Salt Lake:Official development news thread - Part 2

[chad.farnes]

One other article about the OR show: http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/money/5...tdoor.html.csp

As I was eating dinner, I was watching Fox 13 news. They were discussing the idea of a convention hotel and were extremely supportive of it (which I found surprising because I would have thought that they would side of the "it will take customers away from other hotels and put them into a government run hotel" argument). What they (and by they it was the two news casters in the studio and the one outside reporting) said is that a conference hotel is really needed in Salt Lake right now to keep the OR show here, and that by doing so, Salt Lake would be able to get some of the other large shows that they currently can't because of the lack of a hotel. I don't know if public opinion is slowly changing in favor of the hotel or if they have always had that opinion, but I felt like it was a very positive piece in favor of the hotel.

Also in this article (http://fox13now.com/2012/04/25/outdo...ing-salt-lake/), Gov. Herbert is quoted as saying, "I know [the OR show is] growing, it’s been such a successful convention, they need more space. I’m prepared to work with them to get more space and we always have great outdoor recreation here in Utah ." I think it is a great sign that something is coming if the Governor is willing to work with them (although we'll see to what extent) to keep the show here.

[delts145]

Just a reminder, as has been pointed out by many forumers in the past. The Convention Hotel is much more than just a large block of rooms 'on sight'. It also would account for a major expansion in exibition space within the hotel itself. This could be as much or more than an additional 100,000 sq. ft, which is a major part of OR's complaint. Also, accomodating much of the executive 'on sight' perks demanded by an efficiently run convention.

The Hotel has become a must now, in order to keep the OR and bring in additional mega conventions that would come to Salt Lake, but are choosing to go elsewhere at this time. Not building the Hotel is financially stupid, as we will quickly lose more in revenue than would be it's ultimate burden in construction.

CCC is aruguably one of a small handfull of the most elegant lifestyle centers in the U.S., especially in a downtown setting adjacent to a convention center. The proximity of Salt Lake's stunning Temple Square gardens, performance venues, and outdoor mountainscape is also second to none. Add the UPAC for first run show tours, a few more stellar retailers in the mix, and Downtown Salt Lake City will be unbeatable.

[Comrade Reynolds]

Originally Posted by delts145

Just a reminder, as has been pointed out by many forumers in the past. The Convention Hotel is much more than just a large block of rooms 'on sight'. It also would account for a major expansion in exibition space within the hotel itself. This could be as much or more than an additional 100,000 sq. ft, which is a major part of OR's complaint. Also, accomodating much of the executive 'on sight' perks demanded by an efficiently run convention.

The Hotel has become a must now, in order to keep the OR and bring in additional mega conventions that would come to Salt Lake, but are choosing to go elsewhere at this time. Not building the Hotel is financially stupid, as we will quickly lose more in revenue than would be it's ultimate burden in construction.

CCC is aruguably one of a small handfull of the most elegant lifestyle centers in the U.S., especially in a downtown setting adjacent to a convention center. The proximity of Salt Lake's stunning Temple Square gardens, performance venues, and outdoor mountainscape is also second to none. Add the UPAC for first run show tours, a few more stellar retailers in the mix, and Downtown Salt Lake City will be unbeatable.

The problem is that they're also not too enamored with the fragmented convention space, so unless the hotel is directly connected to the convention center, even the space they offer might not help entice them much.

[Future Mayor]

The direct connection to the convention center is what makes the convention hotel just that. It allows for connected convention space for conventions, such as outdoor retailers, that are needing more exhibit and meeting space, but want the convience of having it all in one connceted location.

As for the fairpark, there is not way it could EVER be the home of the OR show, it could simply be a location for them to exhibit a few of their products. It doesn't have nearly the interior exhibit space that the Salt Palace has.

Urban Boy has been following this topic and asked me if I would post this.



I like the idea, it takes into account the need for a 1000+ room hotel, and most likely the final expansion of the Salt Palace. This map also includes moving the UPAC to the block west of it's current proposed location.

[jtrent77]

I like the idea as well, but part of me says, if we are going to add on to the south, might as well make the connection to the west as well and put all of 200 W underneath exhibition space. Although that might cost a pretty penny.

[SLC Projects]

Not sure how I feel about turning what used to be four city blocks into one mega block.

[Lilljemalm]

I like Future Mayor's layout.
Many years ago, I worked in downtown Atlanta. There were a group of 12 to 20 story buildings that housed office and exhibit space for industrial groups, all called ----mart. There was the Apparel Mart, Rug Mart, etc. They mostly had to do with textiles and clothing markets. Has there ever been any thought into building something of that sort in SLC for the outdoor retail/sporting goods industries? Two buildings, 12 to 15 floors each, could contain exhibit and office space for outdoor equipment manufacturers and retailers, giving them a place to meet, network and conduct trade all year long. One could be the Summer Outdoor Mart and the other the Winter Outdoor Mart. They could be build within a block or two of the Salt Palace and could enhance the Outdoor Retail Show ---- and make it harder for the show to move elsewhere.

[Future Mayor]

Originally Posted by SLC Projects

Not sure how I feel about turning what used to be four city blocks into one mega block.

While I agree to some extent, when is the last time any of us actually traveled on 100 S between 200 and 300 West. Ok I did a few weeks ago after a Jazz game, on foot, but other than that I can't really remember the last time.

It does have an access road just east of 300 W, probably 275 W that connects 100 S to 200 S and a few e/w accesses to the street from 300 W. I think it would actually end up making that block much more walkable. Plus the addition of the Japan Town Plaza would create a nice gathering place.

Side note, A former forumer created it and e-mailed it to me, I simply posted the image.

[stayinginformed]

That area of 100 South is used a few times a year for Japanese community events. Including one this Saturday, the Japan Festival. They close off the street on that whole block between 300 West and 200 West. I do not think we should build over the road there.

[Future Mayor]

It seems as though the Plaza and the new N/S street would result in even more usuable space for the festivals.

[delts145]

Originally Posted by Comrade Reynolds

The problem is that they're also not too enamored with the fragmented convention space, so unless the hotel is directly connected to the convention center, even the space they offer might not help entice them much.

I've only ever advocated a direct connection. Also, this is one of the major reasons I would prefer the Convention Hotel Complex be located at the Royal Wood Plaza.

[SLC Projects]

On going.......

Salt Lake fights to keep Outdoor Retailer show
By Peter Samore

SALT LAKE CITY — The Outdoor Retailer show is considering new digs away from the Salt Palace and Utah, but "Visit Salt Lake" says it's ready for battle. The large, semi-annual Outdoor Retailer show has given notice that it might leave Salt Lake City after 2014.

CEO Scott Beck said that Outdoor Retailer has told him that it's just looking for the right fit as it continues to grow.

"They've given clear explanations as to what the right city looks like," he said. "They've also been very clear to say there's no such thing as the right city."

More
http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=148...-retailer-show


blah, blah, blah, we know this already, when will we hear anything about the hotel.

[StevenF]

One new thing I haven't seen is the need for 900 taxi cabs. There is an area Salt Lake has been fighting for years and limiting. I remember during the Olympics that was one of the complaints that there wasn't enough cabs and Salt Lake didn't really budge in that area.

[Makid]

Excluding a few times a year, there isn't enough demand for 900 more cabs or even 900 cabs total.

I do think that if the convention center is expanded, they should design it to be able to go vertical with future expansions. That way they can limit the overall foot print of the center.

[TonyAnderson]

Originally Posted by Makid

Excluding a few times a year, there isn't enough demand for 900 more cabs or even 900 cabs total.

I do think that if the convention center is expanded, they should design it to be able to go vertical with future expansions. That way they can limit the overall foot print of the center.

Why does the city control the number of cabs?

[Orlando]

FYI, the masterplan of the convention center is to cover all four blocks. I was there when they were going through the design phase of the new Salt Palace. I also happen to know the Project Architect for the original new Salt Palace, the one that was completed in '96. What I'm very annoyed at is the cheapo SLC County commissioner(s) who have allowed this piece meal expansion. From what I understand from the last expansion in 2006, the commissioner pushed for the cheapest solution. I'm afraid that's what they got. The lasest expansion is awful, IMO. They should have expanded to the SE corner of S. Temple and 3rd West and fill in the gap between there and the old Double Tree Hotel. and then they should have continued along 3rd West to the NE corner of 1st S. and 3rd West. On top of that, they really didn't check the architects design with the community. It doesn't match anything from the original new Salt Palace. The ugly orange concrete is a crying shame. And, whoever designed the windows and canopy of the portion on S. Temple did not do it well, at all. It's quite amateurish. On the other hand, the portion along 3rd West is cool. I wish they would have stretched that along the length of the block to the corners. The original new Salt Palace went through lengthy design reviews. I went to one of them. They need to do that for any building in the urban core.

[SLC Projects]

Do we really need 900 more cabs when there's a airport trax line going in?

[Comrade Reynolds]

Originally Posted by Orlando

FYI, the masterplan of the convention center is to cover all four blocks. I was there when they were going through the design phase of the new Salt Palace. I also happen to know the Project Architect for the original new Salt Palace, the one that was completed in '96. What I'm very annoyed at is the cheapo SLC County commissioner(s) who have allowed this piece meal expansion. From what I understand from the last expansion in 2006, the commissioner pushed for the cheapest solution. I'm afraid that's what they got. The lasest expansion is awful, IMO. They should have expanded to the SE corner of S. Temple and 3rd West and fill in the gap between there and the old Double Tree Hotel. and then they should have continued along 3rd West to the NE corner of 1st S. and 3rd West. On top of that, they really didn't check the architects design with the community. It doesn't match anything from the original new Salt Palace. The ugly orange concrete is a crying shame. And, whoever designed the windows and canopy of the portion on S. Temple did not do it well, at all. It's quite amateurish. On the other hand, the portion along 3rd West is cool. I wish they would have stretched that along the length of the block to the corners. The original new Salt Palace went through lengthy design reviews. I went to one of them. They need to do that for any building in the urban core.

Four blocks?

Downtown Salt Lake City, circa 2025:



Really, tho, I have a hard time believing anything with that much dead space should take up four city blocks - and we're talking four SLC blocks. The Salt Palace has effectively divided downtown. The continued expansion will only deepen that divide for years to come. I know, I know, it needs to happen and who cares, anyway, right? But I do. I think western downtown is a hole and I'm afraid this isn't going to help matters.

The city really dropped the ball building the convention center so close to the city center. It should have been built west of the ESA, as most city convention centers are built on the outskirts of downtown, not just a mere block from the core - or tucked 'em away in a spot where they wouldn't act like a wall between areas.

Whatever. Build it out. What's a whole extra block, right? It's just a shame 200 S on the western end of downtown is quickly becoming isolated from the rest of downtown. I just fear, in 20 years, we'll be dreading having the convention center so close to the core. I feel, though maybe I'm wrong, it will stunt the growth of our center and create two downtowns that rarely, if ever, connect to one another.

The city should integrate some type of mixed-use development into the 200 S side of the convention center if they want to continue expanding westward. I think there is potential in the area, especially with the street car, but it's going to take investment and smart planning. 200 S should be the southern link between Main & the Gateway, while South Temple acts as the northern link (and can I say how much I hate that 100 S is cutoff here?). Support the redevelopment of the northern block on 200 S between 200 & 300 W. It's ugly. It's got an abandoned storefront, more parking than businesses and it's also what convention center goers see when they arrive into the city.

I guess my point is is that I think western SLC could turn more into an entertainment district with the convention center being where it is. But because it's such a hodgepodge of parking lots, lame-ass retail and shitty cheap hotels, there is no incentive whatsoever to wander through that area of the city. Between Main & the Gateway, you literally pass by more parking lots than businesses. That could be acceptable, to a degree, if it was on the outskirts of downtown. But it's not. The outskirts are still around the area of the Gateway now, not West Temple.

I mean, I've liked what they've sorta done with 200 S west of 300 West, but it needs to continue eastward and truly bridge that gap. Salt Lake is just too scattered right now and it's sad. Our downtown is great at Main and on the eastern side of the city, but everything west of Main, up until the Gateway, sucks donkey ass. It's ugly. It's desolate and I want to change that.

You know what? Fuck the Outdoor Retailer. I'm tired of their whining every few years. If they want out that badly, tell 'em to go. Yeah, it would hurt economically, but we'd get over it. No reason for the city to be held hostage by these people. Yes, build the convention center hotel. No, do not expand the Salt Palace any further.

[John Martin]

It's called the "Outdoor Retailer" convention.. why don't they just expand the convention onto the surrounding parking lots? Only half kidding..

[SLC Projects]

Originally Posted by Comrade Reynolds

You know what? Fuck the Outdoor Retailer. I'm tired of their whining every few years. If they want out that badly, tell 'em to go. Yeah, it would hurt economically, but we'd get over it. No reason for the city to be held hostage by these people. Yes, build the convention center hotel. No, do not expand the Salt Palace any further.

It's not just trying to keep the "Outdoor Retailer" convention, but also trying to get those other conventions who have otherwise looked over SLC for not having enough space, hotel rooms, whatever. I'm glad they keep bitching, maybe then something will finally get done with that convention hotel.

I do agree with not wanted to see the S.P expand over anymore blocks.
I think if the S.P. was design the same way Provo did theirs it wouldn't of taken up two and a half + blocks.