HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForumSkyscraper Posters
     
Welcome to the SkyscraperPage Forum.

Since 1999, SkyscraperPage.com's forum has been one of the most active skyscraper enthusiast communities on the web.  The global membership discusses development news and construction activity on projects from around the world, alongside discussions on urban design, architecture, transportation and many other topics.  SkyscraperPage.com also features unique skyscraper diagrams, a database of construction activity, and publishes popular skyscraper posters.

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > SSP: Local London > Projects & Construction Updates

Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #81  
Old Posted Sep 13, 2010, 6:42 PM
GreatTallNorth2 GreatTallNorth2 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 646
I didn't say I wanted Anne Marie to personally dictate style and approve projects. I would, however, like the political leadership of the city to take an interest in the design of our major downtown buildings, especially ones that impact our skyline. Is that asking too much? A clear example of a city that has a hands on approach to design is Waterloo. Auburn Developments of London is building a multi-million dollar development there. Their proposal to the city of Waterloo was just as ugly as the project they just built in London (Harriston tower). You would probably be proud of how ugly it was. I'm not sure of all the details, but I do know that they had to go back to the drawing board to redesign the project to get the approval of Waterloo council. In London, it seems like all we care about is getting residential units at any cost - and who cares about design.

Also, I am quite aware of how economics work. No one is saying we need marble and glass towers - just a little better design than the status quo would be nice. I don't have to go to school to learn planning, OMB or anything else to know what we have in London currently is crap design. I know that these developers are private. Just wondering, are you in favour of giving them tax breaks, etc. to build concrete crap?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #82  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2010, 12:42 AM
ForestryW's Avatar
ForestryW ForestryW is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Kitchener, Ontario
Posts: 307
The simple fact is, like Snark said, the market conditions in London are not conducive to "quality" architecture, which is invariably more expensive.

Personally I don't think the Renaissance is all that bad. It's a HUGE step up from *shudder* the Harriston *shudder*
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #83  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2010, 1:17 PM
MolsonExport's Avatar
MolsonExport MolsonExport is offline
The Vomit Bag.
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Liver & Onions
Posts: 21,477
The vast majority of new construction in London is fugly. but at least there is some construction. We seem to be like Ottawa, being satisfied with mediocrity. The banality of the ubiquitous concrete slabs is really quite amazing.
That said, the rennaissance is really not that bad when compared to the Harriston, and the pile of fuglies across from Costco Wonderland.
__________________
There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know. -Donald Rumsfeld
Didn't you notice on the plane when you started talking, eventually I started reading the vomit bag?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #84  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2010, 4:36 PM
ForestryW's Avatar
ForestryW ForestryW is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Kitchener, Ontario
Posts: 307
Quote:
Originally Posted by MolsonExport View Post
The vast majority of new construction in London is fugly. but at least there is some construction. We seem to be like Ottawa, being satisfied with mediocrity. The banality of the ubiquitous concrete slabs is really quite amazing.
That said, the rennaissance is really not that bad when compared to the Harriston, and the pile of fuglies across from Costco Wonderland.
Ottawa, what? I lived there last summer and I was impressed at the quality of new residential architecture, with some exceptions. Look at Mondrian...simply beautiful.

You are correct, though, a large amount of Londoners love beige mediocrity.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #85  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2010, 9:29 PM
sparky212's Avatar
sparky212 sparky212 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: London Ont.
Posts: 412
Well things are slowly getting better and its starting in the old east hopefully that will help the standard for development in the city, and you never know tricar might have changed the designof tower 2 to be competative with medallion so not to lose the potential costomers, probably not but wishfull thinking hurt no one.
__________________
visit my mini city at http://londonto.myminicity.com/tra
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #86  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2010, 9:51 PM
ForestryW's Avatar
ForestryW ForestryW is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Kitchener, Ontario
Posts: 307
It is changing, as it is all across Ontario as higher density infill projects become more important (see Places to Grow Act).
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #87  
Old Posted Sep 18, 2010, 3:33 AM
Snark Snark is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 336
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreatTallNorth2 View Post
I didn't say I wanted Anne Marie to personally dictate style and approve projects. I would, however, like the political leadership of the city to take an interest in the design of our major downtown buildings, especially ones that impact our skyline. Is that asking too much?
So, how does the political leadership taking an interest in building design translate into ensuring that buildings without exposed concrete are constructed in the downtown - without some sort of teeth in the process involved? Businessmen don't care about words, they care about profit and what they are legally allowed to get away with to maximize profit in the business environment that they are operating in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GreatTallNorth2 View Post
Anne Marie doesn't have a clue, Tom Gosnell and Van Mer Burgen are pro-ugly design.
One London Place, the Talbot Centre, and the Duffern Corporate Centre all happened under the auspices of Tom Gosnell as mayor. Now it is silly to credit Gosnell for the design of these buildings, but since you "blame" him and others for advocating the current state of affairs of architecture downtown - you must as well credit him for the very best that has been built as well. Can't have it both ways.


Quote:
Originally Posted by GreatTallNorth2 View Post
A clear example of a city that has a hands on approach to design is Waterloo. Auburn Developments of London is building a multi-million dollar development there. Their proposal to the city of Waterloo was just as ugly as the project they just built in London (Harriston tower). You would probably be proud of how ugly it was. I'm not sure of all the details, but I do know that they had to go back to the drawing board to redesign the project to get the approval of Waterloo council. In London, it seems like all we care about is getting residential units at any cost - and who cares about design.
Incorrect. Waterloo didn't force Auburn to go back to the drawing board simply due to the proposed appearance of the buildings. Far, far from it. There were many issues related to the mixed-use nature of the proposal (ie zoning, density, etc). If appearance were the only issue, Auburn could have rammed through the development as originally proposed. That said, Waterloo's urban design planner is one smart cookie, devoted to the idea of good design, and persuasive. He will do his best to persuade developers to "do the right thing" in this regard. London has hired an individual of the same sort several years ago, and the effects are starting to be seen and more will be seen in the future. (Oh and BTW: London got the Harriston (for what it is), while Waterloo will not get the significant towers at the Barrel Yards for likely another 5 or more years, resulting in being 8-10 or more years following the initial announcement).


Quote:
Originally Posted by GreatTallNorth2 View Post
I don't have to go to school to learn planning, OMB or anything else to know what we have in London currently is crap design. I know that these developers are private. Just wondering, are you in favour of giving them tax breaks, etc. to build concrete crap?
You may know what you like, but to navigate the turbulent waters of big business, development, and urban planning - yes you do need to learn this stuff. One day at the OMB can cost you $500,000 in lawyer's fees. It's very legal, very regulated, and very, very complicated involving a lot of heavy hitters.

As for the idea of tax breaks, sure I agree with the idea, as do most in the biz. The carrot is always much more effective than the stick. Most cities already wave development charges and other fees to develop in the downtown. To go further and reduce their actual property taxes further for something totally subjective such as appearance is a political minefield however. Not impossible, but very tricky. Believe it or not, some folks hate glass or even tall buildings in their downtowns.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #88  
Old Posted Sep 21, 2010, 12:16 PM
sparky212's Avatar
sparky212 sparky212 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: London Ont.
Posts: 412
Another tower is on the rise in downtown London.

Tricar Group is preparing its Renaissance site for a second residential tower it hopes to build two years ahead of schedule, because its first tower at Ridout and King streets is “100% full,” said Adam Carapella, Tricar vice-president.

“It is fully occupied right now, so we think London is ready for this. We are pretty excited.”

But there will be a big difference between the second tower and the first that began leasing in April 2009. The newest building will offer condominiums for sale, Carapella said. The first tower has rental units.

“There is demand as London has accepted highrise condominium living as a form of housing, so we are bringing our condos to downtown,” Carapella said.

When Tricar was leasing its first rental tower, it received inquiries about buying downtown condominiums as opposed to renting apartments.

The company’s condominium developments in other parts of the city have sold well, he said.

“It has really taken off recently.”

The new tower will have fewer units, but they will be larger. Units will be up to 1,600 square feet compared with 1,200 square feet in the first tower. Units will range in price from $200,000 to $400,000 with a penthouse also offered at a higher price.

The first apartment tower had 277 units. The second will have 180 units on 28 floors, the same height as the first tower.

“We think the demand will be there,” Carapella said. “The condo mentality has been creeping here from Toronto and we are ready for it.”

Tricar will apply for a permit in a matter of weeks, meaning it will likely be ready for occupancy in 2012.

There are still plans to build a parking garage between the two towers. The garage that may also contain commercial space will be built when the second tower is completed.

“We need that space now as a staging area for all our equipment as we build the second tower,” Carapella said.

The first tower has five levels of parking at its base, and another underground level that will connect to the second tower.

Tricar had expected to start building the second tower in about 2012, but demand has pushed that schedule ahead.

The company still has to get a building permit for the second tower — but that should not be a problem, said Janette MacDonald, manager at Downtown London.

“They have done better than they thought they would, but it does not surprise me. This is fantastic news,” MacDonald said.

“It has proven itself, we are delighted.”

The downtown has proven a draw for empty nesters looking to sell their suburban home and move to the core, where they can walk to more amenities, MacDonald said.

She also cheered the news the development will be condominiums for sale, saying that ensures established homeowners will be moving to the core.

“You need a mix and this will offer that. We have a lot of students and young workers, now we need people at the high end of that mix.”

The London and St. Thomas Association of Realtors recently reported there were 118 condominium sales in August in the London area, a 1.6% increase over August 2009.
__________________
visit my mini city at http://londonto.myminicity.com/tra
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #89  
Old Posted Sep 21, 2010, 1:17 PM
MolsonExport's Avatar
MolsonExport MolsonExport is offline
The Vomit Bag.
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Liver & Onions
Posts: 21,477
This is some great news. I am even more pleased that we will see an influx of condo-owners downtown. Time for a grocery store. The best part of Downtown (King street) is about to get even better.
__________________
There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know. -Donald Rumsfeld
Didn't you notice on the plane when you started talking, eventually I started reading the vomit bag?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #90  
Old Posted Sep 21, 2010, 1:21 PM
MolsonExport's Avatar
MolsonExport MolsonExport is offline
The Vomit Bag.
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Liver & Onions
Posts: 21,477
You'd think there would at least be something on their website, but nada:

http://www.tricar.com/renaissance/index.php
__________________
There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know. -Donald Rumsfeld
Didn't you notice on the plane when you started talking, eventually I started reading the vomit bag?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #91  
Old Posted Sep 21, 2010, 4:20 PM
ldoto's Avatar
ldoto ldoto is offline
Londoner
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: London,Ont
Posts: 1,260
You bet me to the news!!!!!
__________________
lovelondon.ca - The new place to discuss London and area!
Forest City
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #92  
Old Posted Sep 22, 2010, 1:21 AM
Snark Snark is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 336
Quote:
Originally Posted by MolsonExport View Post
You'd think there would at least be something on their website, but nada:

http://www.tricar.com/renaissance/index.php
They likely won't advertise 'till they can sell. They can't sell 'till they have financing - which is contingent on having their permits, a condo corporation set up, etc. They don't need a permit to dig a hole as they are now, but they will need one to pour a foundation.

It will happen soon though. The City will do everything to expedite this. This is a very important threshold being crossed.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #93  
Old Posted Sep 22, 2010, 1:03 PM
MolsonExport's Avatar
MolsonExport MolsonExport is offline
The Vomit Bag.
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Liver & Onions
Posts: 21,477
Basic Marketing 101 is to offer info and teaser advertisements...get people interested/talking about the project.
__________________
There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know. -Donald Rumsfeld
Didn't you notice on the plane when you started talking, eventually I started reading the vomit bag?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #94  
Old Posted Sep 22, 2010, 5:01 PM
ForestryW's Avatar
ForestryW ForestryW is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Kitchener, Ontario
Posts: 307
Pardon my ignorance, but up until now I thought that these were all rental units, but now it seems they are condos...

Can anyone clear this up?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #95  
Old Posted Sep 22, 2010, 6:26 PM
Kokkei Mizu's Avatar
Kokkei Mizu Kokkei Mizu is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by van Hemessen View Post
Pardon my ignorance, but up until now I thought that these were all rental units, but now it seems they are condos...

Can anyone clear this up?
I'm not positive but I believe the first tower was all rentals. And the second tower will either have some condos or will be all condos.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #96  
Old Posted Sep 22, 2010, 6:35 PM
ForestryW's Avatar
ForestryW ForestryW is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Kitchener, Ontario
Posts: 307
In that case you'd think TriCar would be all over trying to pre-sell these things. What gives?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #97  
Old Posted Sep 27, 2010, 12:15 AM
haljackey's Avatar
haljackey haljackey is offline
User Registered
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: London, Ontario
Posts: 1,790
Diagram update: http://skyscraperpage.com/diagrams/?cityID=61

The title of this thread should now be changed to Under Construction.

Some images I took at the site on Friday:





Reply With Quote
     
     
  #98  
Old Posted Sep 27, 2010, 3:24 AM
Kokkei Mizu's Avatar
Kokkei Mizu Kokkei Mizu is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by haljackey View Post
Diagram update: http://skyscraperpage.com/diagrams/?cityID=61

The title of this thread should now be changed to Under Construction.

Some images I took at the site on Friday:
Very awesome to see progress!! Love the photos
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #99  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2010, 3:10 AM
bolognium's Avatar
bolognium bolognium is offline
bro
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: London, ON
Posts: 381
Here's a picture of the site from basically the same location as haljacky's photo. The pit is mostly complete and that blue structure looks like it could be the base of a tower crane.





Let's get this second ugly twin tower under underway!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #100  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2010, 11:15 PM
sparky212's Avatar
sparky212 sparky212 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: London Ont.
Posts: 412
they put the rest of the crane up today
__________________
visit my mini city at http://londonto.myminicity.com/tra
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > SSP: Local London > Projects & Construction Updates
Forum Jump


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 7:49 AM.

     

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.