Crack Dealers, Pimps, Prostitutes.

ericb4prez · #1 Posted: **Jun 15, 2008, 6:04 PM**

i wonder if the city has a plan on cleaning up chinatown with the arrival of max on the horizon.

if not, they're going to have a rude awakening with the sort of clientele hoping on and off the trains in fairless square between burnside and glissan...in turn being shuttled all over downtown.

has anybody heard of some sort of plan from city hall?

there's nights in that area that look something like total recall.

alexjon · #2 Posted: **Jun 15, 2008, 6:57 PM**

Haven't been to skidmore fountain, have you?

MarkDaMan · #3 Posted: **Jun 15, 2008, 9:10 PM**

There are a lot of plans in the works Eric, but yes, you are right, initially it could be blocks of picking up the 'undesirable' element.

I expect the renovated mall and new transit lines will have frequent security by TriMet and Portland Police. At least initially.

ericb4prez · #4 Posted: **Jun 15, 2008, 10:38 PM**

oh yeah...skidmore fountain...not good...but at night, it's actually pretty quiet down there.

sundown in chinatown pretty much means free reign on selling crack.

cab · #5 Posted: **Jun 16, 2008, 2:13 PM**

I don't know one could argue that we should be more afraid of the bankers at PDC in old town then the Pimps and what not. The job they did on the 3rd and 4th Chinatown streetscape project is an abomination. Between the dragon statue and the street tree die off that place is a mess. The old cherry trees had way more character then what they did. What I found the most Ironic is the sidewalk space in front of the PDC building in old town has been skimmed down to the bare minimum. Its hard to even walk past a person going in the other direction, all for auto access. When given a choice they consistently make the wrong one. How many Pimps can do that kind of infrastructure damage? Anyone want a burnside bridgehead? Almost ready to go right after PDC tears down a perfectly good building on the existing property.

ericb4prez · #6 Posted: **Jun 16, 2008, 6:43 PM**

yes, the PDC has their missteps...

but i've never seen them rob anybody as knifepoint on the sidewalk...

or stomp out somebody for looking at them wrong.

WestCoast · #7 Posted: **Jun 19, 2008, 5:50 AM**

the open drug dealing, sleeping all over the streets, across naito on the waterfront, is awful.

I bet there is too much political correctness to run these people out of town, instead we'd rather give them free food and beds and hope they have a nice stay!

pdxman · #8 Posted: **Jun 19, 2008, 6:54 AM**

^^^I agree with you westcoast, but expect to be thoroughly railed by some forumers for the comments

bvpcvm · #9 Posted: **Jun 19, 2008, 7:23 AM**

i doubt that drug dealers are the same people as the ones sleeping on the street. so you're talking about two distinct populations. i also doubt that many drug dealers actually live in ot/ct; they're just there to do business.

drug dealers are one thing. but i truly don't understand this visceral reaction against people who sleep on the street. after all, we closed down most of the psychiatric hospitals and let the patients out. what are they supposed to do now? if their mental issues are severe enough that they're unable or unwilling to live like the rest of us, what then? banish them to gresham? to longview? let us know where you'd like to see them go.

and then, how, exactly, do they make your life a lesser one? do they keep from you getting your daily latte? doubtful. stop you from entering the gap? do they keep you from getting a date? unlikely. so what exactly is it? let us know; then we'll rail you.

Sekkle · #10 Posted: **Jun 19, 2008, 2:15 PM**

^ Excellent post.

cab · #11 Posted: **Jun 19, 2008, 3:33 PM**

They make you see the reality of our country. Can't we just live the American dream in blissful delusion?

alexjon · #12 Posted: **Jun 19, 2008, 4:35 PM**

Didn't the city-hating Trib run a story last year showing that most of the drug dealers merely hop off a bus in the area, deal, then hop back on another bus back to various points in other parts of the metro?

ericb4prez · #13 Posted: **Jun 19, 2008, 7:49 PM**

i'm not talking about the homeless.

i'm talking about the active drug trade, the active prostitution and the fact that i know a couple people that have been robbed/jumped in the area by the pimps and drug dealers.

if that area is going to become a key magnate of transit, it needs to be cleaned up.

bvpcvm · #14 Posted: **Jun 20, 2008, 12:44 AM**

^ i was responding to west coast.

Quote:

Originally Posted by WestCoast

the open drug dealing, sleeping all over the streets, across naito on the waterfront, is awful.

philopdx · #15 Posted: **Jun 23, 2008, 2:09 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by bvpcvm

i doubt that drug dealers are the same people as the ones sleeping on the street. so you're talking about two distinct populations. i also doubt that many drug dealers actually live in ot/ct; they're just there to do business.

drug dealers are one thing. but i truly don't understand this visceral reaction against people who sleep on the street. after all, we closed down most of the psychiatric hospitals and let the patients out. what are they supposed to do now? if their mental issues are severe enough that they're unable or unwilling to live like the rest of us, what then? banish them to gresham? to longview? let us know where you'd like to see them go.

and then, how, exactly, do they make your life a lesser one? do they keep from you getting your daily latte? doubtful. stop you from entering the gap? do they keep you from getting a date? unlikely. so what exactly is it? let us know; then we'll rail you.

I honestly feel bad for the certifiably crazy people that aren't able to function. But once someone becomes a panhandler, then my attitude suddenly changes.

If you're smart enough to understand what our medium of exchange is and you're smart enough to know you need it to buy a pack of ciggies or a flask of whiskey or a dime-bag, then you're absolutely smart enough to sweep a broom across a floor.

If you're smart and physically capable enough to dig through the garbage for hours to find bottles and cans to turn in for deposit, then surely you're smart and capable enough to be a sanitation worker.

The thing that bugs me here, is that without the spoils of civilization to coast on, these people couldn't survive making the choices they have made. Put them in the woods 5000 years ago with no roads, no soup kitchens, no churches, no clothes and no shelter and they wouldn't last particularly long sitting around waiting for someone to feed and clothe them.

Sitting around doing absolutely nothing is the most selfish thing of all. The Thai girl who worked a 12-hour day in the textile factory to make the shirt the panhandler is wearing or the Chinese laborer working in a Adidas sweatshop that made the shoes the panhandler is walking in to feed his family or the middle-class aid workers and contributors who facilitated those clothes being given to the panhandler simply don't have the option to be that selfish.

bvpcvm · #16 Posted: **Jun 23, 2008, 2:42 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by philopdx

The thing that bugs me here, is that without the spoils of civilization to coast on, these people couldn't survive making the choices they have made. Put them in the woods 5000 years ago with no roads, no soup kitchens, no churches, no clothes and no shelter and they wouldn't last particularly long sitting around waiting for someone to feed and clothe them.

i understand your points, but i really think that many of those people seriously just have mental problems. they undoubtedly are smart enough to push a broom, but might not, for example, have the savvy to know how to talk to the boss without getting into an argument. a few years ago i worked with borderline homeless people and i know it sounds kind of surprising, but it actually takes a lot of skills to get by in society - skills people in that borderline situation often lack. from the point of view of the middle class it's easy to look at them and say, well, if they'd follow steps A, B and C there'd be no problem. [just like my dad, who insists that all would be well in iraq if they'd just do certain things which the iraqis clearly have no intention of doing.] unfortunately, people in these situations aren't necessarily able to follow through. SOME of them might be just trying to malinger, but i'd say it's maybe 5%. the debate, then centers around whether you think it's 5% or 95%. but in any case, isn't the whole point of civilization to take care of those people who aren't otherwise capable of taking care of themselves (whatever that percentage is)? and do you make the burden of proof onerous enough that people who truly need help don't get it? there are all kinds of issues here, but i must rush off to work.

pdxtex · #17 Posted: **Jun 23, 2008, 11:45 PM**

walk around lloyd center or downtown and see who is asking for cigarettes or money....its not crazy people talking to themselves, its dirty gutter punks and more then capable under 40 somethings!! i've lived in portland 12 years and chinatown is as sketchy as it was the first summer i moved here. portland as a whole is far too lenient when it comes to dealing with transients, let alone out of control drug dealers and hookers who are clearly breaking the law.....

bvpcvm · #18 Posted: **Jun 24, 2008, 12:36 AM**

you're making snap judgments based on appearances. "crazy people talking to themselves" are probably schizophrenic, but mental illness doesn't end there. and what do you mean by "more then [sic] capable 40 somethings"? what are your criteria for determining, at a glance, that someone is capable of pulling themselves together and maintaining a job and a home? i would bet that in fact you DON'T have any such criteria except for your prejudices. if they bother you so much, i'm sure there's a nice gated subdivision for you somewhere in clackamas county where you'll never be bothered by anyone ever being any different from you.

pdxman · #19 Posted: **Jun 24, 2008, 1:12 AM**

^^^So what's your plan for dealing with this issue bvpcvm? (Thats an honest inquiry, i'm not trying to start something)

rsbear · #20 Posted: **Jun 24, 2008, 2:14 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by bvpcvm

you're making snap judgments based on appearances. "crazy people talking to themselves" are probably schizophrenic, but mental illness doesn't end there. and what do you mean by "more then [sic] capable 40 somethings"? what are your criteria for determining, at a glance, that someone is capable of pulling themselves together and maintaining a job and a home? i would bet that in fact you DON'T have any such criteria except for your prejudices. if they bother you so much, i'm sure there's a nice gated subdivision for you somewhere in clackamas county where you'll never be bothered by anyone ever being any different from you.

What's your criteria for determining that someone is truly in need and deserving of a helping hand from society? It's only fair that you answer the same question you pose to pdxtex.