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  #61  
Old Posted Feb 14, 2017, 2:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dleung View Post
lol it doesn't work like "small-c 'conservative'"

"all lives matter/All Lives Matter" is only ever uttered as a reaction to BLM, which exists only because black lives matter less to police, juries, the news, etc.
TBQH, I don't give a shit. I am not American and will not be bound by labels they have created for themselves as part of their political discourse.

You're the one raised "All Lives Matter", not me. And frankly I have no idea why you did.

Now you're trying to paint me into a corner with some type of bullshit guilt-by-association assemblage.

I actually know very little about All Lives Matter and what they stand for.

But I do know that for me all human lives are of equal value, and that's what counts.
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Last edited by Acajack; Feb 14, 2017 at 2:36 PM.
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  #62  
Old Posted Feb 14, 2017, 2:25 PM
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You're right, Acajack - the only issue is All Lives Matter was a direct slap back to Black Lives Matter, intentionally introduced as a means of shutting them up. It's spread widely, and lots of very well-meaning people now use it, but it started as a reaction to BLM.

I choose to look at it like this - every time you see BLM, imagine there's a "too" at the end. That alleviates the "All Lives Matter" BS for genuine people, and still keeps the focus on people who need it.
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  #63  
Old Posted Feb 14, 2017, 6:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Metro-One View Post
Yes, a kernel of truth is an appropriate measurement.

But, it is not just a "white people speaking bad about others" situation.

Many of the worst things I have heard about the Chinese have come from Korean, South Asian, and Taiwanese people I know in Vancouver.

Just have to add this because these days there is this bizarre concept that only white people have a monopoly on racism and prejudice.

In the end though, either way, ssiguy blows it way our of proportion. The guy has an amazing ability to magnify any negative aspect in BC / Vancouver (and Toronto as times) by about 100 X.
Notice how I never said white people! I've heard comments from all the groups you mentioned, and even from second and third generation Chinese immigrants.

Yeah, he definitely exaggerated, and I have a tendency to do that too I think. But it's just unsettling, and I think worthy of discussion.
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  #64  
Old Posted Feb 14, 2017, 6:43 PM
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Seriously, though, Ukraine's flag is perfect. Is there any other non-reviled flag that instantly conveys what is depicted and who it represents to that degree? I think of it evey time I see one of your posts.

Ours you think... is that faded-out Italy? Gay Italian maybe? No, Newfoundland. And even then they don't know. But Ukraine's, you know it's Ukraine, and you know it's wheat and sky. I think Ukraine won the flag contest.
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  #65  
Old Posted Feb 14, 2017, 8:54 PM
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Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker View Post
Seriously, though, Ukraine's flag is perfect. Is there any other non-reviled flag that instantly conveys what is depicted and who it represents to that degree? I think of it evey time I see one of your posts.

Ours you think... is that faded-out Italy? Gay Italian maybe? No, Newfoundland. And even then they don't know. But Ukraine's, you know it's Ukraine, and you know it's wheat and sky. I think Ukraine won the flag contest.
It is pretty remarkable how recognizable it is considering it belongs to a country that prior to 2014 I often had to describe as "a medium sized country just west of Russia."

I think you're being too hard on the tri-colour though! I grew a lot of appreciation for it after my trip to St. John's. It was everywhere and people seemed to identify with it on a level I only really see in the US. I don't like big brash imperial flags and so the tri-colour is great. Peaceful but meaningful. Not to mention unique. I know lots of flags are striped, but how many have pink!?

I've never really thought about the Ukrainian flag in the way you mentioned either though. Love the peace and simplicity of the wheat and sky, just never gave it much thought before.
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  #66  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 1:09 AM
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Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker View Post
Seriously, though, Ukraine's flag is perfect. Is there any other non-reviled flag that instantly conveys what is depicted and who it represents to that degree? I think of it evey time I see one of your posts.

Ours you think... is that faded-out Italy? Gay Italian maybe? No, Newfoundland. And even then they don't know. But Ukraine's, you know it's Ukraine, and you know it's wheat and sky. I think Ukraine won the flag contest.
Lol I was in St John's for quite a while before I realized it wasn't a faded out irish flag.
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  #67  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 1:13 AM
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Gay Italian
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  #68  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 1:20 AM
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Originally Posted by GlassCity View Post
It is pretty remarkable how recognizable it is considering it belongs to a country that prior to 2014 I often had to describe as "a medium sized country just west of Russia."
.
I think your downplaying something.


Beyond knowing of western Europe, Ukraine is super well recognised.

It's that european country that all those people came from, it's where all of the intense aspects of russian history actually happened, Kievan Rus, gulags, revolutionary violence,chernobyl, cossacks, tatars, etc.
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  #69  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 1:22 AM
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Perhaps it's just because I'm in Alberta, but there's absolutely a heightened understanding of Ukraine here. Disproportionate, in fact.
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  #70  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 1:46 AM
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Most European flags are not particularly distinctive or special looking. Greece is one of the most memorable ones. Czechia also grabs attention because of the triangle but it's still fairly generic.

Many Arab states also have fairly generic flags. The flags of Jordan, Palestine, Kuwait, Sudan, and the UAE are all variations of the same thing and are all easily confused with each other.

Canada actually does really well in this regard. So do Israel and Japan. All three countries have very distinctive flags that signify the country in a "short and sweet" manner.
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  #71  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 2:16 AM
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As I said, after the Crimea invasion it got easier. But before that, I'd say around 40% of the time I'd mention I was born in Ukraine people would respond with "what's that"
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  #72  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 2:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Metro-One View Post
Yes, a kernel of truth is an appropriate measurement.

But, it is not just a "white people speaking bad about others" situation.

Many of the worst things I have heard about the Chinese have come from Korean, South Asian, and Taiwanese people I know in Vancouver.

Just have to add this because these days there is this bizarre concept that only white people have a monopoly on racism and prejudice.

In the end though, either way, ssiguy blows it way our of proportion. The guy has an amazing ability to magnify any negative aspect in BC / Vancouver (and Toronto as times) by about 100 X.
I have a few Japanese friends and two of them have nothing nice to say about Koreans. One time my one Japanese friend and I were at the Jericho pier and there were some Koreans fishing and my friend was like let's go they gross me out, dirty people. I was kinda surprised to how much he disliked them. The one hates samsung and anything made in Korea or by Koreans. Says they steal all their ideas and technology from the Japanese.
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  #73  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 3:13 AM
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Originally Posted by GlassCity View Post
As I said, after the Crimea invasion it got easier. But before that, I'd say around 40% of the time I'd mention I was born in Ukraine people would respond with "what's that"
That's absolutely nuts. I can't even believe it.
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  #74  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 3:15 AM
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Originally Posted by BretttheRiderFan View Post
That's absolutely nuts. I can't even believe it.
I should mention that I graduated high school in 2013, so maybe it's because people that age haven't been exposed to other places as much?
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  #75  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 3:19 AM
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I really think you'd have much different reactions if you were in the prairies. The idea that somebody wouldn't know what/where Ukraine is, is baffling. It'd be like not having heard of Italy or Ireland.
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  #76  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 3:39 AM
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Originally Posted by BretttheRiderFan View Post
I really think you'd have much different reactions if you were in the prairies. The idea that somebody wouldn't know what/where Ukraine is, is baffling. It'd be like not having heard of Italy or Ireland.
Yeah I often wonder what my life would have been like if we had moved to Edmonton or Saskatoon or elsewhere in the Prairies with a more established Ukrainian presence. I always come to the conclusion that it wouldn't be that different though. From what I understand, the Ukrainian diaspora in the Prairies is firmly entrenched and multi-generational, so it wouldn't really make any difference for a new immigrant like myself. We knew one family in Vancouver, and that probably helped out a lot more than any historically Ukrainian settlements would have.
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  #77  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 3:42 AM
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people my age know the ukraine if only for the nuclear meltdown.

And everyone knows their food i mean come on
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  #78  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 3:43 AM
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People here definitely don't speak Ukrainian or anything like that. But the sheer ignorance you're talking about doesn't exist here as far as I'd assume.
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  #79  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 3:47 AM
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Originally Posted by SpongeG View Post
people my age know the ukraine if only for the nuclear meltdown.

And everyone knows their food i mean come on
Really? I was born there and I can't even really think of any iconic food we have Everyone knows perogies, but I think most associate that with Russia. Borscht is also pretty well known, but again, associated with Russia. Ditto with cabbage rolls. I can't really think of anything that is recognized as being distinctly Ukrainian.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BretttheRiderFan View Post
People here definitely don't speak Ukrainian or anything like that. But the sheer ignorance you're talking about doesn't exist here as far as I'd assume.
No, I wouldn't expect them to speak it nor to be ignorant of it. My impression of Ukrainian culture in the Prairies is that of the French in Louisiana: Everyone knows it was an important part of their history, but it's passed and now largely non-influential on day to day life.
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  #80  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2017, 3:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
TBQH, I don't give a shit. I am not American and will not be bound by labels they have created for themselves as part of their political discourse.

You're the one raised "All Lives Matter", not me. And frankly I have no idea why you did.

Now you're trying to paint me into a corner with some type of bullshit guilt-by-association assemblage.

I actually know very little about All Lives Matter and what they stand for.

But I do know that for me all human lives are of equal value, and that's what counts.
You should watch more American TV Acajack. That way, you'll be more familiar with all of "our" issues.
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