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  #1  
Old Posted: Nov 2, 2009, 10:48 PM
bornagainbiking bornagainbiking is offline
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Ontario car insurance reforms

It is all a big rip off anyway. Crack down on the abusers. Why do I have to pick up the tab for insurance money invested and their losses.
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  #2  
Old Posted: Nov 2, 2009, 11:27 PM
vid's Avatar
vid vid is offline
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Learn how insurance works and re-write your post, please.
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It's not about what you don't have—it's the little you've got, and how far you can run with it.
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  #3  
Old Posted: Nov 3, 2009, 2:00 AM
bornagainbiking bornagainbiking is offline
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So sorry

I just pay huge and never an accident. I did listen to CHML 900 today and they did say that some insurance company money could have been invested some of the massive rates they charge. Don't try and tell me there is no profit in it or there wouldn't be so many companies.
Must be good RBC, TD and Desjardine are in the business now.
So I don't care how it works it is still a rip off.
Check out the insurance rates from coast to coast. My 6 month rebate from ICBC paid for my first yr in NS.
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  #4  
Old Posted: Nov 3, 2009, 2:09 PM
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The problem with provincial insurance plans, however, is that the decisions they make are final. In Ontario you can dispute their claims. In Manitoba you can not--you must accept their decision, the courts won't consider it. So you could very well find yourself out far more than in Ontario.

I know letters to the editor aren't the best ways of backing up debate (especially when they're anecdotal) but I want to provide a contrary opinion to the discussion and this is more well-formed than anything I can compose:

Quote:
A tale of insurance
Chronicle-Journal | Letter to the Editor | October 28, 2009
http://www.chroniclejournal.com/stories.php?id=220528

I would like to comment on Mary Ann Macnaughton‘s letter (Oct. 22) about public vs. private insurance systems. I think it‘s important for the people of Northwestern Ontario to know the “truth behind the myths” of this topic.
When my wife and I moved from Thunder Bay to Winnipeg in 1998, we thought that our car insurance would be less expensive, based on what we had been told by many people. Imagine our surprise when we learned that, despite having a letter from our Thunder Bay insurer indicating claims-free status, we had to pay $150 more per year in Winnipeg, with less coverage!
Our next surprise came several years later when we got into a minor accident with a Winnipeg city bus. Despite the fact that the police said the bus driver was at fault, Manitoba Public Insurance Corp. (MPIC) found me to be 100 per cent at fault! What was worse was that the courts said MPIC had the final say in the matter.

I won‘t even get into the nightmares that people who are injured in car accidents have with our government insurer. It is not a pleasant experience.
Trust me when I say, do not ever get rid of your current system of vehicle insurance; it is superior to ours in every way.

Wayne Boesch
Winnipeg
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It's not about what you don't have—it's the little you've got, and how far you can run with it.
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  #5  
Old Posted: Nov 6, 2009, 3:03 AM
brett.electrician brett.electrician is offline
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I think ont is stupidly expensive regardless of what happens claim wise. Within a 1 year period I was insured in BC, then Ont, then SK. Same vehicle, no change in drivers record. BC was through SGI and CAA combo for $560 a year. My first Ont quote was $5000 for equal coverage. Got it down to $2200 after ditching collision, raising my deductable, and using the same company as the rest of my family. Moved to SK and SGI insured me for $1200 with equal coverage to that I had from ICBC. I have found that insurance of any kind seems to be more expensive in Ont then anywhere else, whereas most other goods and services are cheaper.
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  #6  
Old Posted: Nov 12, 2009, 11:47 PM
hagbard hagbard is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brett.electrician View Post
I think ont is stupidly expensive regardless of what happens claim wise. Within a 1 year period I was insured in BC, then Ont, then SK. Same vehicle, no change in drivers record. BC was through SGI and CAA combo for $560 a year. My first Ont quote was $5000 for equal coverage. Got it down to $2200 after ditching collision, raising my deductable, and using the same company as the rest of my family. Moved to SK and SGI insured me for $1200 with equal coverage to that I had from ICBC. I have found that insurance of any kind seems to be more expensive in Ont then anywhere else, whereas most other goods and services are cheaper.
I'll back that up. Moved from Victoria to SW Ontario, our insurance more than doubled. Hey, I'm a libertarian but the socialist insurance of BC is way cheaper than the capitalist insurance of Ontario. Go figure? Maybe its the pathetically awful drivers in Ontario.
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  #7  
Old Posted: Jul 2, 2010, 11:00 AM
bogreg bogreg is offline
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I think it is somehow weird that car insurances are differently priced within one country. I actually cannot understand this system. For example the German car insurance system is one system and the insurance is not more expensive in the one state than in the other. If you have the same car in different states you will nevertheless pay the same for the same insurance. In my opinion the Canadian system needs a makeover.
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  #8  
Old Posted: Mar 14, 2011, 4:21 PM
chrish8 chrish8 is offline
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Let us get it right - Auto Insurance

stumbled across this post searching for something else and figured as an insurance broker in Ontario I would like to weigh in as the post is filled with misconceptions.

I often hear many false statements from clients regarding Ontario insurance the 2 most common statements are;

1. Ontario has the highest rates in Canada, Government run insurance is way cheaper look at BC.,
2. Insurance companies charge what they want when they want
3.

In order;

1. this is probably the second most false statement I hear. BC which is government run has the highest rates of insurance in the country since 2007 ( http://www.citytv.com/toronto/cityne...n-canada-study ) and this is still true today.

The entire statement is false because people are not comparing apples to apples and usually stated by people that have no knowledge of actually insurance costs coast to coast. It’s often someone that heard from a friend of a friend that has an uncle ….etc…. that was talking to a guy and they pay X$ for insurance.

Ontario automobile insurance is very high but you also have to consider Ontario has the richest insurance plan in the Country. There is no other province that offers the limits Ontario offers i.e. $1,000,000 worth of personal Accident benefits, coverage for caregiver support, death and funeral benefits, rehab and 3rd party liability also higher then any other province, income replacement if injured in a car accident.

In BC there is no coverage for personal accident benefits the coverage must be purchased separately
The coverage for 3rd liability is a maximum of $200,000 vs. the norm of $1,000,000 up to $5,000,000 in Ontario.
BC does not offer physical damage cover for the car itself this must be purchased by a 3rd as additional coverage and limits are set it must be purchased through a 3rd party
There is no cover for income replacement in the event you are unable to work due to a car accident.
In BC you must prove your injuries so things like whiplash and soreness is rarely covered in addition the limit is set on what they will pay out i.e a broken leg cost x, arm cost x,

2. This statement is 100% false and probably the one that bothers me the most just because a company suffers a financial loss they can not just take a rate increase to make up for it, it’s the cost of doing business. The companies get rates approved by going to the government and proving that in city X they insured X number of people and had X number of claims which resulted in a loss of X. Every single insurance company in Ontario MUST file their rate and any increases with the Government through the Financial Service Commission of Ontario (FSCO) and all of the rates are public knowledge and can be viewed on line at http://fsco.ca/english/insurance/auto/rates/default.asp .

The problem why we have such high rates is a direct reflection of what I mentioned in #1. If the companies are putting up so much cover of course they are paying out more in claims, and this is what affects the price of insurance. I.E the average claim in Ontario is approx $2,000, given that the average cost to insure 1 car in Ontario is $1300 there is a $700 short fall so the insurance companies will then need to use a portion of everyone’s insurance to make up the loss thus causing an increase. Having such high insurance limits becomes a real issue when you have lawyers involved that know how to get every cent (if not more) out of the system.

As an example from a recent settlement a young female was injured in an accident after the driver ran a stop sign and the court awarded $18.4 million to the family (policy only had 1 million cover), there is no way in the world the family will ever in 10 life times pay that much back to any insurance company. Even worse is that they were insured a small mutual company called Wawanesa that writes 1.9 million a year in premium (before claims) http://www.wawanesa.com/CN/EN/about-company.html , so it will take them approx 20 years to just break even from this 1 claim. The outcome is that as an insurance pool each and everyone of us will suffer rate increases to pickup a downfall like this.

As I stated above Ontario does have very high but we have to compare cover to cover and when you have claims as above occurring more frequently take it makes it very tough for the industry to reduce the cost of insurance. Over the past few years insurance companies have been trying to get laws pass that will allow them to reduce coverage making it more in line with the rest of the country but special interest groups have been defeating every bill submitted.
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  #9  
Old Posted: Apr 24, 2011, 2:07 AM
Umbra Umbra is offline
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Thank Goodness I'm from Manitoba.

I'm 19, got into 3 accidents in 3 years, I own a car and have my full 5F class license (Eq to G2) and I pay $90 a month in insurance, and $65 a year.

Our insurance company (Manitoba Public Insurance; MPI for short) is some-what government integrated and covers all Manitoba citizens.

Third-liability insurance up to $3,000,000.00 is only an extra $1 monthly. My roommate has a bad-driving records and financed his first vehicle brand-new and pays $570.00 insurance monthly.


I personally think that the Ontario Government should re-form and govern Ontario Insurance companies and maybe merge into one company just like Manitoba.

Extra house coverage, health, travel insurance is provided by MPI and/or can be bought through another third-party company. That is what private insurance companies should only govern, nothing else.


FYI, my opinion is third-party considering I'm outside residency and will NEVER consider registering my vehicle to Ontario Insurance companies. I feel sorry for ALL Ontario drivers, I honestly do!
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  #10  
Old Posted: Jun 14, 2011, 2:36 PM
Cinoche Cinoche is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bogreg View Post
I think it is somehow weird that car insurances are differently priced within one country. I actually cannot understand this system. For example the German car insurance system is one system and the insurance is not more expensive in the one state than in the other. If you have the same car in different states you will nevertheless pay the same for the same insurance. In my opinion the Canadian system needs a makeover.
Wow, your German insurance reference is quite inspiring. Indeed, I think we need another reform here in Ontario.
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  #11  
Old Posted: Dec 7, 2011, 2:16 PM
Duckyboy Duckyboy is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 133
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrish8 View Post
stumbled across this post searching for something else and figured as an insurance broker in Ontario I would like to weigh in as the post is filled with misconceptions.

I often hear many false statements from clients regarding Ontario insurance the 2 most common statements are;

1. Ontario has the highest rates in Canada, Government run insurance is way cheaper look at BC.,
2. Insurance companies charge what they want when they want
3.

In order;

1. this is probably the second most false statement I hear. BC which is government run has the highest rates of insurance in the country since 2007 ( http://www.citytv.com/toronto/cityne...n-canada-study ) and this is still true today.

The entire statement is false because people are not comparing apples to apples and usually stated by people that have no knowledge of actually insurance costs coast to coast. It’s often someone that heard from a friend of a friend that has an uncle ….etc…. that was talking to a guy and they pay X$ for insurance.

Ontario automobile insurance is very high but you also have to consider Ontario has the richest insurance plan in the Country. There is no other province that offers the limits Ontario offers i.e. $1,000,000 worth of personal Accident benefits, coverage for caregiver support, death and funeral benefits, rehab and 3rd party liability also higher then any other province, income replacement if injured in a car accident.

In BC there is no coverage for personal accident benefits the coverage must be purchased separately
The coverage for 3rd liability is a maximum of $200,000 vs. the norm of $1,000,000 up to $5,000,000 in Ontario.
BC does not offer physical damage cover for the car itself this must be purchased by a 3rd as additional coverage and limits are set it must be purchased through a 3rd party
There is no cover for income replacement in the event you are unable to work due to a car accident.
In BC you must prove your injuries so things like whiplash and soreness is rarely covered in addition the limit is set on what they will pay out i.e a broken leg cost x, arm cost x,

2. This statement is 100% false and probably the one that bothers me the most just because a company suffers a financial loss they can not just take a rate increase to make up for it, it’s the cost of doing business. The companies get rates approved by going to the government and proving that in city X they insured X number of people and had X number of claims which resulted in a loss of X. Every single insurance company in Ontario MUST file their rate and any increases with the Government through the Financial Service Commission of Ontario (FSCO) and all of the rates are public knowledge and can be viewed on line at http://fsco.ca/english/insurance/auto/rates/default.asp .

The problem why we have such high rates is a direct reflection of what I mentioned in #1. If the companies are putting up so much cover of course they are paying out more in claims, and this is what affects the price of insurance. I.E the average claim in Ontario is approx $2,000, given that the average cost to insure 1 car in Ontario is $1300 there is a $700 short fall so the insurance companies will then need to use a portion of everyone’s insurance to make up the loss thus causing an increase. Having such high insurance limits becomes a real issue when you have lawyers involved that know how to get every cent (if not more) out of the system.

As an example from a recent settlement a young female was injured in an accident after the driver ran a stop sign and the court awarded $18.4 million to the family (policy only had 1 million cover), there is no way in the world the family will ever in 10 life times pay that much back to any insurance company. Even worse is that they were insured a small mutual company called Wawanesa that writes 1.9 million a year in premium (before claims) http://www.wawanesa.com/CN/EN/about-company.html , so it will take them approx 20 years to just break even from this 1 claim. The outcome is that as an insurance pool each and everyone of us will suffer rate increases to pickup a downfall like this.

As I stated above Ontario does have very high but we have to compare cover to cover and when you have claims as above occurring more frequently take it makes it very tough for the industry to reduce the cost of insurance. Over the past few years insurance companies have been trying to get laws pass that will allow them to reduce coverage making it more in line with the rest of the country but special interest groups have been defeating every bill submitted.
Can you please elaborate on which "special interest" groups are keeping us from having cheaper insurance?

thanks for your time.
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