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  #1  
Old Posted: Dec 4, 2006, 5:03 AM
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Following L.A.'s script

It's the LA Times 125th Anniversary and there is an interesting article on the future of cities and Los Angeles' specific impact on it. It kind of makes me sad that they refer to both CityWalk and The Grove as the "future" of cities.

from: http://www.latimes.com/news/local/hi...home-headlines

Following L.A.'s script
From its earliest boom-town days, Los Angeles has always sold itself as the city of the future. Thanks to its changeable nature and international status, it's still a model for how contemporary urban

By David L. Ulin, Times Staff Writer
December 3, 2006

Totally citified


The hangout, redefined


- What L.A. gave the world
A decade or so ago, I went with my father to a Friday night concert in a Cape Cod town. It was August, and the village green — an expanse of grass stretching off Main Street — was packed with vacationers and locals, all eating hot dogs and drinking sodas, reveling in the coolness of the evening air. In the midst of this, four men stood beneath a gazebo, playing old-time standards: "Let Me Call You Sweetheart," "In the Good Old Summertime." After a few songs, I turned to my father and said, with something akin to revelation, "It's like a living turn-of-the-century museum."

My father took great exception to this notion, especially when I went on to suggest that, if such towns represented the past — a last glimpse of the way we once lived in this country — then Southern California was emblematic of the future, with its inevitable growth and sprawl. "God forbid," I think he said, which is probably how a lot of Americans feel. But the idea of Los Angeles as harbinger of the future is hardly outrageous, and has little to do with the region's traditional booster ethos, the hype that tells us we live in a city outside history, in which the old rules no longer apply. Rather, Southern California's purchase on the future has everything to do with history — with geographic history, with demographic history, with the history of technology, with our sense of this place as a final landscape, the last territory on the American continent, where we must finally face ourselves because there is nowhere else to run.

This futuristic sensibility is a big part of how Los Angeles has always sold itself, from the first real estate boom of the 1880s to the rise of the movie business and beyond. As far back as 1904, when a syndicate of leading citizens (including Henry Huntington, E.H. Harriman and Harrison Gray Otis) got the rights to buy up huge swaths of the San Fernando Valley, L.A. was a city with its eye on the future, a city on the make.

Yes, this was an inside deal, one that ultimately yielded more than $100 million in profits because of the syndicate's secret knowledge of a plan to irrigate the arid Valley with water from the Owens River. Still, in its aftermath, Los Angeles became the template for an entirely new kind of city, horizontal, sprawling, defined less by steel and masonry than by speed and light. Nature, for the first time, was no longer an obstacle, but a challenge to be overcome. Need water? Import it. Need to connect the most far-flung districts of the megalopolis? Build a network of roads, of freeways, and in the process redefine the relationship between the city and its geography.

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It's no understatement to suggest that the future identity of L.A. can be traced to the Valley land deal, which set in motion a whole host of developments that continue to unfold to this day. In that sense, it was the syndicate's ability to conceptualize the future, and the role of Los Angeles within it, that set the stage for much that was to come.

Such a future, to be sure, has not always been bright or sunny; it often comes at quite a cost. In the case of the Valley, the price was the Owens Valley, and the lingering implications of a water war that, in one form or another, has gone on for 100 years. But before we judge the past too harshly, it's important to remember that history is complicated, and that events, once set in motion, play out in a variety of ways.

Whatever we think about its origins, Los Angeles is now a laboratory for both our nightmares and our dreams. The city's sprawl, its apparent shapelessness, has for better or worse become a model for how contemporary urban landscapes work, with its de-emphasis of the center in favor of a constellation of satellite communities.

Meanwhile, L.A.'s ethnic and cultural diversity has made it a new kind of international city, belying the mythos of the melting pot in favor of something far more elusive and profound. That's a key development, because it suggests the way the rest of the country — indeed, the world — is going, as borders become increasingly fluid and we elide into an economy of global scale.

More to the point, Southern California's diversity adds up to a wealth of experience, of identities, that makes L.A. a city without a defining narrative. Detractors like to highlight this as emblematic of our essential rootlessness, but as usual, they miss the point. Instead, it's a three-dimensional expression of the notion that in Los Angeles, like everywhere, we are all just making it up as we go along.

Like it or not, of course, the detractors have no choice but to deal with us, as L.A.'s aesthetic spreads. You can see it in every mall, every planned community, in the blurring of so-called high and mass culture, in the ascendancy of noir. Most tellingly, Los Angeles has begun to influence the way even the most traditional cities are reconfiguring themselves — just take a look at Times Square. In his 1998 book "Team Rodent: How Disney Devours the World," Carl Hiaasen lamented Times Square's reinvention as "home to MTV, Condé Nast, Morgan Stanley, the world's biggest Marriott hotel, the Ford Center for the Performing Arts, and soon a Madame Tussaud's wax museum…. The dissolute, sticky-shoed ambience of Forty-second Street has been subjugated by the gleamingly wholesome presence of the Disney Store." Yet if Hiaasen was on the right track, he missed the larger picture; it's not Disney that's the template, but the Grove.

Ever since the opening of Universal CityWalk in 1993, Los Angeles has been on the cutting edge of what social theorist Norman M. Klein calls "scripted spaces" — sites that eclipse the line between public and private, designed to resemble organic urban settings when they are, in fact, elaborately planned. The re-development of Santa Monica's Third Street Promenade is emblematic of this concept, as is Beverly Hills' Two Rodeo and, indeed, the Grove. The new Times Square is just a larger, gaudier scripted landscape, reconstructed almost entirely in the style of L.A. What does it say when New York, which as much as any city thrives in opposition to Los Angeles, adopts a quintessential Southern California strategy to revitalize one of its most iconic sites? It can only mean that the future starts with us.

In 1991, shortly after I moved to Southern California, I interviewed Carolyn See at her Topanga Canyon home. During the conversation, she said some things about Los Angeles that helped to clarify the way I thought. First, she told me that L.A. was its own place, fundamentally different from other cities, where "you don't go down to the cafe and drink a lot of coffee…. You get in the car, drive for an hour, have a long leisurely lunch in a beautiful yard." Then, she cited Paris in the 1920s, envisioning Los Angeles in the 2020s as a city that might have a similar sort of influence and reach.

Fifteen years later, See's assessment remains not just possible but prescient, although I might give it a slightly different turn.

Yes, L.A. is a city of global impact. And yes, we are a testing ground for the future: our own, and that of cities everywhere. I don't think, however, that Los Angeles will ever be like Paris. Instead, it is Paris (as well as New York, Chicago, London, you name it) that will — that have already — become increasingly like L.A.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
david.ulin@latimes.com
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  #2  
Old Posted: Dec 4, 2006, 5:13 AM
Buckeye Native 001 Buckeye Native 001 is offline
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I love L.A. but it is not, and should not be considered, the "city of the future"
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  #3  
Old Posted: Dec 4, 2006, 5:37 AM
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L.A. used to be the city of the future. Now it is the city of the present since many other cities have caught up to it. But to give it credit.....it did get there first.
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Old Posted: Dec 4, 2006, 5:58 AM
Buckeye Native 001 Buckeye Native 001 is offline
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But is "there" a good place to be? Our mass transit is developing but still sucks, neighborhoods and infrastructure continue to fall apart, hardly anyone can afford to live here, and all this city needs is another disaster like an earthquake before it's citizens come unglued.
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  #5  
Old Posted: Dec 4, 2006, 6:07 AM
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Well LA has a palimpsest of transportion. It went from massive mass transit, to massive car transit.
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  #6  
Old Posted: Dec 4, 2006, 6:13 AM
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I would hardly call Los Angeles the city of the future, for all that I think it's a fantastic place.
These succinct comments:
Quote:
But is "there" a good place to be? Our mass transit is developing but still sucks, neighborhoods and infrastructure continue to fall apart, hardly anyone can afford to live here, and all this city needs is another disaster like an earthquake before it's citizens come unglued.
express everything that I would have said. When I think "city of the future" I very definitely think of centralized urban planning that goes up, not out, since common sense dictates that the scarcity of land increases at a historically exponential rate. Chicago and NYC definitely win that battle, as they have the historic grid-pattern at every part.
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Old Posted: Dec 4, 2006, 6:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bryson662001
L.A. used to be the city of the future. Now it is the city of the present since many other cities have caught up to it. But to give it credit.....it did get there first.
Well, no, not really. Chicago and NYC had their suburbs in place a very long time before Los Angeles did. I suppose you can credit some technological implementations to Los Angeles, but mostly in regards to computers and traffic electronics. And Paris/London/Other European cities are several centuries older than Los Angeles. I have not seen a compelling argument in the original article which shows some trait that Los Angeles had before these older cities, unless a Village Green with a Sunday fair is somehow the only distinguishing feature?
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Old Posted: Dec 4, 2006, 7:07 AM
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This article is absurd. It offers no supporting evidence for its statement that the reinvention of Times Square was influenced by a few pre-fabricated malls in Los Angeles. Further, the article's assertion that a completely unsustainable, poorly conceived plan of urban development is somehow "cutting-edge" is laughable. Oh but I forgot, LA is an "entirely new kind of city, horizontal, sprawling, defined less by steel and masonry than by speed and light."
pfft! Speed and light. Give me a break.
I like LA a lot, but as a model for future urban development, never.

Last edited by hoju; Dec 4, 2006 at 7:17 AM.
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Old Posted: Dec 4, 2006, 9:49 AM
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love it or hate it, I'd have to agree with the general point of the article. I think the idea of LA as the birthplace or epicenter of synthetic realities signals the move of the modern city away beyond being a manifestation of solely physical urban form, into the abstract where the physical form is manufactured to resemble some non-native theme or concept. In other words, it's now the virtual theme that becomes the primary driver of the physical form, rather than what has traditionally been some concrete physical necessity. I really think that the advent of virtual space and the dissemination of information/culture within it (the internet) is going to change the way we think about our physical reality - and no question LA is at the forefront of that, for better or worse. It is a fact that modern Times Square is an icon modeled and fabricated on a historic template. The Times square of today is not the original - it's every bit the plastic, manufactured theme that those horrible "lifestyle centers" we have in LA are. Our "rediscovery" of the urban living is also an historicist romantic theme - it stands in stark contrast to the economic reality of modern America, and it's a product that only the upper crust can purchase. Transportation and sustainability were never pillars of this argument to begin with, and so there's no need discredit the article on the basis of that presupposition.

And scribeman, NY and Chicago had suburbs early, but they were never auto-oriented cities at the core. LA is the archetypical decentralized, disseminated city.

Last edited by edluva; Dec 4, 2006 at 10:41 AM.
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  #10  
Old Posted: Dec 4, 2006, 11:24 AM
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The article isn't about centralized versus uncentralized urban models. Ulin isn't arguing that. He's talking about "scripted spaces". But in terms of urban models, suburbanity isn't what LA started. But having rows of houses while abandoning and surviving without a central core is what LA began. Bring urbanity and business from the core and into the suburbs is the LA creation. Nowadays, it's abandoning even that model and evolving into a multinodal urban model, hence the revival of Long Beach, downtown and Hollywood. For that, LA is a pioneer for other cities that will eventually reach geographic limits: the evolution into a multinodal urban model. In that way, it's still a city of the future for post-war cities in its pliability going from central-cored city to non-cored city to a hybrid of the two (multicentered). Whether that is going to be the sustainable model is too soon to tell, but I see sprawled cities eventually following this trend as well.

Last edited by ocman; Dec 4, 2006 at 11:43 AM.
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  #11  
Old Posted: Dec 4, 2006, 7:19 PM
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The Bay Area's growth pattern in recent years has been more or less following the "model" that Los Angeles built - decentralized auto-dependent sprawl out to the furthest reaches of the Central Valley (Stockton, Tracy, etc) and also along the I-80 corridor to Sacramento.
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  #12  
Old Posted: Dec 4, 2006, 10:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckeye Native 001
But is "there" a good place to be? Our mass transit is developing but still sucks, neighborhoods and infrastructure continue to fall apart, hardly anyone can afford to live here, and all this city needs is another disaster like an earthquake before it's citizens come unglued.
Very high cost of housing and on top of that its difficult to not own a car and hence have all the costs associated with it, no thanks.
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Old Posted: Dec 5, 2006, 4:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicago103
Very high cost of housing and on top of that its difficult to not own a car and hence have all the costs associated with it, no thanks.
There is a reason the housing costs are high outhere. Its because a lot of people want to live here.

This is also related to the fact that more millionaires live out here than any place else in the USA.

Public tranisit is not as bad as most think. We are constructing a train system that is almost as big as Chicago's already ever if the West side is still poorly served.

As for the City of the future, I still believe that more national trends for better or worse start out here than in any other city.
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Old Posted: Dec 5, 2006, 5:46 AM
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There are a lot of people who live without cars in Los Angeles, and by choice. What many people speak of as Los Angeles is not part of the city of LA. These folks live in the burbs and have not clue about taking the bus or trains around the city of LA.

They live in the suburbs, and yes its true the service isn't the best in the burbs, just like any other big city burbs. I've taken the buses and trains in the city of LA and its not bad. I said it before and I'll say it again, LA's MTA at the present time is much better than most public transporation agencies in this country. In addtion to the MTA, there are several other transit agencies in the metro that are pretty good such as the Santa Monica Blue Bus, Long Beach Transit, Foothill Transit, Torrance. There are others but these are the top ones I can think of right now.

Here in Long Beach, not only are we serviced by the Long Beach Transit, but the MTA, Torrance Transit, LADOT, and even Orange County has a line that runs into downtown Long Beach. So we're not lacking as some of you migh think. I also know a good number of people who own cars as well, but also use public transportation to commute to work.

Anyway some people need to get off their high horse. Its fine you like where you live, but you don't have to put down another city to elevate where you live. That forumer know who he is, please its getting old we all know what your views are now, no need to express it in every thread.
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Old Posted: Dec 6, 2006, 10:35 PM
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Originally Posted by ChrisLA
There are a lot of people who live without cars in Los Angeles, and by choice. What many people speak of as Los Angeles is not part of the city of LA. These folks live in the burbs and have not clue about taking the bus or trains around the city of LA.

They live in the suburbs, and yes its true the service isn't the best in the burbs, just like any other big city burbs. I've taken the buses and trains in the city of LA and its not bad. I said it before and I'll say it again, LA's MTA at the present time is much better than most public transporation agencies in this country. In addtion to the MTA, there are several other transit agencies in the metro that are pretty good such as the Santa Monica Blue Bus, Long Beach Transit, Foothill Transit, Torrance. There are others but these are the top ones I can think of right now.

Here in Long Beach, not only are we serviced by the Long Beach Transit, but the MTA, Torrance Transit, LADOT, and even Orange County has a line that runs into downtown Long Beach. So we're not lacking as some of you migh think. I also know a good number of people who own cars as well, but also use public transportation to commute to work.

Anyway some people need to get off their high horse. Its fine you like where you live, but you don't have to put down another city to elevate where you live. That forumer know who he is, please its getting old we all know what your views are now, no need to express it in every thread.
I didnt mean to insult the city of LA on a whole, I am just lamenting the plight of people who want to live a location efficient lifestyle without cars. Now I know as well as anyone that it is easier to live without a car than the masses make it seem to be, this applies to virtually anywhere, including LA. Now that being said I still think it is more difficult to live car free in LA because you have to orient your life around mass transit which as of now is only in small corridors along the transit lines. I know you can argue the same can be said of Chicago but the difference is that Chicago has alot more centralized employment in its CBD. In LA downtown is transit accessible but can the same be said of Century City? In addition there are countless other employment centers in LA, many of which can be hard to get to without a car. Now can a person when he or she is looking for a white collar professional job realistically limit their job search to transit accessible areas? In this country the only places where you can do that without seriously limiting your job options is Manhattan and downtown Chicago, sure Chicago has plenty of suburban employment centers as well but its fairly easy to ignore them because downtown Chicago is so huge. I have heard on here that even in cities like Philly it would be unrealistic to contain your job search to the CBD, especially if you are a married couple in need of two jobs.
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Old Posted: Dec 7, 2006, 5:55 AM
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Funny thing is that when I am in LA, I am struck at how much it reminds me of the edges of Chicago and certain high dense suburbs of Chicago, like Evergreen Park and Oak Lawn. Both came of age at about the same time. Much of Los Angeles proper is pretty high density similar to Chicago's bungalow belt. In particular the commercial strips seem more dense than comparable areas of Chicago.

Ofcourse LA has meager density in its CBD and has nothing comparable in density to the Chicago lakefront and Northside.

But once you hit the burbs, LA has much greater density than the suburbia of Chicago, an issue that has been much discussed.
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Old Posted: Dec 7, 2006, 5:59 AM
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Los Angeles certainly does have density comparable to Chicago's lakefront and north side. We've been over this a thousand times on this forum, but I realize you're new.

There are 202.85 square miles within Los Angles city limits that contain 3,035,598 people, for an averaged population density of 14,965 persons per square mile over that land area, and there are smaller areas within that are much more dense than that average.

Code:
Geographical Area -- Year -- Square Miles Area --Population -- Population per Square Mile -- 

Westlake 2000 3.18 106,710 33,543 
Wilshire 2000 13.85 292,101 21,097 
South Central Los Angeles 2000 15.48 260,095 16,797 
Southeast Los Angeles 2000 15.44 254,976 16,509
Boyle Heights 2000 6.03 86,735 14,377 
Palms-Mar Vista-Del Rey 2000 7.95 110,044 13,834 
Central 2000 128.21 1,752,024 13,665 
West Adams-Baldwin Hills-Leimert Park 2000 12.71 172,913 13,605
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Old Posted: Dec 7, 2006, 3:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicago103 View Post
I didnt mean to insult the city of LA on a whole, I am just lamenting the plight of people who want to live a location efficient lifestyle without cars. Now I know as well as anyone that it is easier to live without a car than the masses make it seem to be, this applies to virtually anywhere, including LA. Now that being said I still think it is more difficult to live car free in LA because you have to orient your life around mass transit which as of now is only in small corridors along the transit lines. I know you can argue the same can be said of Chicago but the difference is that Chicago has alot more centralized employment in its CBD. In LA downtown is transit accessible but can the same be said of Century City? In addition there are countless other employment centers in LA, many of which can be hard to get to without a car. Now can a person when he or she is looking for a white collar professional job realistically limit their job search to transit accessible areas? In this country the only places where you can do that without seriously limiting your job options is Manhattan and downtown Chicago, sure Chicago has plenty of suburban employment centers as well but its fairly easy to ignore them because downtown Chicago is so huge. I have heard on here that even in cities like Philly it would be unrealistic to contain your job search to the CBD, especially if you are a married couple in need of two jobs.
You can definitely can live in San Francisco without a car... however New York (Manhattan to be exact) is really the king of the carless city in the U.S. There are some cities where you can live without a car... then there's Manhattan, where its basically prohibitively expensive to own a car.
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Old Posted: Dec 8, 2006, 12:07 AM
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Funny thing is that when I am in LA, I am struck at how much it reminds me of the edges of Chicago and certain high dense suburbs of Chicago, like Evergreen Park and Oak Lawn. Both came of age at about the same time. Much of Los Angeles proper is pretty high density similar to Chicago's bungalow belt. In particular the commercial strips seem more dense than comparable areas of Chicago.

Ofcourse LA has meager density in its CBD and has nothing comparable in density to the Chicago lakefront and Northside.

But once you hit the burbs, LA has much greater density than the suburbia of Chicago, an issue that has been much discussed.
Well, midwesterners were the ones who basically built Los Angeles' central core. That's why there's a sensible downtown, and everything else beyond that goes to hell.
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Old Posted: Dec 8, 2006, 12:50 AM
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As the post oil era approaches it will be interesting to see if LA can keep up or if it becomes the city of the past.
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