CHICAGO | Highrise Projects & Construction

[Hayward]

[Nowhereman1280]

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown

I don't think there are any actual developers who are regulars here; just observers of the development scene.

There are several of us here who do it on the side that I know of. There are also some big fish that lurk this site as well, but rarely/never post.

[Swicago Swi Sox]

I know of a building that has some public and private parking mixed. The top of the parking garage is totally private owned spaces behind a second security gate. The bottom of the garage is run by a public parking company, but residents can also rent spaces (and get one of those "reserved" placards).

The building is in what is generally known as a "good" neighborhood", yet there were still incidents of residents that park in the public spaces having their vehicles broken into. This is because there is a big security difference between leaving your car in a garage for a few hours while shopping or at work, and leaving it in a garage day and night for a few days at a time. Thieves can easily canvas a garage and look for the car that is only used on the weekend and then sits all week long and break in when they know no one will be looking to use the car.

Another thing you need to consider when taking a condo building and making the bottom of the parking public, is the wear and tear on the structure. A public garage will have many more vehicles traveling through, dragging in more snow and salt in the winter. This will lead to higher maintenance costs. A condo board would have to make sure they have an agreement with the new parking company about who is on the line for which costs.

[emathias]

Originally Posted by ardecila

...

Besides, if I'm John and Jane Condo-Owner, and I only use one of my two parking spaces, why would I turn down a $30000 payment for the unused space? Obviously it lowers the value of the condo overall but I think a lot of people would appreciate the flexibility to get some money out of their investment without a home-equity loan.

If it's deeded separately but was part of the original purchase there's probably a lien on it by the mortgage-holder which would complicate a sale. If it's not deeded separately it might not be caught by the mortgage-holder, but it wouldn't surprise me if selling the rights to it resulted in a technical default if the mortgage-holder found out about it. The last thing a mortgage-holder wants is part of their collateral walking away.

[Hayward]

Back when I leased a space it was non-guaranteed. Slightly lower rate than having a reserved space, but if visitors filled up the entire garage on a Saturday, tough luck for residents. The owner certainly got the most bang for their buck. Though it was very rare that any residents came home and couldn't find a spot.

[Buckman821]

Taken today:







This project seems to be moving along at a pretty good clip. It's also a fun one to watch because it's a huge site with tons of activity and 3 cores.

Edit: The more accurate intersection would be Clark & Illinois as that is the corner that the project wraps around.

[Nowhereman1280]

Oooooo Buckman getting in on the photo scene!




Thx for the update.

[harryc]

Jan 31


Feb 6


Feb 10

[Nowhereman1280]

God, I can tell just from the column layout that this is going to be a hideous bastard. You know a building is going to be ugly when the columns line up horizontally with the exterior walls. It just screams "I'm going to be a concrete box"...


Though seeing FOUR tower cranes in one shot is certainly a site for sore eyes.

[harryc]

Jan 25


Feb 13


Jan 30




Jan 31


Feb 1


Feb 10 - core 3 (some pile driving - just for variety)

[ardecila]

This is gonna be some weird construction process, with 3 cores rising simultaneously.

I wonder what kind of complex arrangements will allow the three hotels to share the same building? Do they share HVAC systems, for example? Are the three portions of the building fire-separated?

[Nowhereman1280]

^^^ I'd just like to see the lease agreements and how the deal is structured between ownership and tenants and between the three tenants. It's got to be one mess of a document.

[Mr Downtown]

^In truth, don't you imagine it's one owner (something like River North Hotel Venture LLC) that simply is operating under three "flags," as hotel brands are known? The hotels won't really have any ownership or even leasehold interests. So probably more like those designer boutiques inside Macy's than like a mall food court.

[ardecila]

Good analogies. If they're not really separate, why not just operate as one big hotel? Are the owners just trying to attract multiple segments of the travel market?

[Nowhereman1280]

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown

^In truth, don't you imagine it's one owner (something like River North Hotel Venture LLC) that simply is operating under three "flags," as hotel brands are known? The hotels won't really have any ownership or even leasehold interests. So probably more like those designer boutiques inside Macy's than like a mall food court.

^^^ To be honest, I don't know, that's why I'd be interested to see exactly how this deal is structured. However, the ownership model you are describing seems to be a franchise model and I'm not under the impression that most hotels operate that way. My guess would be that there is a company with ownership interest in the land and building and that each hotel is renting space in the building from that entity which provides them with shared facilities as an "amenity". It would seem logical to structure this property like an office building with three tenants. I could be wrong though as I'm not expert on the hotel industry.

In any case I'd just love to see how a deal like this is put together and negotiated. Yes, I'm such a real estate nerd that I find reading complex lease agreements and PSA's fascinating.

[Mr Downtown]

^Different segments of the travel market, and even different affinity programs. I'm not an expert, but I think most midmarket hotels do indeed operate as "franchises." The buildings are owned by real estate investors, who simply contract with Marriott, Holiday Inn, Sheraton, or the like for one of their brands. Usually there's a plaque somewhere near the front desk so stating. Sometimes a property is reflagged after a sale from one investment group to another. There are certainly many exceptions, particularly flagship properties (Chicago Hilton, Hyatt at Illinois Center) and top-end brands such as Four Seasons, Peninsula, or Ritz-Carlton.

[jc5680]

Originally Posted by Nowhereman1280

^^^ To be honest, I don't know, that's why I'd be interested to see exactly how this deal is structured. However, the ownership model you are describing seems to be a franchise model and I'm not under the impression that most hotels operate that way. My guess would be that there is a company with ownership interest in the land and building and that each hotel is renting space in the building from that entity which provides them with shared facilities as an "amenity". It would seem logical to structure this property like an office building with three tenants. I could be wrong though as I'm not expert on the hotel industry.

In any case I'd just love to see how a deal like this is put together and negotiated. Yes, I'm such a real estate nerd that I find reading complex lease agreements and PSA's fascinating.

Hotels, or groups of Hotels are most often run by Hospitality Management groups. Locally, you have groups like Kokua that manage/own the doubletree, the allerton and inn of chicago - also an aloft in marylyand and a hyatt place in hawaii. These groups also very much franchise hotel brands. It is very likely the situation Mr D said. One owner operating the 3 flags.

for example:
pacificahotels.com
denihan.com/
kokuahospitality.com
chartreslodging.com/portfolio.htm
bricton.com/hotels.php

[Alliance]

Can we tear down AMLI yet?

Originally Posted by ardecila

Good analogies. If they're not really separate, why not just operate as one big hotel? Are the owners just trying to attract multiple segments of the travel market?

There are similar operations here in New York. If nothing else, its nice to see the visual facade of a big monolithic building broken up into smaller pieces.

[ardecila]

Originally Posted by Alliance

There are similar operations here in New York. If nothing else, its nice to see the visual facade of a big monolithic building broken up into smaller pieces.

Thank goodness we didn't get Gene Kaufman to design ours.

[denizen467]

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown

There are certainly many exceptions, particularly flagship properties (Chicago Hilton, Hyatt at Illinois Center) and top-end brands such as Four Seasons, Peninsula, or Ritz-Carlton.

With the Ritz-Carlton at Water Tower Place as one interesting exception - it is operated by Four Seasons (ironically). Apparently the owner of the WTP Ritz was not happy that Marriott acquired control of Ritz-Carlton a decade ago, so rather than have Marriott run the WTP Ritz along with every other Ritz in the world, it was arranged that instead Four Seasons run it. It couldn't be reflagged as a Four Seasons obviously, and apparently keeping the Ritz flag just made marketing sense. (Who owns the WTP Ritz anyway? Somebody with animosity to Mormons?)

Actually, Four Seasons tends not to own their properties either.