2030 Commonwealth Games?

[thistleclub]

They should at the very least study the idea. Last time they killed even the suggestion to study the proposal/idea.

Over the years the cost of the games has exploded, thanks to Beijing and Sochi. However, there is a movement to control the cost and scale down the event.

To be fair, Beijing and Sochi were the Olympics. But yes, it would benefit from a clear-eyed appraisal.

It's hard to imagine a value-engineered 100th Anniversary of the Commonwealth Games, but it's possible.

Inflation-adjusted, Malaysia's costs on the 1998 Commonwealth Games would come in at $1.1B CAD in 2019.

Inflation-adjusted, Hamilton's costs on the 1930 British Empire Games would come in at $1.392M CAD in 2019.

[Dr Awesomesauce]

What did we build for the 1930 Empire Games?

*Civic Stadium
*Jimmy Thompson
*Perhaps Scott Park and the old baseball and soccer stadia
*The walk-ups across from the park (I believe).

Not sure about anything else.

[SteelTown]

Athletes housing

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.2488...7i13312!8i6656

[thistleclub]

Originally Posted by SteelTown

Athletes housing

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.2488...7i13312!8i6656

One of the appealing but undersold aspects of the bid would be the potential creation of athletes’ residences that would be converted to new affordable housing stock post-Games. Hamilton hosted 400 athletes in 1930, but that number would be 10-12 times higher in 2030. That timeline doesn’t address today’s shortfalls, but it would certainly be of help, and it’s hard to imagine another way of creating that many units in the space of three council terms.

[Dr Awesomesauce]

^It's tempting, believe me.

I think I'm just too old to get caught up in these sorts of things, especially when so little of the conversation is actually about the athletic event itself.

[SteelTown]

They are debating about it now, looks like Merulla is in favour. So it looks positive.

[SteelTown]

Done, council voted unanimously for staff to examine a possible bid for the 2030 Commonwealth Games.

[thistleclub]

Carmens Group will apparently bankroll the bid.

@SamCraggsCBC:

• Brian MacPherson, CEO of the Commonwealth Games, says the games cost $1.5B operational to host the games, plus about $500M for capital. He references another municipal contribution of $150M+, but says the economic spinoff makes it worth it

• The 2017 report showed hosting the games would cost Hamilton millions. @Sam_Merulla said then, "It's a basket of lunacy to even think about talking about this." He likened it to buying a hot tub with a tiki bar when the basement is flooded

• Mercanti's group will look into potential benefits of Hamilton hosting the games & pay to put together a bid. Not the cost of hosting, but the bid. If Hamilton gets the games, city would likely contribute 25% of the hosting cost, whatever that is. Glasgow spent $150M-$300M Cdn

• Merulla says he sees this as a "basket of opportunity" now if it leads to more affordable housing. "I'm concerned too about housing & all that," says Pauls. She moves staff reporting back to GIC with an "outline of the games, potential risks & reward"

• Danko: Can we keep track of staff time? That's an in-kind contribution & community will want to know for transparency. Staff: yes. Anyway, staff report on potentially hosting passes unanimously. In 2017, the vote to bid to host the games failed 10-5

[thistleclub]

After feedback from council (and, later, staff) there may be some rescoping, but Mercanti's pitch seemed to bolt on the "affordable housing" appeal after the fact. His presentation seemed to suggest that there might be cost efficiencies in using McMaster residences — around 3,600 beds — for athletes' accommodations. That savings would obviously come at the cost of new housing construction, which in turn might undermine council support.

[SteelTown]

Commonwealth games officials feel 'excitement and energy' in Hamilton visit

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamil...n100-1.5234711

Commonwealth games officials wrapped up a three-day whirlwind tour of Hamilton Friday as the community continues its campaign to bring the event back to the city where it all began for its 100th anniversary.

The 2030 games mark a milestone for both the games and Hamilton, the city where the first-ever version of the games, then known as the British Empire Games, back in 1930.

Since then, every attempt to spark enthusiasm around hosting the games again has fizzled. But this time a community group called Hamilton100 is leading the pack with a focus on engaging the community and building excitement around the games.

That passion wasn't lost on David Grevemberg, CEO of the Commonwealth Games Federation during his visit to various venues across the city this week.

During a media conference he spoke of a "fantastic swell of enthusiasm, excitement and energy" and said the city could be a "real contender."

"We're really proud to call Hamilton a proud city of the Commonwealth, because the citizens and communities are really benefiting from the power of sport," Grevemberg added, saying the city is home to world-class venues that are already being used to attract business.

100th anniversary no guarantee

As for the idea of circling back to Hamilton for the 100th anniversary, the CEO said doing so would provide an opportunity to showcase how both the games and the city have evolved.

"I think there's some wonderful synergies there. If the planets are aligned and this looks like something that's going to work for everybody … I think there could be some really amazing opportunities."

But, despite the novelty of circling back for such a significant celebration, there's no guarantee the games will wind up in Hamilton.

While the milestone might be important to Canadians, it will most likely be lost on other 70 nations and territories that vote on which city will be host.

"For them it's going to be the 100th anniversary no matter where it's held," pointed out Linda Cuthbert, director of Commonwealth Games Canada and chair of the country's bid and hosting committee.

She said several Canadian cities are interested in hosting the games. Each hopeful will have to submit Part 1 of their hosting plan, including its vision and general ideas around finances and budgeting by Nov. 22.

Part 2 of the plan is due in March and Cuthbert said all levels of government must be on board with a bid before Canada's preferred bid is moved forward internationally.

That's important because while words like "destiny" and "excitement" were tossed around during Friday's update, there are still plenty of unanswered questions around the games.

Hamilton is still at the dialogue stage of the process. The bid is in the exploratory stage meaning the city hasn't locked down the games, let alone been chosen as the Canadian city which will get to try for them.

Business plan will be brought to council in November

Although council has supported Hamilton100's involvement in the bidding process, some councillors are still raising questions about how much of the cost the city will have to carry. Preliminary estimates for the 2018 Commonwealth Games in Australia indicate a price tag of over $1.8 billion. The cost to hold the 2022 games in Birmingham, England is expected to hit about $1.5 million.

Hamilton100 bid president P.J. Mercanti said over the next three months they'll be working to put together a business plan which will be presented to council in November.

He stressed the bid is all about delivering maximum value to Hamilton's citizens, with plans for accessible youth sports programs before and after the games, along with a focus on affordable housing solutions.

Now, thanks to the visit, he added, the team is also armed with new "operating models and efficiencies" passed along by the commonwealth federations which will help reduce the cost of the games and make sure they're "right-sized" for the city.

In the meantime, Mercanti said, the biggest challenge they face is making sure everyone in Hamilton — including council —understands the benefits the games could bring.

"The games are a catalyst for change in the community," he explained. "It's more than just sport. It's about community building."

[Pipedreams]

This might come off as awful, but I am almost excited to having people move on to endlessly debating the merits and cons of this project so that the anti-LRT crowd can move on to something else to fret about.

Although to be honest I am much less in favour of this one; a billion dollars in spending on a one time event. I know there is always the talk about legacy building but I think the vast majority of Olympic cities have failed to do adequately do so in any meaningful way that justifies their cost.

[Dr Awesomesauce]

^How could the Commonwealth Games be $1b?? Silly.

Seriously now, if someone came to me with a ridiculous proposal like that, I'd laugh and send them back to the drawing board...and likely not take any future calls from them!

Those are taxpayer dollars. They have a responsibility to do better. Lay it out for Hamiltonians. Explain to us why this is a worthwhile investment. What problem does this solve for Hamilton? No bs about a 100-year anniversary. Why is this event an absolute necessity for Hamilton?

[king10]

Originally Posted by Dr Awesomesauce

^How could the Commonwealth Games be $1b?? Silly.

Seriously now, if someone came to me with a ridiculous proposal like that, I'd laugh and send them back to the drawing board...and likely not take any future calls from them!

Those are taxpayer dollars. They have a responsibility to do better. Lay it out for Hamiltonians. Explain to us why this is a worthwhile investment. What problem does this solve for Hamilton? No bs about a 100-year anniversary. Why is this event an absolute necessity for Hamilton?

Security and logistics make up a huge part of it. Also there is no stadium with running track in place, olympic size pool etc.

Based on past Olympics, Pan Ams, Commonwealth games $1B is on the cheap side.

[SteelTown]

Since the region has hosted a major sporting event recently, 2015 Pan Am Games, there's a lot of venues Hamilton wouldn't need to build such as velodrome, rowing, etc. The track and field can be a temporary venue to save the cost. Most of the cost for venues would probably be to renovate existing venues such as Tim Hortons Field (perhaps an open roof), Convention Centre, Hamilton Place and Copps.

From the sounds of it, they'll propose a new Athletes Village in order to gain more support from council. Sam Merulla wants more affordable housing and this fits in.

[Djeffery]

Originally Posted by SteelTown

Since the region has hosted a major sporting event recently, 2015 Pan Am Games, there's a lot of venues Hamilton wouldn't need to build such as velodrome, rowing, etc. The track and field can be a temporary venue to save the cost. Most of the cost for venues would probably be to renovate existing venues such as Tim Hortons Field (perhaps an open roof), Convention Centre, Hamilton Place and Copps.

From the sounds of it, they'll propose a new Athletes Village in order to gain more support from council. Sam Merulla wants more affordable housing and this fits in.

Toronto's track and field was at York with mostly temporary stands. Hamilton can probably do similar at Mac, at the track beside Ron Joyce stadium. It's unfortunate that that one side of that track is hard up against the Ron Joyce stands though, so you can't put in a temporary bowl design like Toronto had. But you can steal half the neighbouring rugby field and parking lot and fit a lot of seats in.

[king10]

Originally Posted by Djeffery

Toronto's track and field was at York with mostly temporary stands. Hamilton can probably do similar at Mac, at the track beside Ron Joyce stadium. It's unfortunate that that one side of that track is hard up against the Ron Joyce stands though, so you can't put in a temporary bowl design like Toronto had. But you can steal half the neighbouring rugby field and parking lot and fit a lot of seats in.

I'm not sure I see that working. Half the track is landlocked by Ron Joyce stadium(as you alluded to) plus Ivor Wynne Centre. You may be able to get temporary seating around 50% of the track but the issue becomes you need a permanent structure for the media, tv etc which doesn't exist plus meeting minimum seating capacity. Commonwealth Games Bid requirements state a 40,000 seat stadium is required for athletics which is significantly higher than the Pan Ams. https://pub-hamilton.escribemeetings...umentId=193904

Below is the area around Mac we're talking about.

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Ro...!4d-79.9169964

Also I don't believe that Mac track is up to standards, it's only 8 lanes and Commonwealth may require 9. It's already very cramped and difficult to expand.

Another complication is you need a nearby warm up track which Mac does not have. York used the already established toronto track and field centre on its property.

For the above reasons I think you would need something entirely new, and probably temporary because we don't need a 40,000 seat athletics stadium. Maybe Burlington would be interested in a 10,000 seat permanent athletic stadium with 30,000 temp seats?

[Djeffery]

Originally Posted by king10

I'm not sure I see that working. Half the track is landlocked by Ron Joyce stadium(as you alluded to) plus Ivor Wynne Centre. You may be able to get temporary seating around 50% of the track but the issue becomes you need a permanent structure for the media, tv etc which doesn't exist plus meeting minimum seating capacity. Commonwealth Games Bid requirements state a 40,000 seat stadium is required for athletics which is significantly higher than the Pan Ams. https://pub-hamilton.escribemeetings...umentId=193904

Below is the area around Mac we're talking about.

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Ro...!4d-79.9169964

Also I don't believe that Mac track is up to standards, it's only 8 lanes and Commonwealth may require 9. It's already very cramped and difficult to expand.

Another complication is you need a nearby warm up track which Mac does not have. York used the already established toronto track and field centre on its property.

For the above reasons I think you would need something entirely new, and probably temporary because we don't need a 40,000 seat athletics stadium. Maybe Burlington would be interested in a 10,000 seat permanent athletic stadium with 30,000 temp seats?

Cool, I wasn't aware the CG wanted so many more seats for track as the Pan-Ams, which was probably no more than 10,000 seats at York. Interesting note at the bottom of that sheet about one facility being branded as "Commonwealth" going forward after the games. We have that here in London where 18 years after the Canada Summer Games, the aquatic centre is still called the Canada Games Aquatic Centre. I guess that might explain why the football stadium in Edmonton hasn't been corporately named.

[ChildishGavino]

Originally Posted by Djeffery

Cool, I wasn't aware the CG wanted so many more seats for track as the Pan-Ams, which was probably no more than 10,000 seats at York. Interesting note at the bottom of that sheet about one facility being branded as "Commonwealth" going forward after the games. We have that here in London where 18 years after the Canada Summer Games, the aquatic centre is still called the Canada Games Aquatic Centre. I guess that might explain why the football stadium in Edmonton hasn't been corporately named.

It technically is. During Eskimo games only, the place is referred to The Brick Field @ Commonwealth Stadium, a name so stupid I don't know why they'd even pay for it.

[king10]

Originally Posted by Djeffery

Cool, I wasn't aware the CG wanted so many more seats for track as the Pan-Ams, which was probably no more than 10,000 seats at York. Interesting note at the bottom of that sheet about one facility being branded as "Commonwealth" going forward after the games. We have that here in London where 18 years after the Canada Summer Games, the aquatic centre is still called the Canada Games Aquatic Centre. I guess that might explain why the football stadium in Edmonton hasn't been corporately named.

Ya pan am track stadium was 12,500.

[SantaClo]

https://www.hamiltonnews.com/news-st...spthrhhbwldvsi

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