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  #3621  
Old Posted Apr 25, 2014, 4:15 AM
N830MH N830MH is offline
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When they will start built?
     
     
  #3622  
Old Posted Apr 25, 2014, 5:10 AM
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Originally Posted by NYC GUY View Post
What I don't understand is didn't the PA make a deal with Silverstein that if he got a tenant they'd give him money? So he found a tenant why don't they honor the agreement?
Makes us wonder about WTC2. If this is having trouble, I can't imagine what the even more expensive second tower will go through. And thats if it finds a tenant...

On the brightside, if tower 2, and 3 do have even more delays, at least we have all the madness happening in Midtown. The creation essentially of a new CBD over in Midtown will keep us busy and visiting for a long time along with the dramatic changes occurring in the outer boroughs.
     
     
  #3623  
Old Posted Apr 25, 2014, 4:21 PM
SouthAmboyGuy SouthAmboyGuy is offline
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If 2 and 3 WTC are not going to be built in the foreseeable future, then the "cap-off" should be finished and retail allowed to move in. The transit center should be finished as well. The transit center is more complete now than it is "in progress." Finish it. It will be an major tourist attraction and something uplifting that will only spur more development in the area.

As far as 2 and 3 WTC are concerned, low rise "tax payers" were very common during the Great Depression, e.g. the Hearst Building on 57th St. Hearst only got its tower 50 years after it was built. Their time will come.

Also, the entire WTC building site should be cleaned up with the removal of construction equipment, Jersey barriers, chain link fences, plywood walls, etc., so that the area is livable for residents, workers, and tourists. Streets and sidewalks should be finished (even if they will need to be torn up again later).

As it is now, it looks like a makeshift armed work camp and only discourages commerce and movement through the area. It is a hostile environment for most people. Construction sites are meant to be temporary. 13 years is long enough.

When the time is right, 2 and 3 WTC will be built. I have no doubts about this. Cleaning up the site will cost less in the long run than leaving it as it is today.
     
     
  #3624  
Old Posted Apr 25, 2014, 4:25 PM
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Originally Posted by NYC GUY View Post
What I don't understand is didn't the PA make a deal with Silverstein that if he got a tenant they'd give him money? So he found a tenant why don't they honor the agreement?
Because Silverstein is asking for additional funding. The original agreement was for the PA to loan Silverstein approximately $600 million for the tower with Silverstein putting in $300 million and the rest coming from private financing. The $600 million was conditional on 3WTC having at least 400,000 sq ft of preleased space. While the GroupM lease meets the PA requirement, it appears that the capital markets feel that it's not enough of the prelease to warrant financing and won't offer terms that are acceptable to Silverstein.

Silverstein is now asking for the public commitment to be doubled to $1.2 billion while he firm increases it's contribution to $450 million. The PA will honor the existing agreement- the question is whether they will expand it.
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  #3625  
Old Posted Apr 25, 2014, 4:47 PM
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Originally Posted by wong21fr View Post
Because Silverstein is asking for additional funding. The original agreement was for the PA to loan Silverstein approximately $600 million for the tower with Silverstein putting in $300 million and the rest coming from private financing. The $600 million was conditional on 3WTC having at least 400,000 sq ft of preleased space. While the GroupM lease meets the PA requirement, it appears that the capital markets feel that it's not enough of the prelease to warrant financing and won't offer terms that are acceptable to Silverstein.

Silverstein is now asking for the public commitment to be doubled to $1.2 billion while he firm increases it's contribution to $450 million. The PA will honor the existing agreement- the question is whether they will expand it.
So why is everyone complaining about the PA? Why should they have to give even more money now?
     
     
  #3626  
Old Posted Apr 25, 2014, 5:51 PM
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Originally Posted by baseball1992 View Post
So why is everyone complaining about the PA? Why should they have to give even more money now?
Agreed, PA's job is to support transportation infrastructure and not to subsidize private towers. If banks would see 3 WTC as feasible investment Larry would have no problem getting financial backing from them. With still high vacancy at 1WTC and 4 WTC and new office space coming to market at Hudson Yards and Manhattan West no financial institution wants to back 3WTC so why should PA, only to accumulate more debt which we all would have to pay back in form of subway and tunnels fare increases?
     
     
  #3627  
Old Posted Apr 25, 2014, 10:53 PM
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Originally Posted by chris08876 View Post
Makes us wonder about WTC2. If this is having trouble, I can't imagine what the even more expensive second tower will go through. And thats if it finds a tenant....
It doesn't really have anything to do with the other. Both towers need financing, but 2 WTC isn't relying on backed assistance. That tower needs a major tenant before it can get financing, same as any other office tower proposal.



Quote:
Originally Posted by gdellafave View Post
If 2 and 3 WTC are not going to be built in the foreseeable future, then the "cap-off" should be finished and retail allowed to move in.
The retail isn't going to move in because no one wants the uncertainty of construction disrupting business. If Silverstein doesn't get tower 3 rising (which he most likely will), then the potential retail tenants with Westfield won't go through.



Quote:
Originally Posted by wong21fr View Post
Because Silverstein is asking for additional funding.
That's misleading, and not really accurate. Silverstein himself would have to provide additional funding in the deal, he's asking for more PA backing so he can get financing. The objection from some in the PA is that if Silverstein defaults (which again, he most likely wouldn't), the PA would be responsible for more of the debt.


Quote:
While the GroupM lease meets the PA requirement, it appears that the capital markets feel that it's not enough of the prelease to warrant financing and won't offer terms that are acceptable to Silverstein.

The market Downtown will always take longer to absorb new commercial space, that's just known. With space in the Freedom Tower and 4 WTC still available, it's not as tight as Silverstein would like it to be, even though he has already signed a large tenant for tower 3. I don't doubt that Silverstein would already have financing by now if this tower were rising in Midtown.



Meanwhile, things are taking shape in regards to overall access at the sight.


http://www.downtownexpress.com/2014/...r-on-security/

In a shift, W.T.C. residents like what they hear on security





April 24, 2014
BY JOSH ROGERS


Quote:
Will it be a kinder, more flexible N.Y.P.D. protecting the World Trade Center when the new security plan begins to be implemented next month?

That message comes not from police officials trying to reassure the Downtown community, but from beleaguered W.T.C. area residents who have been fighting with police for years over what they say are excessively tight security restrictions. Last week, several resident leaders said that for the first time in over a dozen years, they felt their voices were being considered.

One of the most surprising things about the meeting was that Dep. Inspector Kevin Burke, who heads the World Trade Center Command, and Lieutenant Tom Ferramosca, who helped develop the security plan, said that residents like Perillo right near the site could take taxis through the World Trade Center to get home.

“Traffic within the campus will be restricted, but people who have business within the campus will be permitted in and those people enrolled in [the Trusted Access Program], will be permitted in,” said Ferramosca.

Under TAP, vehicles and people that regularly enter the site including nearby residents will have passes to enter in vehicles.


The official line has always been that Greenwich St. would be open to at least some traffic, but the N.Y.P.D. always reserved the right to keep it closed, and few Downtowners had much hope the street would actually open anytime soon.

Once the museum opens to the public, pedestrians will have freer access to the 9/11 Memorial, which will no longer have the timed ticketing system. Officials with the Port Authority, owners of most of the W.T.C. said earlier this month that some of the barriers to the memorial at the south end will be removed, which will allow residents and visitors to traverse between Battery Park City and the Financial District as they experience the memorial.

Still sounds a little tense to me. It's no wonder tenants aren't flocking to the site.
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  #3628  
Old Posted Apr 26, 2014, 3:00 AM
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^^ That plan doesn't sound much different than what was originally announced... They will still probably have those barriers all around the site.
     
     
  #3629  
Old Posted Apr 26, 2014, 6:57 AM
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At least they are letting the public/locals through, so that's something?
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  #3630  
Old Posted Apr 26, 2014, 4:11 PM
SouthAmboyGuy SouthAmboyGuy is offline
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Maybe I'm getting old but...

Picture it -- 1990.

One could walk up a short but broad flight of steps from Church Street, walk across the WTC Plaza without any impediment, and into Tower 1 or 2 -- with no security check of any kind.

Then from Tower 1 or 2, you'd take an escalator down to the main level from the mezzanine level.

Then the elevators were wide open. You could hop on any elevator you wanted to, without so much as a sideways glance from the guards.

Today, this boggles the mind. We were wide open--yet nothing happened for 20 years.

How I wish we could go back to that level of feeling safe and confident.

That security plan is depressing, yet probably necessary.

Last edited by SouthAmboyGuy; Apr 26, 2014 at 4:20 PM. Reason: Adding an important point.
     
     
  #3631  
Old Posted Apr 26, 2014, 9:15 PM
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Enigmatism415 Enigmatism415 is offline
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It'll become another Park Row. Heaven help the Financial District and all who dwell within its iron curtain.

Last edited by Enigmatism415; Apr 27, 2014 at 12:52 AM.
     
     
  #3632  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2014, 7:46 PM
M. Incandenza M. Incandenza is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gdellafave View Post
Maybe I'm getting old but...

Picture it -- 1990.

One could walk up a short but broad flight of steps from Church Street, walk across the WTC Plaza without any impediment, and into Tower 1 or 2 -- with no security check of any kind.

Then from Tower 1 or 2, you'd take an escalator down to the main level from the mezzanine level.

Then the elevators were wide open. You could hop on any elevator you wanted to, without so much as a sideways glance from the guards.

Today, this boggles the mind. We were wide open--yet nothing happened for 20 years.

How I wish we could go back to that level of feeling safe and confident.


That security plan is depressing, yet probably necessary.
Complete security is an illusion and all of these efforts are merely theater. You can make the WTC perfectly secure, but then the scary evil people will just target midtown; you can make airplanes perfectly safe, but what about buses and shopping malls and movie theaters?

I'm sorry you don't feel safe and confident. But I think you should, and I wish you and everyone else would, because there's no reason not to, and all this fear is used to justify an awful lot of nonsense.
     
     
  #3633  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2014, 10:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gdellafave View Post
Maybe I'm getting old but...

Picture it -- 1990.

One could walk up a short but broad flight of steps from Church Street, walk across the WTC Plaza without any impediment, and into Tower 1 or 2 -- with no security check of any kind.

Then from Tower 1 or 2, you'd take an escalator down to the main level from the mezzanine level.

Then the elevators were wide open. You could hop on any elevator you wanted to, without so much as a sideways glance from the guards.

Today, this boggles the mind. We were wide open--yet nothing happened for 20 years.

How I wish we could go back to that level of feeling safe and confident.

That security plan is depressing, yet probably necessary.
The 90s were way better times! You could probably have walked into most buildings in New York City and done the same thing then. I feel like I'm going to be telling my children one day about this golden age-like time when few people feared for their security (school, work, sporting events, ect...) and everyone lived relatively happily.

9/11 greatly skewed the concept of security all over the place, especially in large cities. After the attacks the likelihood of a further set of terrorist attacks went down greatly, yet the government and private businesses rolled right on believing another major attack was moments away, acting like the world was coming to an end. Don't worry though, the good times will return. Just not yet.
     
     
  #3634  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2014, 8:07 AM
ArtDecoRevival ArtDecoRevival is offline
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Ugh, the constant false starts and then disappointments on WTC3 is so frustrating. If it were like WTC2, which has really never had a promising start and then sudden halt, I could move on and accept it'll be years. But this tower keeps getting my hopes up that full construction will commence and then always something happens. How many years will we have to wait to see a completely restored lower-Manhattan skyline? 5? 10? I'm reminded of what that P.A suit said after the recession was at its worst; that the WTC site wouldn't be completed until 2036. Now that seems optimistic. The PA and Cuomo really are intent on watering down or outright killing the remainder of this project. I guess it's a small victory it only took 13 years to get WTC 1 and 4.

Last edited by NYguy; Apr 29, 2014 at 1:57 PM.
     
     
  #3635  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2014, 10:26 AM
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The PA shouldn't be involved in real estate. Period.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ILNY View Post
Agreed, PA's job is to support transportation infrastructure and not to subsidize private towers. If banks would see 3 WTC as feasible investment Larry would have no problem getting financial backing from them. With still high vacancy at 1WTC and 4 WTC and new office space coming to market at Hudson Yards and Manhattan West no financial institution wants to back 3WTC so why should PA, only to accumulate more debt which we all would have to pay back in form of subway and tunnels fare increases?
     
     
  #3636  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2014, 1:27 PM
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Originally Posted by NYguy View Post
The retail isn't going to move in because no one wants the uncertainty of construction disrupting business. If Silverstein doesn't get tower 3 rising (which he most likely will), then the potential retail tenants with Westfield won't go through.
It should be noted though, that work below street level has been steadily progressing, and the retail locations within the footprints of both towers are likely to open on time with the rest of the mall.
     
     
  #3637  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2014, 5:14 PM
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Originally Posted by drumz0rz View Post
It should be noted though, that work below street level has been steadily progressing, and the retail locations within the footprints of both towers are likely to open on time with the rest of the mall.
Could retail really open in a tower still under construction? I imagine there's a certain concern for safety that would keep that from happening - scaffolding and heavy crane lifts being chief among them. Am I wrong?
     
     
  #3638  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2014, 8:23 PM
weidncol weidncol is offline
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Westfield have already mentioned they will not put retail in this tower until it is fully built. I don't know if they were talking soley about the podium retail or that and underground retail.
     
     
  #3639  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2014, 8:48 PM
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I kind of feel bad for Silverstein, it looks like he may never live to see these towers rise.

I'm starting to doubt we will either but that's another story
     
     
  #3640  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2014, 10:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Zapatan View Post
I kind of feel bad for Silverstein, it looks like he may never live to see these towers rise.

I'm starting to doubt we will either but that's another story
they are not leaving two stumps there forever. they will get built eventually. silverstein is OLD. the new regime will take care of business.
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