Evergreen Line | u/c

[GeeCee]

Originally Posted by Daka

There's supposed to be a new storage yard/operations & maintenance centre for the Evergreen Line, incl. in that $1.4 billion cost (apparently Burnaby is out of capacity). Does anyone know where that will be, and if it will be capable of shouldering capacity for future SkyTrain extensions (i.e. Millennium West, Surrey)? With the Evergreen Line taking over the Millenium's portion between Lougheed and VCC-Clark I'm sure it would be expandable in such way.

From earlier in the thread..

Originally Posted by officedweller

It was slated to be along Barnet Highway near Falcon Drive area.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by mr.x

I like how the Canada Line actually shows up as red on this Evergreen Line fact sheet....the sheer illogic of not branding it as red in the first place by the SNC-Lavalin folks is beyond me.

http://www.evergreenline.gov.bc.ca/d...jectUpdate.pdf

Originally Posted by NucksFanInVan

Brings up an interesting branding question. When the Evergreen Line begins thru service to VCC, one can presume that the existing Lougheed-VCC millenium segment will be re-branded green on Translink mapping and the yellow millenium line trace will terminate at Lougheed. (Hopefully this much is consensus.)

So the yellow Millenium line will exist mostly parallel to Expo's dark blue with a little yellow tail at the end. Coincidentally, the Expo's dark blue will exist parallel to Millenium but with a dark blue tail. However, the Canada Line will still be shown as a single light blue line with two tails.

Will the system continue to embrace the inconsistency of having the same situation treated in two different ways? Or will it motivate a change to a dual branding of the Canada Line (dare we say it - red and light blue)? Or maybe a change to single-branding of the Expo line?

Originally Posted by BCPhil

Yep that's the plan, we've talked about that a lot here.

Running the Evergreen and Millennium lines in parallel would result in far more trains running on the track than are required to meet service needs. And it would be a scheduling nightmare when you think about how you would have to run the Mline in sync with 2 other lines.

Originally Posted by simonfiction

Ah right, that makes sense. I must have over-looked that somehow whilst dipping in and out of this thread.

My personal preference would be to take the same style as the Canada line. I guess this would make the Millennium line no more?

Originally Posted by jsbertram

Various ideas have been kicked around here, but I've stopped guessing what Translink will do until there's an official announcement.

One concept:
Millennium runs 'full loop' from Waterfront via Columbia and Lougheed to VCC (same as today)
Expo shares the tracks from from Waterfront to Columbia then branches off to King George (same as today)
Evergreen shares the tracks from from VCC to Lougheed then branches off to Douglas College



A second concept:
Expo runs from Waterfront to Columbia then to King George (same as today)
Evergreen runs VCC to Lougheed then to Douglas College
'Millennium shuttle' between Columbia and Lougheed

With this concept, the Expo and Evergreen lines run as separate services, so if something happens on one of the lines causing it to be shut down, the other could still operate as normal.



Then again Translink might just rename everything to colours and terminals:

Yellow line to King George or (or Waterfront)
Blue line to VCC (or Waterfront)
Green line to Douglas College (or VCC) (or even UBC someday)

Originally Posted by BCPhil

I feel pretty confident that on the day Evergreen line opens service will be set up as:

Expo Line: Waterfront <-> King George
Millennium Line: Waterfront <-> Lougheed
Evergreen Line: VCC <-> Douglas


I do have a feeling though that for late night service (like 10pm to close) they will (or at least should) shorten the Millennium line to be Columbia <-> Lougheed. This would allow them to run trains every 5 minutes out to King George instead of every 10 minutes. As it is today, at night, every train leaving Columbia for King Goerge is packed full, while trains leaving Columbia for M-Line are less than half. The Surrey section could use a real bump up in night service (while the system overall doesn't really need it).

Originally Posted by BCPhil

I don't know about that. I've been on plenty of platforms when a group (2 or more) next to me are talking among themselves:

"WAIT! don't get on this train, it's a Millennium line, it won't take us to Metrotown."
"But the other train went to Surrey. Where is the train to Metrotown?"

And many other variations thereof.

Either way of labeling it will always confuse the easily confused, at least the first time.

At least the new configuration will keep people who get on the train at Brentwood labeled "Waterfront" from asking me "is this the fastest way Downtown?" That has happened to me more than once.

Originally Posted by NucksFanInVan

Pros and cons to both approaches. Personally I think either could work. I just hope that they standardize Canada and Expo because right now we have the worst of both worlds, and that means that the easily confused will likely remain so.

If I had to choose I'd say call them different lines to underscore the different destinations. Otherwise the problem will get worse as one line (e.g., Waterfront <-> King George Expo or Waterfront <-> Brighouse Canada) is extended in the future and begins to dominate how people think of each line. For example, if everyone comes to understand that Expo runs from Waterfront to Langley, the Lougheed route will be reduced to a footnote. "Oh yeah, that's Expo too, just not the same Expo."

I suspect the problem with splitting the branding on the Canada Line is (a) that it's a pain for the concessionaire, who right now can sell the "Canada Line" brand; and (b) the naming was part of the negotiations around federal funding.

Originally Posted by jsbertram

I showed someone on the map that the yellow line trains and the blue line trains both went to Metrotown.

They got REALLY confused because the only trains they'd seen so far were either white or grey & blue. Where were the yellow trains?

Gee ... this is getting complicated. Anyway, other big cities with metros far more extensive - and complex - than ours manage, so smallish Vancouver with only 4 metro lines should be able to figure it out.

[Canadian Mind]

As for the OMC, wouldn't that be another benifit of expanding southeast to Langley and Cloverdale in the future? Plenty of open space for a large OMC with expansion room. You could shut the urban ones down and use the land for something else.

[DKaz]

These people who don't know the M and E Line both go to Metrotown are an exception. I wouldn't worry about them, this is probably not the only thing in life they fail at and it would be prohibitively costly to cater to these kinds of folks.

Imagine if they had to make an announcement "Expo Line to King George with stops at Granville, Stadium, Main St.-Science World, Commercial Broadway....... Scott Road, Gateway, and Surrey Central."

[twoNeurons]

If Columbia was reworked, I'd say that this station would be much better suited to be a tail terminus.

This would increase capacity SOF (where capacity is more needed) and alleviate pressure on the EXPO line north (As you wouldn't have as many from Lougheed taking the M-Line downtown. Additionally it's less confusing.

EXPO is our trunk line... it doesn't need the M-Line sucking resources away SOF.

[queetz@home]

Nothing really new...I guess its an excuse to bump the thread until something happens....

http://www.tricitynews.com/news/137925023.html

On Wednesday, Jan. 25, a special event is taking place at the Port Moody Station of the West Coast Express where an announcement regarding the line is supposed to be made.

[GeeCee]

"when the line is supposed to be made"

That's some quality writing right there.

[Mininari]

I note some warnings of upcoming watermain construction on Clarke and North Road... is this some of the prelimiary, pre-construction work on utilities that is required, or totally unrelated?

[Alex Mackinnon]

Anyone know what time the announcement is? You know, for those with nothing better to do...

[officedweller]

Of interest - Burnaby report explaining why the guideway alignment down the centre of North Road was selected - essentially because residential podiums are planned for the Lougheed Mall site and they wanted the guideway as far from residential on each side of the street. This is nothing new, as the entire alignment of the M-Line SkyTrain switches back and forth across and down the middle of Lougheed Hghway to avoid residential areas.

The report does not even consider the impact of a centre guideway on the cost or feasibility of a station at Cameron (the centre alignment makes a station much more expensive than a side-of-road alignment would do (think Holdom Station configuration versus Brentwood Station configuration with mezzanine)).

http://davidpereira.ca/wp-content/up...-Alignment.pdf

.

[hollywoodnorth]

looks like a official facebook page is up >> http://www.facebook.com/evergreenline

[GeeCee]

Originally Posted by Mininari

I note some warnings of upcoming watermain construction on Clarke and North Road... is this some of the prelimiary, pre-construction work on utilities that is required, or totally unrelated?

Not sure. Other underground work for utilities has been mentioned but watermain replacement hasn't been.

[racc]

Well, looks like it is a go for sure. They have a Facebook page! All I can say is FINALLY! Next round of stimulus, they should ask for Facebook ready projects. But won't be up and running until summer of 2016. Better a decade or two late than never.

[nname]

Originally Posted by officedweller

Of interest - Burnaby report explaining why the guideway alignment down the centre of North Road was selected - essentially because residential podiums are planned for the Lougheed Mall site and they wanted the guideway as far from residential on each side of the street. This is nothing new, as the entire alignment of the M-Line SkyTrain switches back and forth across and down the middle of Lougheed Hghway to avoid residential areas.

The report does not even consider the impact of a centre guideway on the cost or feasibility of a station at Cameron (the centre alignment makes a station much more expensive than a side-of-road alignment would do (think Holdom Station configuration versus Brentwood Station configuration with mezzanine)).

http://davidpereira.ca/wp-content/up...-Alignment.pdf

.

The station is feasible if they are willing to build the guideway higher. The plan indicates the grade drop from +6% to +2.769% about 200m south of Cameron street. So if the station is to be built north of Cameron, they just need to continue the 6% grade all the way to the intersection. It just that the track would be as high as 12-13m above the intersection, and the station would probably be higher than the apartments beside it. But the good thing is the station would be high enough for a mezzanine level on the south end.

[nname]

Originally Posted by Alex Mackinnon

Anyone know what time the announcement is? You know, for those with nothing better to do...

Maybe they'll announce the launch of the Facebook page

[Metro-One]

I just cant wait to see the mega structures going up. Love watching the gantry cranes putting the guide way together.

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by nname

The station is feasible if they are willing to build the guideway higher. The plan indicates the grade drop from +6% to +2.769% about 200m south of Cameron street. So if the station is to be built north of Cameron, they just need to continue the 6% grade all the way to the intersection. It just that the track would be as high as 12-13m above the intersection, and the station would probably be higher than the apartments beside it. But the good thing is the station would be high enough for a mezzanine level on the south end.

Feasible, but too costly.
The taller guideway would cause an increased cost that would work against including it as a future station.
The other increase in costs would be from the more complex structure of the mezzanine station
(Brentwood Station has special concrete supports jutting from the sides of the columns to support the platforms over the roadway).
In comparison, the future Lincoln Station would be a "side-of-road" station like Holdom.

[queetz@home]

Originally Posted by Alex Mackinnon

Anyone know what time the announcement is? You know, for those with nothing better to do...

I don't have a link, just reading this off from my Thomson newsfeed from work....

Its at 9:30 am. The people who will be there are BC Transpo Minister, aka the one who was pivotal on saving the Evergreen Line, Blair Lekstrom, Federal Transpo Minister Denis Lebel, Heritage Minister James Moore, and Mayor's Council Chair Richard Walton.

I would love to come, even if its just a chance to give my thanks to those people who are making this much needed rapid transit line finally happen. But its so short notice so I couldn't take the day off. Hopefully when they do the groundbreaking for the major construction, they would provide more notice.

[officedweller]

It's probably to announce the start of the pre-construction work - relocation of electrical lines, etc.

The technical bids from the proponents are not due until April 2012, so it's not the announcement of a preferred proponent.

See the Nov 9, 2011 press release when the RFP was issued:

http://www.evergreenline.gov.bc.ca/d...096-001456.pdf

[tybuilding]

The announcement this morning was for the pre construction work. Finish main construction summer 2016