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  #501  
Old Posted Jan 22, 2019, 5:31 AM
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I always thought the rear end of The Right House was much newer, a 1970s-80s era addition. Looks like it's been there since at least the '30s and was just heavily modified with the orange paneling, window alterations, and the glass extension facing King William.

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Then



vs now

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  #502  
Old Posted Jan 22, 2019, 11:48 PM
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I really feel like Hamilton is especially lucky to still have a building like the Right House and it's severely underappreciated and underutilized.
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  #503  
Old Posted Jan 22, 2019, 11:51 PM
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Originally Posted by matt602 View Post
I really feel like Hamilton is especially lucky to still have a building like the Right House and it's severely underappreciated and underutilized.
You got that right - the building is basically almost entirely underutilized. There is tons of "office" space in hamilton with nobody taking up the real estate. How many of you can actually say you've gone through there lately, or been up in there from the 2nd floor and up?

Also it always kills me when you look at the windows and you can see inside everyone has just covered them up. Natural lighting my ass. At least in the 30s they had nice beautiful drapery in each one.
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  #504  
Old Posted Jan 23, 2019, 12:03 AM
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Buildings like the right house are a dime a dozen in Toronto. Just take a stroll down King St west between Spadina and Niagara. As nice and sweet and local as core urban is, I’d rather see Allied or Riocan take over this block.
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  #505  
Old Posted Jan 23, 2019, 1:19 AM
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Originally Posted by davidcappi View Post
Buildings like the right house are a dime a dozen in Toronto. Just take a stroll down King St west between Spadina and Niagara. As nice and sweet and local as core urban is, I’d rather see Allied or Riocan take over this block.
We're not toronto, and we will never BE toronto - thus you might want to get into the habit of realizing that and stop constantly comparing hamilton to toronto and trying to make hamilton toronto. I realize you work in toronto, but you DO live in hamilton do you not?

Who cares if they're a dime a dozen in toronto? We're not toronto! We thus pride ourselves more in the few buildings like that that we HAVE, esp. the ones in the core, which make up the heritage footprint of the gage park area.

We aren't going to constantly reference toronto to see what THEY did to determine what WE will do - that's party why hamilton has such an insecurity problem, because everyone just sees it as "that city thats not toronto" who judges everything hamilton should be doing on what toronto is doing or has done - we are our own thing - smaller, more blue collar, and more valuing of our heritage- our heritage buildings are what makes us hamilton. We value our history in this city. It's why people shoot movies here, BECAUSE of that kinda stuff. - because we're not like every other steel and glass clone city out there.

And for all you whiners out there that call our behaviour nimbyism - if you don't like it, then LEAVE and go to toronto. We're sick of hearing it. Appreciate the city for what it has to offer, not for what you want to turn it into, which judging from a lot of your guys post is just a clone of new york or toronto with nothing but towering 35 story+ steel and glass skyscrapers. There is a reason people like to live in hamilton - they like it because it's NOT toronto.

Last edited by Chronamut; Jan 23, 2019 at 2:22 AM.
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  #506  
Old Posted Jan 23, 2019, 1:49 AM
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I guess sometimes I just get a little tired of people thinking every building in Hamilton is AmAzInG but it also has to do with my own bitterness and now generally jaded feeling towards the city.

I was pretty fortunate to get to visit a lot of places all over Ontario at my previous job and I got to see a lot of city cores and downtowns, and by comparison Hamilton has one of the most unimpressive remaining collections of historic buildings in the province. This isn't so much a criticism as it is an observation. I was amazed to see that places like Windsor and London had managed to hold on to more substantial buildings, including generally better modernist buildings during the 50s-70s boom.

Toronto and Hamilton in spite their differences share so many similarities when it comes to built form and urban geography that it's hard not to see the two as linked. Hamilton can learn a lot from Toronto when it comes to policy, planning, and especially architectural conservation, but it's unlikely that will happen until the (contagious) bitterness and desperation for an identity figures itself out.

So until then I'm gonna continue to draw parallels based on the way I experience Hamilton and I'm sorry if that makes some people feel insecure.
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  #507  
Old Posted Jan 23, 2019, 2:17 AM
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Originally Posted by davidcappi View Post
I guess sometimes I just get a little tired of people thinking every building in Hamilton is AmAzInG but it also has to do with my own bitterness and now generally jaded feeling towards the city.

I was pretty fortunate to get to visit a lot of places all over Ontario at my previous job and I got to see a lot of city cores and downtowns, and by comparison Hamilton has one of the most unimpressive remaining collections of historic buildings in the province. This isn't so much a criticism as it is an observation. I was amazed to see that places like Windsor and London had managed to hold on to more substantial buildings, including generally better modernist buildings during the 50s-70s boom.

Toronto and Hamilton in spite their differences share so many similarities when it comes to built form and urban geography that it's hard not to see the two as linked. Hamilton can learn a lot from Toronto when it comes to policy, planning, and especially architectural conservation, but it's unlikely that will happen until the (contagious) bitterness and desperation for an identity figures itself out.

So until then I'm gonna continue to draw parallels based on the way I experience Hamilton and I'm sorry if that makes some people feel insecure.
Lets not forget that pretty much all of original downtown hamilton originally burned down, so any buildings before the stone era which came after are pretty much gone forever with only a few exceptions, and even a lot of those stone buildings burned as well leaving only shells - some of our most impressive structures fell victim to fire, and some still do.

That being said yes a lot of old buildings were also demolished because people don't know what to do with them back then - they were too expensive to conserve and so it was just easier to knock them all down. Companies also outgrew them - they needed more space - like the bank building on the corner of king and james. It originally had a few more floors added, and then was just demolished entirely after the merger and made a lot bigger and more modern.

Upon saying that however the 30 year neglect of downtown probably actually did it more good than harm because the sense of conservation we have now didn't exist in the 80s lets say and so a lot of our downtown older buildings woulda have been lost in that modernist craze that claimed so many downtowns older buildings during that time.

And I hear ya - there are a lot of beautiful buildings in other downtowns all across the continent - I probably have them all mentally documented of where every single one of them was in our city - hell the monstrosity that is jackson square took out a good few city blocks in and of itself!

Toronto generally built everything bigger and taller, and they had a bigger city footprint to work with. Thus torontos buildings tend to look a bit more impressive, esp. with all the condos on top of them with the facades integrated into the first few floors - I will give it that.

And yeah I can certainly understand the jaded feeling concerning hamilton - I was jaded too growing up, feeling frustrated that everything was boarded up and rotting and really wanting hamilton to DO something with itself, and now it is, but it's not always so black and white. Change happens but it happens slowly. I'd rather see slow change then really bad decisions imo.

I really do hope that hamilton finally does find an identity, because it desperately needs one now that its steel identity has collapsed. Don't want to see it become toronto, but also don't want to see it become detroit.
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  #508  
Old Posted Jan 23, 2019, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted by davidcappi View Post
.. Just take a stroll down King St west between Spadina and Niagara. As nice and sweet and local as core urban is, I’d rather see Allied or Riocan take over this block.
^^ this x 1000. Allied has saved many buildings in Toronto and profited well.
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  #509  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2019, 1:29 PM
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I agree. Wouldn't mind if it was permanent. Would really at to the street vibe we have going on on King William.
I think it would be brilliant if this section were closed permanently as well but along with King William Street between James North & John St. What this would do is create a safe European streetscape with restaurants, patios, shops, buskers and it would connect people to Gore Park and the new park being built where Lulu Shawarma is. See my crude highlighting on the map below. The existing patios on King William could be slightly enlarged because of this keeping a pathway open still for emergency vehicle access if needed.

This would also be a catalyst I'm sure to fill up the retail in The Right House and would encourage excellent retail in the podium of the new King at Hughson development! It would guarantee to be a very lively area during the nice weather months and a possible tourist draw. Would allow Art Crawl & Supercrawl to expand as well! Win win win if you ask me!

Only possible problem is coming up with a solution for deliveries to some of the businesses that would be affected by the loss of the road access. Maybe designated times? Solutions exist we would just need to find the best for this area.

Thoughts?

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  #510  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2019, 3:02 PM
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...
Only possible problem is coming up with a solution for deliveries to some of the businesses that would be affected by the loss of the road access. Maybe designated times? Solutions exist we would just need to find the best for this area.

Thoughts?
I think it's a great idea to close this street permanently. Expect bitching and moaning lol.

In the pedestrianized areas of some European cities, there are designated times of the day for delivery vehicles. Usually in the morning, before 9:00.
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  #511  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2019, 4:40 PM
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Originally Posted by StEC View Post
I think it would be brilliant if this section were closed permanently as well but along with King William Street between James North & John St. What this would do is create a safe European streetscape with restaurants, patios, shops, buskers and it would connect people to Gore Park and the new park being built where Lulu Shawarma is. See my crude highlighting on the map below. The existing patios on King William could be slightly enlarged because of this keeping a pathway open still for emergency vehicle access if needed.

This would also be a catalyst I'm sure to fill up the retail in The Right House and would encourage excellent retail in the podium of the new King at Hughson development! It would guarantee to be a very lively area during the nice weather months and a possible tourist draw. Would allow Art Crawl & Supercrawl to expand as well! Win win win if you ask me!

Only possible problem is coming up with a solution for deliveries to some of the businesses that would be affected by the loss of the road access. Maybe designated times? Solutions exist we would just need to find the best for this area.

Thoughts?

Absolutely love this idea! I've also thought the city should try to expropriate a strip of land between the south facade of the CIBC Towers to an imaginary line through the parking lot that matches with the south street wall on King facing the Gore….any new building put on that parking lot would need to have street-facing retail both on James and along this new pedestrian promenade connecting Gore Park directly to the MacNab Transit Terminal. With you idea above, this would create a nice simple network of pedestrian prominent spots and places to hang out from MacNab all the way to Catharine St on the Gore, and NE to the new John/Rebecca Park and condo tower on Rebecca.
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  #512  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2019, 5:04 PM
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Originally Posted by LRTfan View Post
Absolutely love this idea! I've also thought the city should try to expropriate a strip of land between the south facade of the CIBC Towers to an imaginary line through the parking lot that matches with the south street wall on King facing the Gore….any new building put on that parking lot would need to have street-facing retail both on James and along this new pedestrian promenade connecting Gore Park directly to the MacNab Transit Terminal. With you idea above, this would create a nice simple network of pedestrian prominent spots and places to hang out from MacNab all the way to Catharine St on the Gore, and NE to the new John/Rebecca Park and condo tower on Rebecca.
Ive thought something similar but would like to take it one step further and say that parking lot should be the new home of a single lovely shiny Commerce Place tower with frontage on the new Gore park expansion where the two towers sit now. Also the entrance to Jackson square could use an overhaul.
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  #513  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2019, 6:41 PM
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Totally agree on the closing of king william except for deliveries etc. I am not so sold on closing hughson st though.. that little stretch between king and king william isn't frequented a lot by pedestrians. I mean it might be a little bit when the new condos and storefronts go up but the right house is still pretty much abandoned inside, and so this lack of businesses to have frequent foot traffic going through is just an invitation for vandals, which has been proven again and again in the past, esp. with the bus stop there.

And that's the other issue, there is a bus route that goes through here, or at least did - I don't take the bus anymore, so that would have to be removed as well.

So sold on king william, not so much on hughson - however, if retail businesses went into the right house I might change that to a yes as well.

Also I am happy that the underground isn't being torn down for the park (to my knowledge anyways) - I know lots of people have issues with it but it's one of the few places that is known for bands to play and I really do like the architecture of the building. That and I do have memories of my childhood form there. Def. glad something is being done about the sea of parking lots though.. now if only they'd do something about the one behind horizon/alectra utilities.. THAT one is the one that sticks out more than any other.
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  #514  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2019, 9:00 PM
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Where is the driveway access to the towers?
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  #515  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2019, 11:07 PM
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Looks great, especially the King William side.
hard to tell with this render, but to get both Hughson and KW ped only, this would need a veh entrance/exit to parking levels off John.
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  #516  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2019, 12:14 AM
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Not a fan of permanent street closures. I think we can accomplish what we want with seasonal or evening or weekend street closings.

Actually, I'd rather have streets where the traffic moves slowly and where people can safely walk or cycle in the streets without fear of being mowed down - more of a 'Naked Streets' idea. I wonder if we already have that with King William or the Gore. Lots of room for improvement, of course...
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  #517  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2019, 12:43 AM
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I like the idea of closing that block of Hughson. What's Liuna's plans for the frontage on Hughson? Actual store fronts?
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  #518  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2019, 4:10 AM
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Where is the driveway access to the towers?
last I checked it was on hughson st - around the area where the old exit of the bingo hall on the side was around where the bus stop was.

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Originally Posted by drpgq View Post
I like the idea of closing that block of Hughson. What's Liuna's plans for the frontage on Hughson? Actual store fronts?
storefronts on each end with the entrance to the internal parking in the middle if I recall correctly. Kinda a similar setup to the royal connaught parking entrance on the side.
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  #519  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2019, 6:11 AM
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last I checked it was on hughson st - around the area where the old exit of the bingo hall on the side was around where the bus stop was.
I really don’t think closing Hughson and KW is feasible then.
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  #520  
Old Posted Jan 27, 2019, 8:48 AM
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I really don’t think closing Hughson and KW is feasible then.
Indeed.
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