Broadway Rapid Transit Corridor Discussion | Proposed

[mr.x]

Originally Posted by crazyjoeda

they should build it in stages, like first to Cambie, then down to someplace like Arbutus, and then to UBC. That way it will be less of an upfront finacial commitment and will have a better chance of being approved.

that might be worth taking a look at.....but look at the M-Line. it was supposed to be built in stages with the Broadway and Coquitlam extensions for 2002.....look at where we are today. LRT for the Evergreen and back to the drawing boards for the western extension.

[eduardo88]

Originally Posted by mr.x2

that might be worth taking a look at.....but look at the M-Line. it was supposed to be built in stages with the Broadway and Coquitlam extensions for 2002.....look at where we are today. LRT for the Evergreen and back to the drawing boards for the western extension.

I think that's partly because it was seen as a more distant future extension. If we were given a guarantee of funding over say 10 years to build the project in phases it could be done, we just can't rely on the whole "in a few years we'll ask for the funding" like we have done. It would be cool if they could open a new station every year or so like they do on many metro systems around the world, for example they could bore the tunnels once the machine is done with the Canada Line and work on adding stations in phases, say 2011 up to Cambie, 2012 to Granville, 2013 to Arbutus, 2014 UBC? All the while maintaining the 99B and adding a new express bus from the last built station to UBC, which would only be temporary until the line would be finished.

[Doug]

How long would this line be (from VCC to UBC) - about 10km?

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by eduardo88

for example they could bore the tunnels once the machine is done with the Canada Line and work on adding stations in phases, say 2011 up to Cambie, 2012 to Granville, 2013 to Arbutus, 2014 UBC?

Maybe add a year or two since the Canada Line boring machine will be used for the Evergreen Line (compete in 2011)

Originally Posted by deasine

Why did they have to make the Lougheed Station interchange so confusing.... I understand how it works (especially after the explaining from officedweller and the Provincial gov't diagrams) but why couldn't they just make something similar to the Canada Line split (do an under version instead of over).

Agreed - but it's probably because they expected there to be more volume or flexibility at Lougheed than Columbia (also a two platform station) - hence the three platforms (i.e. a short turn platfrom). In theory they could run more through trains with the extra track without having trains wait as much. With only two platforms, that would eventually limit the capacity. But you'd think they could have done that with a flyover.

[mr.x]

Originally Posted by eduardo88

I think that's partly because it was seen as a more distant future extension. If we were given a guarantee of funding over say 10 years to build the project in phases it could be done, we just can't rely on the whole "in a few years we'll ask for the funding" like we have done. It would be cool if they could open a new station every year or so like they do on many metro systems around the world, for example they could bore the tunnels once the machine is done with the Canada Line and work on adding stations in phases, say 2011 up to Cambie, 2012 to Granville, 2013 to Arbutus, 2014 UBC? All the while maintaining the 99B and adding a new express bus from the last built station to UBC, which would only be temporary until the line would be finished.

Sweet Leilani is being used for the Evergreen Line after 2009, if it gets built.

The thing with adding stations like that is it would be costly. It costs quite a bit to reprogram the SkyTrain computer, and we're doing this every year for three years? Not to mention that the Broadway extension will be bored....you can't really do boring unless you have a maintenance pit at where you started to dig.

How long would this line be (from VCC to UBC) - about 10km?

I'd say 12 km.

[Jared]

WRT phased extentions:

The other thing is that you're going to need to build a big bus loop at every terminus station, as UBC students will still need a place to board what would be a shortened B-Line. Making new ones is expensive, as you would probably need to expropriate some property along the way (if you could even find anything suitable).

[SpongeG]

i thought whatever the technology they ended up that passengers would need to transfer at lougheed station

[deasine]

^If the Evergreen Line was using SkyTrain technology, like originally planned

[twoNeurons]

it may not be bored, as well. it could be cut n' cover down 10th.

[mr.x]

Originally Posted by tintinium

it may not be bored, as well. it could be cut n' cover down 10th.

That could happen....though trees that are 10 times older and 5 times taller than the trees that were removed on Cambie would need to come down. I could see the NIMBY's going crazy over that, though i do admit they are quite beautiful.

[eduardo88]

I hope they do bore it, cut and cover along 10th would be hell. the streets only two lanes wide and its all single family homes, imagine the complaints translink will get! i wonder what's faster to build anyways?

[mr.x]

Originally Posted by eduardo88

I hope they do bore it, cut and cover along 10th would be hell. the streets only two lanes wide and its all single family homes, imagine the complaints translink will get! i wonder what's faster to build anyways?

well, they were originally planning to use 6 boring machines for the Canada Line. Two from Olympic Village Station heading north to Waterfront Station, another two from Olympic Village Station heading south to Marine Drive. And two boring machines at Marine Drive Station heading north, and will meet up along the route with the other two Olympic Village boring machines.

i think cut and cover is a little faster.

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by mr.x2

well, they were originally planning to use 6 boring machines for the Canada Line. Two from Olympic Village Station heading north to Waterfront Station, another two from Olympic Village Station heading south to Marine Drive. And two boring machines at Marine Drive Station heading north, and will meet up along the route with the other two Olympic Village boring machines.

Those were not firm plans - that was the multiple account evaluation assessing the feasibility of the project.
It was not a proposal by the successful bidder - InTransitBC.

i.e. therein lies the problem with confusion over what is "proposed" and what is used as a comparator.

[MistyMountainHop]

Originally Posted by mr.x2

That could happen....though trees that are 10 times older and 5 times taller than the trees that were removed on Cambie would need to come down. I could see the NIMBY's going crazy over that, though i do admit they are quite beautiful.

Which trees would have to come down? I can't think of any myself that they'd have to remove.

[mr.x]

Originally Posted by marmorek

Which trees would have to come down? I can't think of any myself that they'd have to remove.

tons of tall trees on both sides of the street starting at around west of Burrard.

[officedweller]

If they stack the tunnels, the trench could be quite narrow and they may not interfere with tree roots too much.
As for construction without the use of the small overhead cranes that they are using on the Cambie segment (which would require overhead clearance and trimming trees) - I'm thinking they may be able to use smaller cranes that could fit below the canopy.

[eduardo88]

Ok i did this cause i've been bored (just graduated and i have nothing really to do this week), but i thought it'd be cool if the M-Line expansion could be done like this. It would include recreating it completely, with the creation of a new "Ring Line" (cause it forms a ring around the city;alternatively could be called 'Circle Line' because it forms a rough circle), which would follow the existing M-Line (apart VCC, Renfrew, Commercial, Rupert and Gilmore), but instead of turning around at Waterfront it would continue down Hastings and back to Brentwood. This is just a vision, but it would have been really cool if they could built it this way, would reduce transfers at Broadway/Commercial substancially and provide another route downtown, but this time from the east. It would also provice Hastings with rapid transit.

The way I see it frequencies (at peak hours) would be as follows:

M-Line: Brentwood-UBC 2 minutes
Brentwood-Lougheed 60 Seconds (due to Ring Line Trains)
Lougheed-Coquitlam 2 minutes

Ring Line: Columbia-Waterfront 60 seconds (due to Expo Line Trains)
Waterfront-Brentwood 2 minutes
Brentwood-Lougheed 60 seconds (due to M-Line Trains)
Lougheed-Columbia 2 minutes

Expo: King George-Columbia 2 minutes
Columbia-Waterfront 60 seconds (due to Ring Line Trains)


Frequencies of 45 seconds would prob not be needed into/out of downtown because of the relief the Ring Line would give the existing Expo/M-line. Also it would provide people from Sapperton-Brentwood a one seat ride to DT.

The stations for the Ring Line would be:

Willingdon Heights Park @ Kitchener St. and Gilmore Ave (future station)
Boundary Road @ E Hastings St. and Boundary Road
PNE @ E Hastings St. and Renfrew St.
Pandora Park @ E Hastings St. and Nanaimo St.
Clark Dr. @ E Hastings St. and Clark Dr.
Oppenheimer Park/Main St. @ E Hastings St. and Main St.

Maps Below:





maps are a little rough but give the overall idea.

[deasine]

It works... but for some odd reason I don't like it HAHA. But it works perfectly.... hmmm...

[officedweller]

I think I'd rather see the black line turn south at Boundary (or even Willingdon) and provide a transfer station to the Expo Line. That way riders could loop in Burnaby (from Metrotown to Brentwood) with a couple of transfers.

[mr.x]

i think it should keep going on Hastings, go through SFU if at all possible, and terminate at Lougheed.