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  #21  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2008, 4:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zilla View Post
I understand that routing the TCH in the vicinity of McKnight was a preferred option for TCH planners when it was built in the 50s, but the 16th Avenue businesses lobbied for the current route, fearing loss of business traffic. It was a much smaller city back then, eh?
Definitely. The routing on the west side by the University was originally planned to run down 24th (hence the extra wide corridor) from what I recall, then down the hill to where 16th is in Montgomery and out the city that way.
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  #22  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 1:22 AM
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Originally Posted by freeweed View Post
Seriously?? I figured I'd go with the conservative estimate at 80.

Surprising we'll see a 100 road with lights, but I guess the Deerfoot was like that too until recently.

OK, so the ring road will be MUCH faster than 16th, not just a lot faster.
The Inland Island Highway on VAncouver Island is 110 km/h with lights.
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  #23  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 2:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Jarrod View Post
The Inland Island Highway on VAncouver Island is 110 km/h with lights.
Yeah.. I meant within the confines of a city. I've been on many 100kph highways with lights, believe me - I grew up on the prairies, after all! We even have stop signs on 100 routes (not making this up).
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  #24  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 4:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Boris2k7 View Post
I have put this forward already, but I believe that upgrading already-existing highways to reroute the TCH down to Glenmore would be a reasonable solution.

Click to Enlarge


This is in recognition of the fact that, realistically, Glenmore is the only E-W route directly through Calgary that could be turned fully into a limited-access freeway. And that drivers, unless forced otherwise, will probably choose to go through the city than around it.
Interesting idea Boris. I always assumed if Glenmore was to become the new TCH route it would be done via 16th Ave - Sarcee - Glenmore (as someone also mentioned). I think your route is a better one but there would likely be some resistance from lower Springbank residents, might have to bring it out Hwy 8 further. It also wouldn't be the most scenic route through the east side industrial area along Glenmore.

Mersar: Thanks for explaining the wide ROW for 24th Ave - interesting.
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  #25  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 4:40 AM
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Originally Posted by freeweed View Post
Yeah.. I meant within the confines of a city. I've been on many 100kph highways with lights, believe me - I grew up on the prairies, after all! We even have stop signs on 100 routes (not making this up).
Only on the Canadian praries.
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  #26  
Old Posted Mar 14, 2008, 5:33 AM
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As already mentioned, rerouting the TCH via Glenmore Trail would only add a nominal distance but greatly improve travelling through Calgary. There are enough links out there pointing to Sarcee & Glenmore Trails being full freeways between Calgary's eastern & western city limits, so the only project that isn't on the books is an eastern Glenmore Trail extension to TCH 1.

Compliments of the City of Calgary
Graves Bridge Twinning
Glenmore Trail Corridor (Blackfoot Tr to Barlow Tr) - click on Open House 3 to see some maps

East of Calgary (Compliments of Rocky View MD)
Shepard Area Structure Plan - fast forward to page 80

Compliments of Alberta Transportation
Deerfoot Trail & Blackfoot Trail interchange reconfigerations
West Ring Road Interchanges - includes Stoney Trail SW, Sarcee Tr, and 37 St SW
East Freeway Interchange

There are no links, but you can probably bet there are will utimatly be interchanges at 52 St SE and 68 St SE, the only signals on Glenmore Trail not addressed in the above links.

As for Sarcee Trail? Here is a study for interchanges at Richmond Rd, 17 Ave SW, and Bow Trail.
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  #27  
Old Posted Mar 15, 2008, 5:42 AM
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Thanks for the boatload of info and links.
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  #28  
Old Posted Mar 15, 2008, 9:39 PM
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Is it really so bad that people traveling through our fair city are burdened by a few traffic lights and a slower speed limit? I mean, this place is in the middle of nowhere in the grand scheme of things, so why not slow down and take in the awesomeness that is Calgary. What else is there?

Any upgrades should be done with the interests of the people using the infrastructure daily, first and foremost.
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  #29  
Old Posted Mar 15, 2008, 9:54 PM
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Originally Posted by defaultuser View Post
Any upgrades should be done with the interests of the people using the infrastructure daily, first and foremost.
Any highway traffic taken off of innercity roads is in the interest of people who live in those areas, first and foremost.

Catering to suburban commuters is secondary.
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  #30  
Old Posted Mar 16, 2008, 6:22 PM
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Whatever the TCH route through the city is (or becomes) I really hope they landscape the crap out of it. The trees along 16th Ave east between Barlow and 52nd are brutal. And get rid of the lights at 19th and the Deerfoot interchange while they are at it.
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  #31  
Old Posted Mar 16, 2008, 6:30 PM
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Actually, if 16th Ave remains the TCH this is what I would like to see:
1. Complete the widening and "Boulevard" improvements currently underway between 10th St. NW and 6th St NE.
2. Make the route free flow (no lights) coming in from the west all the way to Crowchild Tr.
3. Change the current alignment east of shouldice Park to Bowness Road to get the highway away from the river and avoid having to by out business owners along this stretch. Link it back up west of Shagannappi.
4. Complete free flow from 6th St. east out of the city with a "Grand" bridge over the Deerfoot ravine.
5. And like I said before - LANDSCAPE THE SHIT OUT OF THE ENTIRE ROUTE !

That is my pipe dream anyway.
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  #32  
Old Posted Mar 16, 2008, 7:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by craner View Post
Actually, if 16th Ave remains the TCH this is what I would like to see:
1. Complete the widening and "Boulevard" improvements currently underway between 10th St. NW and 6th St NE.
2. Make the route free flow (no lights) coming in from the west all the way to Crowchild Tr.
3. Change the current alignment east of shouldice Park to Bowness Road to get the highway away from the river and avoid having to by out business owners along this stretch. Link it back up west of Shagannappi.
4. Complete free flow from 6th St. east out of the city with a "Grand" bridge over the Deerfoot ravine.
5. And like I said before - LANDSCAPE THE SHIT OUT OF THE ENTIRE ROUTE !

That is my pipe dream anyway.
Aside from tying off the western portal of AB-1 at Sarcee Trail instead of Crowchild to keep the Bownesians and Montgummers from descending on City Hall with pitchforks and molten lead, I would strongly suspect that your pipe dream is pretty much how it's going to look in the end.
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  #33  
Old Posted Mar 16, 2008, 9:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mersar View Post
Definitely. The routing on the west side by the University was originally planned to run down 24th (hence the extra wide corridor) from what I recall, then down the hill to where 16th is in Montgomery and out the city that way.
I found this on "Alberta Roads", is this what you're talking about?

http://albertaroads.homestead.com/Ca...ans/index.html

It shows the proposed Trans Canada Highway as well as the proposed Bow Trail through downtown.
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  #34  
Old Posted Mar 16, 2008, 9:37 PM
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Thats another plan I hadn't seen, the one I had seen had continued along 24th after Crowchild then across Shaganappi, and hooked back into 16th just west of 53rd street. Most of the rest was similar.

Looking at those plans I am glad they weren't fully built out, especially the interchange at Crowchild which would have erased all of McMahon Stadium plus probably a good portion of Foothills Athletic Park. Other parts such as the full interchanges with flyovers would have been nice to have though, especially since that type of design is whats needed now (for instance imagine if the full flyover interchange labeled for 24th and Blackfoot was built to replace what exists at 16th and Deerfoot today)
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  #35  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 12:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mersar View Post
Thats another plan I hadn't seen, the one I had seen had continued along 24th after Crowchild then across Shaganappi, and hooked back into 16th just west of 53rd street. Most of the rest was similar.

Looking at those plans I am glad they weren't fully built out, especially the interchange at Crowchild which would have erased all of McMahon Stadium plus probably a good portion of Foothills Athletic Park. Other parts such as the full interchanges with flyovers would have been nice to have though, especially since that type of design is whats needed now (for instance imagine if the full flyover interchange labeled for 24th and Blackfoot was built to replace what exists at 16th and Deerfoot today)

Forget about McMahon, that plan would have completely destroyed every neighbourhood on the north side of 16th, Banff Trail, Capital Hill, etc etc. We dodged a major bullet there, although, nothing ever planned for Calgary can compete with the horror show that Edmonton avoided:

http://albertaroads.homestead.com/ed...testagekey.jpg

"Ultimate Stage" ha, more like "Final Solution."
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  #36  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 1:13 AM
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To paraphrase Brampton Billy Davis in his assessment of another motorway scheme in 1971:

Quote:
If we are building a transportation system to serve the automobile, the Trans Canada Highway Freeway Plan would be a good place to start. But if we are building a transportation system to serve people, the Trans Canada Highway Freeway Plan is a good place to stop.
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  #37  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 1:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by craner View Post
Actually, if 16th Ave remains the TCH this is what I would like to see...

2. Make the route free flow (no lights) coming in from the west all the way to Crowchild Tr.
I'm with Beltliner here, this wouldn't be for the best. 16th between Sarcee and Bowness Road has a lot of potential. I'm pretty sure a former group partner of mine worked on a pretty neat concept plan for the area, I'll try to dig it up.
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  #38  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 3:19 AM
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Originally Posted by jeffwhit View Post
Forget about McMahon, that plan would have completely destroyed every neighbourhood on the north side of 16th, Banff Trail, Capital Hill, etc etc.
As someone who not only lives in Tuxedo, but actually right on 24th ave NW, all I can say is "thank god'!

That said an interesting benefit for me is that the city did include an extra large ROW on our street so my front and back yard is significantly larger than other avenues in the area. Though much of that extra space is actually owned by the city, the truth is that I get to live inner city on an extra large lot!

Regarding that Edmonton proposal - crap, were they on crack back then?? Ditto for the Calgary proposal - nice finds.
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Last edited by shreddog; Mar 17, 2008 at 3:21 AM. Reason: Engrish been good to me - spelling
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  #39  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 5:50 AM
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It would have been nice if at least a decent bridge connecting downtown Edmonton with the south side came out of Edmonton freeway proposals (like the one marked "105 St bridge" on the map), but I'm glad very little of that plan actually came into fruition.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shreddog View Post
Regarding that Edmonton proposal - crap, were they on crack back then?? Ditto for the Calgary proposal - nice finds.
That plan almost looks like the end result of a 4 year old armed with a blue marker getting a hold of a map of Edmonton.
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  #40  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2008, 4:30 PM
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Re: 24th ave, wasn't the original plan only utilizing 24th ave *west* of crowchild? vs 24th ave through the north hill communities? Or did I misinterpret mersar's post? That said I don't quite understand where the TCH would route between Shaganappi and 'hooked back into 16th just west of 53rd street'.
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