PHILADELPHIA | The Development Thread VIII

[wanderer34]

ACC dead, huh????!!!! That's a mighty big shame to hear, especially when that tower had a lot of potential to gradually change Phila for the better, but it dies instead. Hopefully, the parcel never gets built until a similar plan comes about (another ACC???) since I feel the city can blame itself for not doing anything to lower it's business taxes and not generating a business-friendly atmosphere in CC. Someday a supertall will occupy 18th and Arch, but I guess this wasn't meant to be!!!

[Ninjawho]

Originally Posted by Capsule F

Whats so bad about it?

I was able to sit in the plaza on saturday while they were putting the paintbrush in. The quality is second or third grade. Its super apparent this was done on the cheap. Which makes perfect sense because lenfest was going to take the grant away because the school sat on the grant for so long. The utilization of space is horrible. Granted its narrow amd theres not alot of room to begin with. But Olin could have done a better job of not only designing the space but also how the parts fit together. The one redeeming part is the wooden benches. The only problem is they clash so badly with the cheapo brick that in the end they just look tacky.

I dont think the paint brush was anyones choice either. Its a big stretch to call oldenburg an american artist. Having a koons would have only been a bit more expensive but so much better for the school. he represents a visual style that doesnt fit in our time or school.

the hamilton building was done similarly. On the cheap and hodge podge. So now we have three completely diffrerent idea smashed up into each other and the disorganization shows.

[von hayes]

Originally Posted by phillyaggie

This is why, for example, the TOD being developed east of Temple by the Puerto Rican CDC is doing it by itself and not in concert with SEPTA...and SEPTA won't earn any incremental tax revenues or profits for land sale, etc.

APM purchased the land from the City and not Septa. It is currently used by PGW employees as a parking lot.

[phillyaggie]

Originally Posted by von hayes

APM purchased the land from the City and not Septa. It is currently used by PGW employees as a parking lot.

exactly. SEPTA didn't even own it, but this was one location considered for a TOD in the city.

[brian.odonnell20]

whats the possibility of nbcu kicking off a supertall ?

[Pennsgrant]

Originally Posted by brian.odonnell20

whats the possibility of nbcu kicking off a supertall ?

About 0.0000001%

NBCU signed a 10 yr. $1/2 Billion dollar lease at Rockefeller Center back in March.

Comcast has already outgrown Comcast Center so they could still very much be in play as a tenant at 18th + Arch. I just dont think NBC is part of that expansion at least not in the short term.

[thenbagis]

Originally Posted by Pennsgrant

About 0.0000001%

NBCU signed a 10 yr. $1/2 Billion dollar lease at Rockefeller Center back in March.

Comcast has already outgrown Comcast Center so they could still very much be in play as a tenant at 18th + Arch. I just dont think NBC is part of that expansion at least not in the short term.

The one thing I don't understand is... if Comcast has outgrown their building and/or NBC is moving some functions to Philly... why wouldn't they use Phase II of the existing property? Seems expensive to buy another property.

[Cro Burnham]

Phase II of Comcast Center is right on top of the SEPTA train tracks along JFK, which probably imposes structural and construction logistic complications limiting the potential size and height of the building. I assume this accounts for the squatness in the renderings. The Arch St site LPT just acquired has none of those limitations and affords the flexibility to build something much larger should the need arise.

[josef]

Originally Posted by alasi

I think Inga already has weighed in. You got your wish.

Er, that article was written by "Stacey Burling, Inquirer Staff Writer", not Inga. In fact... I think Inga's done "for now":

This is my last regular "Changing Skyline" column for awhile. I'm heading to Cambridge, Mass., where I will be a Loeb Fellow at Harvard University's Graduate School of Design. Look for my blog reports at philly.com/philly/blogs/changing-skyline.

This was in the Lenfest article at http://articles.philly.com/2011-08-1...windows-design

[thenbagis]

Cro- Fair point about SEPTA's tracks... I guess the only way Comcast would be involved in the Arch St site is if they doing something big. Otherwise, if it was simply outgrowing Comcast Center, they'd build Phase II.


Josef- Thanks for the info on Inga, must have missed that bit.

Here's Harvard's bio for her:

Inga Saffron is the architecture critic for the Philadelphia Inquirer.  She writes not only about new buildings, but about development, urban planning, preservation, public space and neighborhood revitalization. She is particularly interested in Philadelphia’s struggle to maintain its dense urban qualities in a world organized around automobiles and highways. Inga will explore the tensions cities face as they seek a balance between the architecture of spectacle and the architecture of daily life.   

http://www.gsd.harvard.edu/professio...eb_fellowship/

[Aaamazarite]

Originally Posted by Ninjawho

Which makes perfect sense because lenfest was going to take the grant away because the school sat on the grant for so long.

I believe a big part of the delay was due to dealing with the city's bureaucracy regarding shutting down Cherry Street. Work was to begin at the beginning of summer 2010... they closed the street for some prep work and the city made them reopen it, iirc.

[Ninjawho]

Originally Posted by Aaamazarite

I believe a big part of the delay was due to dealing with the city's bureaucracy regarding shutting down Cherry Street. Work was to begin at the beginning of summer 2010... they closed the street for some prep work and the city made them reopen it, iirc.

Im actually refering to pre 2010. The Lenfets gave the school money for the project in the mid to early 2000s. They threatened to take the money away in 08 or 09.

[Aaamazarite]

Originally Posted by Ninjawho

Im actually refering to pre 2010. The Lenfets gave the school money for the project in the mid to early 2000s. They threatened to take the money away in 08 or 09.

Interesting... I wonder if PAFA was waiting for confirmation that the PA convention center expansion was still a go. PAFA made a whole lot of improvements all at once in the mid 00's until now... I wish they would have focused on that gigantic empty lot behind the Hamilton building before they did this plaza.

[Ninjawho]

Originally Posted by Aaamazarite

Interesting... I wonder if PAFA was waiting for confirmation that the PA convention center expansion was still a go. PAFA made a whole lot of improvements all at once in the mid 00's until now... I wish they would have focused on that gigantic empty lot behind the Hamilton building before they did this plaza.

I'm not certain we own that lot. However, it seems to be generally accepted here, (meaning staff), that it will be a hotel sometime in the "near" future.

[thenbagis]

Another opportunity to share your opinion:

SEPTA survey in regards to the smartcards.

Survey Link: https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/2LCWRPW

Planphilly article on the survey: http://planphilly.com/septa-releases-smart-card-survey

[josef]

I still don't get how you'd pay going in to the city from a suburban station. Would you just walk on, and get a fare card from the conductor?

[volguus zildrohar]

Done and done. A lot of turnstiles may be needed for RR stations like Suburban with multiple access points to multiple platforms. It would be hairy at first.

[thenbagis]

Originally Posted by josef

I still don't get how you'd pay going in to the city from a suburban station. Would you just walk on, and get a fare card from the conductor?

From the second question... I gathered that they were expecting you to tag a pedestal of some sort (like a badge) reader on the station platform. To me, it sounded way too easy to bypass.
(someone else please post this question... I can't get back into the survey)


btw... I think they've dropped the idea of one-way payment (only paying in center city)

The group voted 11-1 in favor of continuing with two-way fares under the new payment system. Riders would have to tag in and out at the beginning and end of each trip. That could be accomplished at turnstiles to be installed at the five Center City stations, validating machines to be installed at many outlying stations or by a conductor.

[thenbagis]

Nothing really new... but covers a few of the things discussed here.

Another Comcast tower in Center City?
Joseph N. DiStefano, Thursday, August 25, 2011
http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/i...nter-City.html

A buyer represented by Liberty Property Trust on Aug. 3 paid $40 million for the 1800 Arch St., ending a longshot proposal by developers to build the tallest building in Center City Philadelphia, according to real estate sources familiar with the sale.

Seller Multi Employers Property Trust, a union pension investment fund, had paid $32 million in 2007. "We're glad MEPT made a nice profit," David Richter, head of Marlton-based Hill International Group's real estate affiliate, which had hoped to develop a 1,500-foot tower on the site, told me. "We would have preferred they hold onto the property. I think we're getting close to the end of the recession. But MEPT got a good offer, for the best piece of property in Center City."

[Phil_North]

Another Comcast office building certainly would not be out of the question. Not because of NBCU, but Comcast itself. Comcast currently still has office space at both 15th and Market and at 1717 Arch street. While the total amount of office space occupied by Comcast in these other two buildings may not be enough to fill an entire building, a small 18 story building could work. If there is ever a move to consolidate other offices or expand current operations, another building would not be out of the question.