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  #61  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 6:43 PM
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Originally Posted by EpicPonyTime View Post
Toronto is a market that is concerned with its image. Why do you think the Blue Jays suddenly became the talk of the town when they became good? It was cool again to be seen wearing a Jays hat, where for twenty years it was embarrassing.

Throw MLSE's media savvy behind the Argos and you can definitely get them past their current image of being a game for old white men from the suburbs. And yes, if Drake supported them there would be people from Toronto who would give them a look. Don't kid yourself.
It's not anymore concerned with its image as any other Canadian market and a fair number of US markets. I would even boldly say Toronto is one of the least concerned with image out of the Canadian markets well known to me. Your analogy doesn't fly. No one likes paying to watch a team going nowhere. That has nothing to with image. The Yankees couldn't draw flies in the late 80s, early 90s either.

That's why the constant whining over Torontonians being embarrassed with the CFL is freaking funny. First. The league can survive without Toronto. Second. There simply aren't very many true fans of the game in Toronto. The stadium is also in the wrong place.
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  #62  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 6:55 PM
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Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper View Post
It's not anymore concerned with its image as any other Canadian market and a fair number of US markets. I would even boldly say Toronto is one of the least concerned with image out of the Canadian markets well known to me. Your analogy doesn't fly. No one likes paying to watch a team going nowhere. That has nothing to with image. The Yankees couldn't draw flies in the late 80s, early 90s either.

That's why the constant whining over Torontonians being embarrassed with the CFL is freaking funny. First. The league can survive without Toronto. Second. There simply aren't very many true fans of the game in Toronto. The stadium is also in the wrong place.
The analogy works fine when you consider that the Argos have been successful yet don't sell tickets, while TFC has largely been the opposite for the majority of their existence. The Argos and league have a negative perception in Toronto that is undeniable. The city wants it's shiny toys, which is true of every city I'll admit, but Toronto takes it to a ridiculous degree. It's the only city I've ever seen where a team wins a championship and the response is ridicule, but that's what the perception of the team is. MLSE can definitely change that by making going to the games appealing and exciting too younger people. That's not debatable.

I don't think the Argos could survive with a stadium in another location (like the suburbs which seems to be where people suggest). How many big teams does Toronto have that don't play in the core? Zero. Moving the team anywhere north of the U of T is a recipe for disaster. Move the team outside of Toronto itself and you lose all hope of reclaiming fan support.
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  #63  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 7:02 PM
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Schedule

Wow, another win for the CFL and Randy Ambrosie

https://www.cfl.ca/schedule
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  #64  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 7:21 PM
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Originally Posted by EpicPonyTime View Post
The analogy works fine when you consider that the Argos have been successful yet don't sell tickets, while TFC has largely been the opposite for the majority of their existence. The Argos and league have a negative perception in Toronto that is undeniable. The city wants it's shiny toys, which is true of every city I'll admit, but Toronto takes it to a ridiculous degree. It's the only city I've ever seen where a team wins a championship and the response is ridicule, but that's what the perception of the team is. MLSE can definitely change that by making going to the games appealing and exciting too younger people. That's not debatable.

I don't think the Argos could survive with a stadium in another location (like the suburbs which seems to be where people suggest). How many big teams does Toronto have that don't play in the core? Zero. Moving the team anywhere north of the U of T is a recipe for disaster. Move the team outside of Toronto itself and you lose all hope of reclaiming fan support.
TFC was never "cool" till about a year ago. From day one, anytime you told someone you liked them, they either had no clue Toronto had a pro soccer team or they'd say that "TFC sucks!" Toronto has a huge underbelly of soccer fandom waiting to be converted so as the quality improves more and more are coming over who already "get" the sport at a good level. It's the entertainment aspect that's converting them bit by bit. The visibility TFC had prior to last year was mainly due to the passion of existing TFC fans. Once you attend a couple games it doesn't take long before you get sucked into it hardcore.
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  #65  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 7:31 PM
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Originally Posted by cjones2451 View Post
Wow, another win for the CFL and Randy Ambrosie

https://www.cfl.ca/schedule
Wow indeed! I don't think the schedule has ever been released so early into the offseason.
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  #66  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 7:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cjones2451 View Post
Wow, another win for the CFL and Randy Ambrosie

https://www.cfl.ca/schedule
I'm amazed they got it out so early... maybe it's happened before, but I can't recall when the schedule was released before Christmas.

The season is longer now in the name of player safety, so we have the preseason starting in late May and the first game in the middle of June. In some respects it's a good way to test the waters for moving the season up even earlier in 2019 once the NFL Network deal is finalized.

Personally I think it'll work... it'll just require some extra marketing dollars to remind fans that football is starting at a time when the Stanley Cup Playoffs are dominating the Canadian sports media.
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  #67  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 7:38 PM
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After a quick review of the schedule, some observations

- No more Wednesday games! All games in the summer are on Thursday, Friday or Saturday.
- There are 2 weeks in the schedule that have 3 teams on bye and therefore, only 3 games to be played.
- Starting Labour Day weekend, there will be no more Thursday night games. (although I think that was mostly typical)
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  #68  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 8:13 PM
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Originally Posted by TimB09 View Post
There will be an NFL Network deal coming up. You're in for a surprise.
Ambrosie makes a comment, and POOF, a short time later, it happens. He's the Doug Henning of commissioners. I don't think it is too early to say Ambrosie>Cohon and that is saying something, because under Cohon's watch things got a lot better.
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  #69  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 8:18 PM
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What is the holdup with scheduling the second Argos preseason game?
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  #70  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 9:18 PM
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What is the holdup with scheduling the second Argos preseason game?
Maybe they're looking at location options for the game? It would be a Toronto home game vs the Redblacks.
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  #71  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 9:28 PM
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What is the holdup with scheduling the second Argos preseason game?
Why delay things for that when they can start selling season tickets with known dates. Hell, they can even be given as Christmas gifts now.
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  #72  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 9:31 PM
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Why delay things for that when they can start selling season tickets with known dates. Hell, they can even be given as Christmas gifts now.
Yeah, as far as I can tell it's the only game yet to be scheduled. I'm assuming it's a question of working out schedule issues with the soccer team?
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  #73  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 9:34 PM
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Originally Posted by esquire View Post
Yeah, as far as I can tell it's the only game yet to be scheduled. I'm assuming it's a question of working out schedule issues with the soccer team?
Looks like they already have, I can't tell you how many posts I've read about the TFC zealots gleefully saying how the Argos were fourth in the pecking order regarding scheduling. I think she's a whole new ballgame now. Besides, with the Argos playing so few games it was a ridiculous thing to say anyway, like TSN wasn't going to get what they wanted.
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  #74  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 10:00 PM
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^ Yeesh! I know it's just a difference of opinion but I think that Als logo is terrible.
The CFL needs to hire a good graphic design firm. In pains me to say this but NFL logos, jerseys, and merchandise is much nicer. It's not even close. For a league that struggles with perception and looking for revenue streams they sure don't do themselves any favours.

The Alouettes logo and jerseys are way too busy. The Argos logo is UGLY. The merchandise is un-purchasable, tacky, low brow garbage. I've been looking for 15 years for something I could buy and only found 1 thing I was willing to wear. I'm seriously contemplating designing something then having it made.
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Last edited by isaidso; Dec 14, 2017 at 10:12 PM.
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  #75  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 10:22 PM
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Exactly! Americans love their football and this is a fix they can fill until September rolls around. And if they love the game, they can keep watching into October and really get their fill of football.
As long as they don't change when the league starts and stops. June to the end of November is when the league plays. Satisfying viewers in a foreign country must always take a back seat to what Canadians want. Canada is the CFL's market so what we want should be front and centre ALWAYS.

Can you imagine the NFL starting their season in December because Canadians are still watching CFL. Outrageous.
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  #76  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 10:31 PM
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^ Thing is the idea of finishing the season in late October/early November sits well with a lot of Canadians... it's certainly been discussed enough in recent years. I think first weekend of November would be perfect for the Grey Cup.
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  #77  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 10:42 PM
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Originally Posted by esquire View Post
^ Thing is the idea of finishing the season in late October/early November sits well with a lot of Canadians... it's certainly been discussed enough in recent years. I think first weekend of November would be perfect for the Grey Cup.
Have they actually polled people? If it's the case that people want it moved they should get what they want. A poll is far better than relying on the amount of complaints. People who want change/don't like something are always far more vocal than people who are fine the way things are.
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World's First Documented Baseball Game: Beachville, Ontario, June 4th, 1838.
World's First Documented Gridiron Game: University College, Toronto, November 9th, 1861.
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Last edited by isaidso; Dec 14, 2017 at 10:52 PM.
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  #78  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 10:42 PM
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Originally Posted by esquire View Post
^ Thing is the idea of finishing the season in late October/early November sits well with a lot of Canadians
Positives, a lot of people like the idea of not being in the cold late season, and a possible large infusion of TV cash. Negatives, too many to mention until I get more time to think about it.

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  #79  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2017, 10:45 PM
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Originally Posted by isaidso View Post
The CFL needs to hire a good graphic design firm. In pains me to say this but NFL logos, jerseys, and merchandise is much nicer. It's not even close. For a league that struggles with perception and looking for revenue streams they sure don't do themselves any favours.

The Alouettes logo and jerseys are way too busy. The Argos logo is UGLY. The merchandise is un-purchasable, tacky, low brow garbage. I've been looking for 15 years for something I could buy and only found 1 thing I was willing to wear. I'm seriously contemplating designing something then having it made.
http://www.nflshop.com/Minnesota_Vik...ed_Sweatshirts

There are some pretty lame options in the above link.

https://www.thebomberstore.com/colle.../mens/Sweaters
https://www.theriderstore.ca/collect...4-mens-hoodies

Equal to or better than the NFL options

http://zonerouge.montrealalouettes.com/us/mens/hoodies/

Definitely the worst selection I've come across.
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  #80  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2017, 3:05 PM
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Interesting little factoid in this Globe ROB article about the MLSE Argonauts acquisition...

Quote:
BCE's financial disclosure from 2015 showed the Argos were purchased for a total of $50-million; even with a Grey Cup win last month, a franchise with the league's worst attendance isn't worth much more now than it was two years ago.
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/repo...ticle37337507/

So with the Argos worth $50 million and a bit (given that a couple years have passed since that value was established), it's probably not much of an exaggeration to say that some of the higher-revenue teams are probably into the nine figures when it comes to value. Of course it's moot because the Roughriders, Bombers and Eskimos are community-owned teams that will never be for sale, but it certainly puts the lie to the idea that CFL teams are near-worthless entities that people could buy for peanuts.

It kind of makes you wonder what the expansion fees will be like for the 10th team.
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