Gateway Discussion: Port Mann Bridge/Hwy 1/RapidBus

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by madmigs

Article about tolling and the port mann and red ink


http://www.bclocalnews.com/greater_v...116879748.html

That seems pretty reasonable, given the population increases expected for Surrey.

Massive spikes in oil prices or other big economic factors could change that.

Besides, lets remember, in this case "bleeding red ink" refers to not being 100% user-pay... I'm not a user of this bridge, but if a 3.3B project actually costs a few $100m of general revenue, I won't be whining too hard about it.

[DKaz]

2022... "Motorists have been advised to find other methods of travel after the Port Mann Bridge was repossessed by the financiers to be put up for foreclosure auction. $300/barrel oil and the extension of the Expo Line to Langley has been blamed on for the demise of Port Mann Bridge traffic which is recording just 60,000 trips a day. The province has opted to default on payments to instead focus on the multi billion dollar rehabilitation of the Expo Line which will include a new dual express track and long deferred platform extensions on the heavily overcrowded line which sees an average of 500,000 passengers per weekday."

;D

[bulliver]

Great pics Metro, thanks for those.

[Mininari]

Thats pretty amusing but I'll take a different cynical stance:

Maybe this?

"Sept 06 2022: Well, its back to work and school, and traffic at the heavily-congested Port Mann Bridge has never been worse. Out-of-control sprawl in Langley, Abbotsford, and Chilliwack has created a flood of traffic from a commuter "watershed" of epic proportions. The Lower Mainland is being nicknamed "Los Angeles Basin of the North," choked with traffic, smog, and sprawling retail... ... talks with the City of Delta broke down again over the continued push to upgrade the 72nd Avenue and 91A intersection to a full interchange. The province hoped to include this as part of their SFPR Freeway Upgrade project (Estimated at $2.0B), but are claiming "scope changes" required them to downgrade the interchange to a partial movements interchange... ... The cost of an average single family detached dwelling in the Lower Mainland eclipsed $1.5M. The surge in single-family development in the valley, spurred by the new bridge, did little to sooth housing demand. When asked about the market, Joe Black said "I have no effing clue how I'm going to afford to live anywhere around here"... ... Crews continue to clean up the tangled mess of the collapsed Patullo Bridge. Early progress on the much-anticipated refurbishment revealed that the bridge, was in fact, being held together only by rust. Translink officials were unwilling to comment. "Why did they wait this long? I mean what were they thinking? What were they waiting for? The second coming?"... ... Translink officials continue to debate which technology to use on the newly re-promised Evergreen Line. Port Moody Mayor Joe Trasolini was red in the face, demanding to know when the "effing Murray Clarke Connector would be built." Estimates for that project have it at $120M and climbing... ...

I could go on and on...

[DKaz]

That's just depressing! I was making a funny.

[WarrenC12]

Good ones. I think in 2025 the PMB will be just fine (revenue wise). I think there will be a relatively smooth shift from fossil fuel to electric single occupancy vehicles over the next ~30 years. I say relatively smooth considering it will still be the most massive transportation shift since horses to horseless carriages.

[Stingray2004]

Since some offbeat ideas have been posted here I thought that I might chime in. Here's a 'logical' idea that has not yet been bandied about - Don't scrap the old PMB just move it down river as a replacement for the old Pattullo. Voila, two birds killed with one stone.

Caveat, one must have the mindset of a Kelly Bundy and test for clear airflow between ears in order for this concept to make sense:

Don't Scrap the Port Mann, Move It

Published: February 24, 2011 3:00 PM

With regard to the Pattullo Bridge replacement or rebuild, I would like to offer this idea as a possible solution. The existing Port Mann Bridge could simply be dismantled and relocated to the north side of the existing railway bridge that is next to the existing Pattullo Bridge.

Large sections of the bridge including roadway could be barged down the river and repositioned on new foundations. This new location would offer better alignment with existing roads and as opposed to alternative ideas, would also significantly reduce disruption to traffic flow during construction.
The Port Mann Bridge has five lanes and has already had some seismic upgrading. Any further upgrading could be done at the time of construction.

This bridge is scheduled to be dismantled anyway at significant cost, as it will have to be broken down into pieces small enough that can be trucked away.
I’m sure that if the appropriate people were to “do the numbers” on this idea we may find it to be a viable solution that would be far more economical than a new bridge involving tolls and certainly better than refurbishing the existing Pattullo Bridge as it does not have adequate foundations to support any additional weight to the structure.

It seems unfortunate enough that we should scrap a perfectly good bridge and build an expensive new one that we will have to pay tolls for, but even more unfortunate that we scrap it when it could be the logical replacement for the Pattullo Bridge.

John Call

http://www.bclocalnews.com/opinion/l...116875768.html

[bulliver]

^ I love it! I wonder if it is feasible.

[logan5]

Originally Posted by madmigs

Article about tolling and the port mann and red ink


http://www.bclocalnews.com/greater_v...116879748.html

Something is wrong here.

This year Canadian corporations are getting a 6 billion dollar tax break. Every year corporations get a greater and greater share of our countries overall wealth, while the working people face higher costs and higher taxes.

If corporations paid their fare share of taxes, we would easily be able to pay for the new Port Mann Bridge, and the Evergreen Line, and the UBC extension, and so on.

Instead we are charging tolls and raising taxes on the middle class to finance major infrastructure projects.

This is just another transfer of wealth from the working people to the very rich.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by logan5

Something is wrong here.

This year Canadian corporations are getting a 6 billion dollar tax break. Every year corporations get a greater and greater share of our countries overall wealth, while the working people face higher costs and higher taxes.

If corporations paid their fare share of taxes, we would easily be able to pay for the new Port Mann Bridge, and the Evergreen Line, and the UBC extension, and so on.

Instead we are charging tolls and raising taxes on the middle class to finance major infrastructure projects.

This is just another transfer of wealth from the working people to the very rich.

I'd like a source for your $6B figure.

You too can get a bigger and bigger share of the wealth. Use your income (from a corporation) to buy some shares and you too can reap the profits of any publicly traded company.

Define "fair share?" Would you rather these companies pack up and move to another country?

How does transit get built? Tax dollars. Where do those tax dollars come from? Corporations, people employed by corporations, capital gains tax, property tax, and so on.

I am far from right-wing, but I can't stand anti-business grandstanding from those who think economic activity (of which a portion goes to the government) can be generated by unicorns and happy thoughts.

[logan5]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

I'd like a source for your $6B figure.

You too can get a bigger and bigger share of the wealth. Use your income (from a corporation) to buy some shares and you too can reap the profits of any publicly traded company.

Define "fair share?" Would you rather these companies pack up and move to another country?

How does transit get built? Tax dollars. Where do those tax dollars come from? Corporations, people employed by corporations, capital gains tax, property tax, and so on.

I am far from right-wing, but I can't stand anti-business grandstanding from those who think economic activity (of which a portion goes to the government) can be generated by unicorns and happy thoughts.

Canada has the lowest rate among the G7 nations. And there is another rate reduction coming next year. Ask Revenue Canada.

The minimum wage has been at $8/hr since 2001. Many rich corporations choose to still pay these low wages despite tax breaks. They're only getting richer.

Trickle down economics does not work.

[Stingray2004]

Originally Posted by logan5

Canada has the lowest rate among the G7 nations. And there is another rate reduction coming next year. Ask Revenue Canada.

The minimum wage has been at $8/hr since 2001. Many rich corporations choose to still pay these low wages despite tax breaks. They're only getting richer.

This is the PMB/Hwy 1 thread. Take your working class warrior crap to the politics section.

[officedweller]

Great shots Metro-One!

The 3 segments that are suspened above the others - presumably those will slot in between the ones below - but there doesn't look to be enough space.
The left column is an abutment - and it looks like the last segment will sit in a recess on its face, the roadway then rises and the last segment on the right of the pic will sit atop the column.

[Metro-One]

Thanks Officedweller and Bulliver! (I was starting to worry I went through all that trouble for nothing, hehe )

Anyways I was able to take a few more pics today of the Cape Horn Interchange, but again I have to say short of an airplane this is one tough project to photograph. I tried sooo many spots north and south of it but it seems everywhere there were houses, trees, shrubs and power lines blocking the lens! (seriously, I could not find one decent break the whole Dawes Hill area, was very tempted to trespass into some peoples yards!

Nonetheless, I was able to squeeze out a few photos, not as grande or extensive as I was hoping, but here they are anyways!

A quick snap of the Lougheed Easbound flyover




here is the #1 westbound (CD lane) off ramp tunnel under the #1 to United Boulevard. (at first I thought it was the Lougheed Eastbound underpass but then realized this one is located east of the railroad tracks)




I had to sneak into the work yard for these two (the sun was in the worst spot as well!). These are the westbound highway 1 off ramp elevated structures as the fly over the Mary Hill onramp.






And here is the northern elevated structure of the highway 1 westbound off ramp to Lougheed eastbound. (These pics are taken from the thistles located alongside Planet Ice)








And last but not least, the only tiny unobscured window I could find of the project from the Dawes Hill area.




The largest fly over, the Lougheed Westbound to #1 eastbound only has its supports currently up, so I am looking forward to see that one take shape! (but it is the hardest of the bunch to photograph, haha!)

All pics are my own - Flickr link: http://www.flickr.com/photos/30634635@N03/

Hope you enjoy them

Cheers

[giallo]

Awesome updates, Metro!

[shaners]

Thanks Metro! Great shots!

[vansky]

luv the pics, the viaducts....highways, feels like american...what a great feeling, except there's only "one true highway"in van~~~

[hollywoodnorth]

ace work as per usual Metro-One!

[SpongeG]

Originally Posted by logan5

Something is wrong here.

This year Canadian corporations are getting a 6 billion dollar tax break. Every year corporations get a greater and greater share of our countries overall wealth, while the working people face higher costs and higher taxes.

If corporations paid their fare share of taxes, we would easily be able to pay for the new Port Mann Bridge, and the Evergreen Line, and the UBC extension, and so on.

Instead we are charging tolls and raising taxes on the middle class to finance major infrastructure projects.

This is just another transfer of wealth from the working people to the very rich.

corporations hire us tax payers though without the breaks they shut down we lose or jobs

[DKaz]

Great shots, Metro-One!