved development with 82 market strata units and 39 social housing units. The development will have separate entrances and separate lobbies. It did include separate play areas for the children of the two groups of residents. These plans were revised due to the public backlash.

LilZebra · #**5239** Posted **Sep 20, 2018, 10:38 PM**

I received an e-mail last week from the Prov., saying that TNC Plaza will be opened at official ceremony on Sept. 27th. Doesn't say what time of the day though. I assume 10 am-ish.

Wolf13 · #**5240** Posted **Sep 21, 2018, 3:16 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by LilZebra

Just came across a related article on Wednesday...

ReadyToRent (BC) - Walking Through the Poor Door

If the ratio were 1/3 of total units and it was social housing, then yes, I can see the problem.

In Wpg's case, I believe it caps qualification to a certain income and, I think, 1 bedroom units to around $900/month and 2 bedroom to $1100. Definitely below market, but in Winnipeg, not necessarily dangerous to the fabric of the entire building. That would only be about 20 units out of 200 at TNS, I think. Not worth the extra elevators/doors/expenses. Irrelevant, regardless.