Salt Lake Transit News Thread

[DENrising]

Don't forget how we are all getting screwed over by the freaking Saudi's, which the U.S. has spent billions on defending in the past, yet they don't care any more about that, but rather how they can get $300/a barrel.

BREAKING NEWS: White House says Saudi Arabia does not see a reason to increase oil production

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/24660754/

It's time to stop sucking up to these low lifes Mr. Bush.

"When Bush first ran for president in 2000, he criticized the Clinton administration for high fuel prices and said the president must "jawbone" oil producing nations and persuade them to drop rates. At that time, oil was nearing $28 a barrel."

What a GREAT JOB Bush has done to screw us all up since his initial landslide victory. At least he's an oilman himself, he must really be smiling in private about this, while patting himself on his back and enjoying that daily steak dinner with his Big Oil comrades!! Way to go...

Thanks SLCProjects

[delts145]

... And with that in mind read this.... Hopefully Gov. Huntsman will prevail.

Utah trio push for oil shale

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/1...6,00.html?pg=1

... The U.S. has more than 70 percent of the world's oil shale, with the richest deposits in Colorado, Utah and Wyoming estimated to contain 1.5 trillion barrels of shale oil, said Hansen...

If only 800 billion of this can be recovered, that alone would supply all of our current domestic petroleum needs for the next 100 years or more,... He called the three Western states the "Saudi Arabia of oil shale."

"It would be nice to pretend we're not dependent on oil, that we can skip immediately to some yet-to-be-identified alternative 30 years down the line...

"Utah is home not only to substantial oil shale reserves (most of which are located upon BLM lands) but also to businesses willing to develop oil shale using new technology that will make extraction cleaner and more efficient,"

.

[NYC Rick]

Originally Posted by scrapernerd

Allright I'm Confused A Little Bit? Alot Of People On This Forum Make It Sound That Its Is A Sin To Drive To Work And Yet When Suburbs Start Building Office Space And Places For There Citizens To Work Alot Of People Don't Like That Here Because It Takes Away From Slc, To Be Consisitant Shouldn't Every Person Be Force To Work Within One Mile To Were They Live And Then They Wouldn't Have To Buy A Car And Cause So Much Polution And Then We Can All Just Send More Money To Uta. If I Remember Right Commuter Rail North Just Cost Tax Payer 600 Million So What Maybe 3000 People Can Ride It. It Dosen't Make Senes To Me! Everytime The Citizens Of Utah Pass Another Tax Uta Raises Rates On Them Right After. Sorry For My Rant But I Had To Do A Report On Uta And I Liked Them Alot More Then Then I Do Now.

Welcome to the real world...What exactly is your point? Not pushing just very confused by what you are saying.

"Shouldn't Every Person Be Force To Work Within One Mile To Were They Live And Then They Wouldn't Have To Buy A Car And Cause So Much Polution And Then We Can All Just Send More Money To Uta." HUH?

[scrapernerd]

First off the reason it my last post was all capitalized was because I didn't notice my cap locks was on and I guess it only capitalized the first letter in each word. And first off I'm not in school or working in development I just started liking skyscrapers when I hit 16 and I got to tell I saved alot of time and gas money having this forum because I was always driving to the site and wondering if anything was happening.I don't know how many time I drove by 222 S to see if hamilton had started that skyscraper. But my whole point is it seems if a person want to live in the suburbs or not in a city, and have land they are are not as enlightned as people who live in capitol citys, and in regards the uta I think I read once the head gets a higher salary then the govenor (not sure where I read it, poss utah business mag) I just think people don't question the public transportation enough except to say more is better. Which it could be because people are voting for it. Well now I'm rambiling again

[delts145]

Siemens execs praise Utah for maximizing green potential

http://www.sltrib.com/business/ci_9290050

Loescher and his fellow Siemens executives heaped praise on Utah for its leading vision of a cleaner America. They said its transit-rail system is growing at a rate that is now the envy of many U.S. cities scrambling for federal dollars to duplicate the model Utah started in the run-up to the 2002 Winter Olympics. But the city and county also are seeking cleaner buildings, and Siemens is helping to make some of them up to 90 percent more efficient, added George Nolen, CEO of Siemens Corp. USA.
"We really see Utah as a very progressive place, and taking seriously how a city of the future should look," he said

.

[WASDEN]

Originally Posted by delts145

Siemens execs praise Utah for maximizing green potential

By that do they mean their own cash? I think I'd be praising anybody who just handed me $277,000,000 worth of business.


I kind of like the current TRAX cars (minus the hand-me-downs from San Jose- YUCK!) I just hope a nice paint job can make those Siemens S70s more palatable. In the pics you guys posted it looks like a huge floating.. hmm..


I think someone said our current TRAX cars look "communistic"? Well how about the one below? Its the San Diego trolley and I think its dead sexy! All that old school flair-

tndwest.com


This newer model looks similar to an S70, probably isn't, but you get the idea. Not bad with the paint job but I still like the look of that classy older version better.

brokerforyou.com

[delts145]

Parkway nears the finish line

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/1...227103,00.html


(Laura Seitz, Deseret News)

When the parkway opens this fall, it will be the second-largest road project in Utah and carry a $685 million price tag. It comes in second only to the $1.6 billion I-15 reconstruction leading up to the 2002 Salt Lake Winter Olympic Games.

But Legacy will drop to third place after completion of a 20-mile I-15 reconstruction project in Utah County, which is expected to cost $2.6 billion. Construction on that project is expected to begin in late 2009 or early 2010 and could last five years.

.

[RFPCME]

Originally Posted by delts145

... And with that in mind read this.... Hopefully Gov. Huntsman will prevail.

Utah trio push for oil shale

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/1...6,00.html?pg=1

... The U.S. has more than 70 percent of the world's oil shale, with the richest deposits in Colorado, Utah and Wyoming estimated to contain 1.5 trillion barrels of shale oil, said Hansen...

If only 800 billion of this can be recovered, that alone would supply all of our current domestic petroleum needs for the next 100 years or more,... He called the three Western states the "Saudi Arabia of oil shale."

"It would be nice to pretend we're not dependent on oil, that we can skip immediately to some yet-to-be-identified alternative 30 years down the line...

"Utah is home not only to substantial oil shale reserves (most of which are located upon BLM lands) but also to businesses willing to develop oil shale using new technology that will make extraction cleaner and more efficient,"

.

Delts: Thanks for posting this article. It appears that Hell has frozen over and the Sun is now coming up in the West...I finally agree with something that Orin Hatch and Jim Hansen are pushing! I don't think I've gotten any smarter, nor do I think that Hatch and Hansen are losing their grips. I think all of us are realizing the patently obvious...the oil shale is there, it's cheap in comparison to other sources of energy and essential materials, and it can be developed responsibly, mitigating environmental impacts (at a price that is probably less than half of today's oil prices). I read the draft EIS, and it seems well thought out. Yes, there are some unknowns, the biggest one being scarce water. But even the water issue is surmountable with the right approach using today's technology. It's time. No, it's past time.

[RC14]

^
One of our Utah representitives or senaters, was being interviewed on the Night Side Project. I can't remember who, I think it was Chris Cannon, but anyway he was saying, There is currently a study being done that is expected to prove that oil shale could be developed for less then $30 per barrel and he thinks it could actualy be done for way less than that even.

[SLC Projects]

Originally Posted by RC14

^
One of our Utah representitives or senaters, was being interviewed on the Night Side Project. I can't remember who, I think it was Chris Cannon, but anyway he was saying, There is currently a study being done that is expected to prove that oil shale could be developed for less then $30 per barrel and he thinks it could actualy be done for way less than that even.

That would be nice. But even if we could find a way there's still be greedy people out there who will still sell it for $140.00 per barrel.

[PhxSprawler]

Originally Posted by SLC Projects

That would be nice. But even if we could find a way there's still be greedy people out there who will still sell it for $140.00 per barrel.

That's not greed, it is just the going rate (well, $131.78 per barrell at this very moment). That would be great for the economy of Utah (and America) if it can happen, but oil is still a limited resource no matter how it is obtained.

[RFPCME]

Originally Posted by PhxSprawler

That's not greed, it is just the going rate (well, $131.78 per barrell at this very moment). That would be great for the economy of Utah (and America) if it can happen, but oil is still a limited resource no matter how it is obtained.

PhxSprawler: No doubt, there is greed involved in current oil pricing. When you have so few significant suppliers (think DeBeers Diamond cartel) and they are purposefully under-producing to keep prices high, that's greed! The good news in all of this, as was the summation in the NY Times today, now maybe the American public will get it and get on with serious conservation, mass transit, alternative fuels (don't forget nuclear), and better use of existing fossil fuels, including coal and oil shale. I cannot believe that with a serious effort we cannot develop the technology to take out greenhouse gases in coal and develop shale without strip mines, especially at prices over $130 a barrel!
Final arguement, if you don't think there isn't greed involved, look at the skyline in Dubai! At least the Saudi's have enough sense not to rub our noses in it!

[DENrising]

Originally Posted by RFPCME

PhxSprawler: No doubt, there is greed involved in current oil pricing. When you have so few significant suppliers (think DeBeers Diamond cartel) and they are purposefully under-producing to keep prices high, that's greed! The good news in all of this, as was the summation in the NY Times today, now maybe the American public will get it and get on with serious conservation, mass transit, alternative fuels (don't forget nuclear), and better use of existing fossil fuels, including coal and oil shale. I cannot believe that with a serious effort we cannot develop the technology to take out greenhouse gases in coal and develop shale without strip mines, especially at prices over $130 a barrel!
Final arguement, if you don't think there isn't greed involved, look at the skyline in Dubai! At least the Saudi's have enough sense not to rub our noses in it!

This is true, there is greed, and yes, Dubai is a city of oil money. Anyhow, conservation and mass transit should have been the key all along, it is only now when the gas prices are so outrageous that people start complaining. Too bad the government can't come up with a long-term policy, but...you know Washington.

Another point no one has mentioned, look at Europe. They have been living with high gas prices for a long time now. You don't hear them freaking out or see a busted Euro because they actually invested in mass transit along time ago, and yes people do walk and ride bikes too.

That should be the main point here, as this is a Transit thread.

Happy Memorial Day everyone, try not to use too much gas!!

[RFPCME]

SLCrising: Ah, men!

[RC14]

There was an artical in the Deseret News Sunday about the proposed street car line to Sugar House, that got me thinking: "What if we were to extend that line and create one big transit loop connecting all the major shopping districts downtown.

Namely:
Sugar House
9th & 9th
Trolly Square
Main Street
City Creek Center
The Gateway

Here is a map I created using Google Maps:
The Orange lines are TRAX
Blue = currently proposed street car line
Red = My idea opt1
Green = My idea Opt2
Black = Front Runner
[IMG][/IMG]

P.S. Commenting one the current topic: I would like to point out that the Oil Companys make $0.10 per gallon profit, the government makes twice that. Yes there is greed involved but it's not just the oil companys.

[ski_steve]

Nice
It seems to me that it would nice to have some kind of mass transit though 9th and 9th. In my opinion that whole line you have created should be a continuation of this Sugarhouse Trolley, not light rail. It would also be cool to see a line to the Cottonwood Canyons one day as well. It would be nice to see these areas become increasingly transit oriented.

I would almost make it run further east, to Foothill and connect somewhere by the U.

It would also be nice to see some kinda of either light rail or street car running down South Temple from the Med center to downtown.

[PhxSprawler]

Originally Posted by RFPCME

PhxSprawler: No doubt, there is greed involved in current oil pricing. When you have so few significant suppliers (think DeBeers Diamond cartel) and they are purposefully under-producing to keep prices high, that's greed! The good news in all of this, as was the summation in the NY Times today, now maybe the American public will get it and get on with serious conservation, mass transit, alternative fuels (don't forget nuclear), and better use of existing fossil fuels, including coal and oil shale. I cannot believe that with a serious effort we cannot develop the technology to take out greenhouse gases in coal and develop shale without strip mines, especially at prices over $130 a barrel!
Final arguement, if you don't think there isn't greed involved, look at the skyline in Dubai! At least the Saudi's have enough sense not to rub our noses in it!

I see your point, but what would you call a business man selling oil in the fair open market at $90 a barrel when the going rate is $140 a barrel? I would call him an idiot. I think we have different views on the term "greedy," but that is all semantics and circumstance.

Anyhow- it is great that the Wasatch Front is doing something to create options for those not willing to pay the price at the pumps, and I do hope the Mountain states will start to see some of the windfall profits from oil production. I would much rather see oil money benefiting our national economy than another country's, but that is my own greediness.

PS, I like your map RC14! That would be great to use as a tourist, especially if it were free (paid for by the businesses along the line).

[RFPCME]

Originally Posted by PhxSprawler

I see your point, but what would you call a business man selling oil in the fair open market at $90 a barrel when the going rate is $140 a barrel? I would call him an idiot. I think we have different views on the term "greedy," but that is all semantics and circumstance.

Anyhow- it is great that the Wasatch Front is doing something to create options for those not willing to pay the price at the pumps, and I do hope the Mountain states will start to see some of the windfall profits from oil production. I would much rather see oil money benefiting our national economy than another country's, but that is my own greediness.

PS, I like your map RC14! That would be great to use as a tourist, especially if it were free (paid for by the businesses along the line).

PHXSprawler: Beg to disagree, but a cartel is cartel, which is polite name for price fixing, which is illegal in this country and absolutely skews a free-market economy. But the point is, legal or not, if the pricing drives us to fuel conservation, then it is a good thing. What is really beginning to bother me now is that oil is not only fuel but it is a commodity, used in the production of some many basic materials; plastics, paints, coatings, and more. Oil also drives the pricing of transportation, construction (including materials), agriculture and so many other industries. We are beginning to see skyrocketing food and construction materials costs, which portend hyperinflation, which is a direct threat to national security. It's time to take more direct measures with OPEC and others and get the flow moving again.

[murdoc9]

Originally Posted by RC14

^
One of our Utah representitives or senaters, was being interviewed on the Night Side Project. I can't remember who, I think it was Chris Cannon, but anyway he was saying, There is currently a study being done that is expected to prove that oil shale could be developed for less then $30 per barrel and he thinks it could actualy be done for way less than that even.

I always thought Cannon was an idiot when I lived out there. There is no way that Shale can be developed for anywhere near the $30/barrel level. The problems have to do with water, pollution, and most importantly (in terms of cost) energy needed to convert into usable hydrocarbon fuel. Think about how much fuel must be used to power the conversion process and then think about the costs of those inputs. With the additional spectre of pollution controls coming online, most likely in a cap a trade type system which all the presidential candidates support, this looks like a dog.

Cannon is pandering to his constituency, and someone needs to vote that clown out of office.

[WASDEN]

Michael Brandy, Deseret News


'Bus Rapid Transit' coming soon to 3500 South


The white "X" in the bus design looks way cool!

Sounds kind of like a Bus/TRAX hybrid. Signal priority, designated lanes, buy your tickets from kiosks at designated stops and it comes by every 15 minutes. Hopefully 35th will get a much needed makeover at the same time, but I couldn't find any information on that. Anybody have any details?