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  #261  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2010, 11:54 PM
Spoolmak Spoolmak is offline
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^ Why so ghetto
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  #262  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 12:19 AM
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^ Why so ghetto
So it fits in
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  #263  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 1:07 AM
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So it fits in
good one
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  #264  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 1:35 AM
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Originally Posted by MonctonRad View Post
Interesting JayM. Thanks for the link.

To put it in tabular form here.........

1 - Edmonton (Commonwealth Stadium)........62,531
2 - Vancouver (BC Place Stadium)...............59,841
3 - Toronto (Rogers Centre).......................53,506
4 - Calgary (McMahon Stadium)..................35,560
5 - Hamilton (Ivor Wynne Stadium)..............30,000
6 - Winnipeg (Canad Inns Stadium)..............29,503
7 - Regina (Mosaic Stadium).......................28,800
8 - Ottawa (Frank Clair Stadium).................26,559
9 - Moncton (Stade Moncton Stadium).........20,641 (configured for the Touchdown Atlantic game)
10 - Montreal (Percival Molson Stadium)........20,202

So, while the Moncton stadium remains smallish, it is not that far off the target for a lot of the other CFL stadiums. Only Edmonton, Vancouver, Toronto and Calgary are significantly bigger!

I think the Moncton stadium could be expanded to about 30,000 without too much modification.
It's so weird seeing Moncton in that top 10 list, but I'm glad the Maritimes finally has a significant stadium. A few points:

- Frank Clair been partially demolished and isn't at 26,559 any more
- Mosaic has 'temporary' stands erected all season and really has capacity of 30,945
- Molson will be at 25,000 for next season
- BMO Field will get a boost from 20,000 which should put it in the top 10 stadia, but it's not a football stadium
- Empire Stadium in Vancouver being refitted with 27,500 temporary seats for whole season while BC Place undergoes renovations

By the end of the year, the top 10 will look like this:

01 - Edmonton (Commonwealth Stadium)........62,531
02 - Vancouver (BC Place Stadium)...............59,841
03 - Toronto (Rogers Centre).......................53,506
04 - Calgary (McMahon Stadium)..................35,560
05 - Regina (Mosaic Stadium).......................30,945
06 - Hamilton (Ivor Wynne Stadium)..............30,000
07 - Winnipeg (Canad Inns Stadium)..............29,503
08 - Vancouver (Empire Stadium)..................27,500
09 - Montreal (Percival Molson Stadium)........25,000
10 - Moncton (Stade Moncton Stadium).........20,641 (configured for the Touchdown Atlantic game)
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  #265  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 1:43 AM
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^Has it been confirmed that the Argo's are playing at BMO Field?
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  #266  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 1:48 AM
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Shouldn't the big O be on the list?
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  #267  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 1:52 AM
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^^ You're right! Awww, so much for Moncton being in the top 10!

CURRENTLY
01 - Montréal (Stade Olympique)..................66,308
02 - Edmonton (Commonwealth Stadium).......62,531
03 - Vancouver (BC Place Stadium)...............59,841
04 - Toronto (Rogers Centre).......................53,506
05 - Calgary (McMahon Stadium)..................35,560
06 - Regina (Mosaic Stadium)......................30,945
07 - Hamilton (Ivor Wynne Stadium)..............30,000
08 - Winnipeg (Canad Inns Stadium)..............29,503
09 - Moncton (Stade Moncton Stadium).........20,641 (configured for the Touchdown Atlantic game)
10 - Montreal (Percival Molson Stadium)........20,202

NEXT YEAR
01 - Montréal (Stade Olympique)..................66,308
02 - Edmonton (Commonwealth Stadium).......62,531
03 - Vancouver (BC Place Stadium)...............59,841
04 - Toronto (Rogers Centre).......................53,506
05 - Calgary (McMahon Stadium)..................35,560
06 - Regina (Mosaic Stadium)......................30,945
07 - Hamilton (Ivor Wynne Stadium)..............30,000
08 - Winnipeg (Canad Inns Stadium)..............29,503
09 - Vancouver (Empire Stadium)..................27,500
10 - Montréal (Molson Stadium).....................25,000

11 - Moncton (Stade Moncton Stadium).........20,641 (configured for the Touchdown Atlantic game)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Distill3d View Post
^Has it been confirmed that the Argo's are playing at BMO Field?
Nope. There were discussions about it, but I don't think soccer was keen on the idea. Even with the expansion, BMO is a little small capacity wise, and I'm not sure if a football field would fit inside BMO the way it is configured presently. The width is fine, but the length of a football field is a problem.
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Last edited by isaidso; Apr 9, 2010 at 2:03 AM.
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  #268  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 2:15 AM
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Both Rochester and Albany have metro populations over 1 million, Duluth has a strong football heritage and no team. I don't think either of the 3 would harm the league all that much. I'm not saying that they're blockbuster or blue chip markets in the States like a Detroit or Boston or Chicago. I'm just saying that in my opinion these 3 cities could support a CFL team given the opportunity. I think the only reason most would write them off from being included in the CFL is because they're American cities.

Of course, Canada's game needs to be developed in Canada first. Hence the 20 year plan to expand to Kelowna, Saskatoon, Moncton, Windsor, Quebec, and Halifax first. Then we can start developing the game in American markets.

None of the 5 chosen markets currently play host city to an NFL team, nor would it seem are any on the NFL expansion or relocation radar at the moment (well, maybe Portland...). It would only seem fitting to include them on our radar.
My snarky comments weren't necessarily directed at you, but at a certain "mentality". Sorry if you thought they were attacking you.
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  #269  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 3:09 AM
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Shouldn't the big O be on the list?
I knew about the "Big Owe", but since it isn't normally a CFL stadium (except for the Grey Cup), I left it off the list.
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  #270  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 2:34 PM
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^Has it been confirmed that the Argo's are playing at BMO Field?
I think I had posted that awhile back that Argos were interested but as the field is currently configured for soccer with no room for improvement the Argos realized that it was a dead deal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MonctonRad View Post
I knew about the "Big Owe", but since it isn't normally a CFL stadium (except for the Grey Cup), I left it off the list.
Yeah Olympic Stadium is only used for playoff which doesn't count for regular season games. It's also important to note though it still should be on the list for reference purposes.
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  #271  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 3:20 PM
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Yeah Olympic Stadium is only used for playoff which doesn't count for regular season games. It's also important to note though it still should be on the list for reference purposes.
Sometimes it's used for the last game of the season too.
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  #272  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 4:04 PM
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Sometimes it's used for the last game of the season too.
I was going to mention that but I think almost everyone was aware of that.
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  #273  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2010, 10:20 PM
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Sometimes it's used for the last game of the season too.
Went to an Als game at the big O 3 or 4 years ago and we lost something like 40-20 to the Argos.
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  #274  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 1:53 PM
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Lansdowne debate resumes in earnest

Foes fear growing city debt; friends call stadium world-class

By Maria Cook, The Ottawa CitizenApril 9, 2010



As deadlines approach for a decision on renewing Lansdowne Park, the debate about the way forward resumed in earnest at City Hall on Thursday.

Ian Lee, director of the MBA program at Carleton University's Sprott business school, said it was a bad deal for taxpayers to spend $129 million to renovate Frank Clair Stadium, particularly since the city would be borrowing in the face of a debt crisis and rising interest rates.

"We're providing the land and the capital, and I don't see what we're getting back," Lee said during a press conference held by Capital Ward Councillor Clive Doucet. "The people who are benefitting are the owners of the sports teams."

Kevin McCrann, spokesman for the Ottawa Sports and Entertainment Group, said the developers would spend $30 million to bring a Canadian Football League team to Ottawa.

"We're building the retail component and parking, and we're contributing to the front lawn," McCrann said. "We're also inheriting the losses of operating the stadium for years to come.

"There are very few stadiums that are privately built. This is Ottawa's world-class open-air stadium. It will host Carleton University football games, soccer games, concerts. It's a public facility. We think it's a fair proposal."

City council's final vote to approve the Lansdowne Partnership Plan is scheduled to take place in June. The results of a design competition for the public space will be unveiled May 13. A transportation study is also under way.

Lee said most stadiums built in the United States in recent years have had large amounts of private money behind them.

For example, at University of Phoenix stadium in Glendale, Arizona, which opened in 2006, the public contributed $344 million and the private sector $104 million.

At Lincoln Financial Field in Philadelphia, which opened in 2003, the public cost was $202 million, while the private sum was $310 million.

"The message is that it can't be built unless the public sector builds it," Lee said. "That's not true."

The city plans to borrow $116.9 million at 5.35 per cent interest over 40 years, with a repayment of $283.9 million. The city's current debt is about $550 million.

"Every government is moving forward into an economic environment where interest rates are going to go up dramatically," Lee said. "Is it prudent to borrow like there's no tomorrow?"

Also at the press conference was "concerned taxpayer" Jean-Marie Leduc of Ottawa. He recently returned from the Vancouver Olympics, where he displayed his collection of vintage skates.

While in British Columbia, he visited Fort St. John, population 19,000. It recently built a sportsplex featuring two NHL sized ice rinks, an Olympic-sized speed skating oval, a figure skating facility, 12 dressing rooms, a 400-metre running track, meeting rooms and more.

It cost $41 million, with local taxpayers paying $15 million and the province contributing $26 million. In addition, the federal government has given $5 million for the parking lot.

"It's gorgeous," Leduc said. "I think we can do much better (than Lansdowne Live.)"

Doucet said Lansdowne was not eligible for provincial or federal funding because it was a sole-source project.
© Copyright (c) The Ottawa Citizen
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  #275  
Old Posted Apr 10, 2010, 2:01 PM
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GCA calls Lansdowne Park "an endangered place"

By mariacook Tue, Mar 30 2010 COMMENTS(46) Designing Ottawa

Filed under: public space, Lansdowne Live, Lansdowne Park, Glebe, Ottawa Sports and Entertainment Group, heritage, Lansdowne Partnership Plan, OSEG, parks, urban planning

From a press release today:

The Glebe Community Association has asked to have Lansdowne Park listed as an "endangered place" by the Heritage Canada Foundation. HCF evaluates selected sites based on the significance of the site, the urgency of the threat, and community support for its preservation. The GCA says Lansdowne Park scores high on all three factors.

"The current plan to turn nearly 25% of Lansdowne Park into commercial development is inappropriate and inconsistent with its nearly 150-year history as a public space," said Joan Bard Miller, chair of the association's Heritage Committee. "The Park is historically associated with sports, recreation and exhibitions but may soon be associated with large-scale retail."

The Heritage Canada Foundation will release their 2010 Top Ten Endangered Places List in May.

***

NOMINATION FOR HERITAGE CANADA FOUNDATION'S MOST

ENDANGERED PLACES LIST

Type of Site (residential, civic, commercial, engineering work, cultural landscape, etc.):

Lansdowne Park is a municipally owned public space located next to the Rideau Canal World Heritage Site in the heart of the Nation's Capital. Since 1868, the site has been host to agricultural exhibitions, sporting events and military troops. The site contains two designated heritage buildings, an aging football stadium with a connected arena and large parking lots.

The Aberdeen Pavilion National Historic Site is a prominent feature on the site and within the neighbourhood.

Heritage Status (designation, zoning, protective covenants, easements):

Although the entire site has not been designated as a cultural heritage landscape, arguably it would qualify under regulation 9/06 of the Ontario Heritage Act.

The site contains two designated heritage buildings, one of which is protected by easements with the Ontario Heritage Trust (OHT).

The Horticulture Building (1914) was designated in 1994 under Part IV of the Ontario Heritage Act, and is on the national register of historic buildings. It exhibits an outstanding example of the Prairie Style of architecture, which is rare in Canada. Despite its heritage status, the City of Ottawa is considering moving this masonry building, which is over 200 feet in length, from its present location adjacent to the main entry of the Aberdeen Pavilion National Historic Site to the rear of the Pavilion.

These intentions fail to recognize that one of the building's character defining elements is its proximity to the Pavilion.

The justification for moving the building is to make additional space available for retail development on public land.

The Aberdeen Pavilion (1898) was designated in 1982 under the Ontario Heritage Act and in 1983 as a National Historic Site by the Historic Sites and Monuments Board of Canada.

The Aberdeen Pavilion also has two Ontario Heritage Trust easements. The first easement extends from Bank Street to the building, and includes a buffer zone around the structure where approvals are required for design and location.

The second easement deals with protecting three sightlines from Queen Elizabeth Driveway to the building, which means that any new structures placed in this area must meet Ontario Heritage Trust Approvals.

Owner:

The City of Ottawa has owned the site from 1868 to the present. The National Capital Commission owns adjacent land between Lansdowne Park and the Rideau Canal World Heritage Site. Public ownership is threatened by a private/public partnership that would lead to retail and residential development on the site.

What was the original use of the site?

The site was originally used in 1868 as a showground for the Ottawa Agricultural Society. Beginning in 1875 the site was used for Provincial exhibitions. The Central Canada Exhibition was hosted on the site for the first time in 1888, a tradition that has continued for over 120 years.

The grounds were also used for training troops entering both the First and Second World Wars.

Throughout the 20th century Lansdowne Park has hosted Stanley Cup Championships and Grey Cup Games. Recreational activities, including curling in the Horticulture Building, have also been part of the site's heritage.

What is the current use of the site?

Use of the site evolved in the latter 20th century to include trade shows and concerts.

An OHL hockey team, the Ottawa 67s, has utilized the Civic Centre since their inception in 1967.

Recreational soccer games are played in a dome on the stadium field in the winter.

The Central Canada Exhibition continues to run at Lansdowne Park for two weeks every August. The site is also home to a local Farmer's Market, a tribute to the site's agricultural tradition.

What is the current condition of the site?

The Aberdeen Pavilion was restored in the mid 1990s and remains in excellent condition.

It is, however, surrounded by an asphalt parking lot and structures in need of repair. The municipally designated Horticulture Building has been closed to the public for several years and is currently used for storage.

The windows are boarded up and the building is not well maintained.

Frank Clair Stadium (1966) and the attached Civic Centre Arena are in need of repair. The lower portion of the stadium's south side stands was deemed unsafe and demolished in 2009.

What is the threat(s) that is endangering the site?

The main threat is the loss of public space to private retail and residential development with the transfer of a large portion of the site from the City of Ottawa to a consortium of private developers.

The developers want to build 300,000 square feet of commercial retail on the site: large‐scale stores that will hold no relationship to the long‐term historical, cultural, or aesthetic nature of the site.

This type of development next to two designated buildings will obscure their heritage attributes as they compete with storefront signage and advertising.

A site of this significance not only should remain in public hands, it should be designed as a world‐class civic space for residents and visitors to enjoy for generations.

The City is also threatening its own heritage designation of the Horticulture Building, a masonry building that is approximately 200 feet in length, by entertaining options to relocate it within Lansdowne Park.

This option is being considered regardless of the fact that one of the building's character‐defining elements is its physical relationship to the adjacent Aberdeen Pavilion.

A heritage report prepared jointly for the City and private developers indicated that several exhibition buildings were relocated within the site over its nearly 150‐year history and therefore justified the option to relocate.

It does not, however, include that the previous buildings were more conducive to being moved and were not designated structures.

What actions have been taken to protect the site? (Describe any actions taken to alleviate the threat(s) described above and indicate if these actions were taken by governments, local groups or individuals).

Many private citizens, local community organizations and politicians have spoken out against the transfer of public space to private interests and the proposal of large‐scale retail and residential

development.

These organizations and individuals have vociferously campaigned the city to consider ideas from more than one developer and to reject the shopping mall concept that threatens to diminish the cultural landscape.

The City has hired a respected urban design consultant to oversee a design competition for green space that will occupy approximately one fifth of the site. Redesign for the majority of the site, including the football stadium and commercial/residential components, are under the control of private developers.

Please summarize why this site should be considered for inclusion on HCF's Top Ten Endangered Places List. The summary should address the three criteria listed above. Please indicate if the site has any formal designations.

The current process to turn nearly 25% of Lansdowne Park into commercial development is inappropriate and inconsistent with its nearly 150‐year history as a public space. The Park is historically associated with sports, recreation and exhibitions but may soon be associated with large‐scale retail.

The grounds and the buildings, including the municipally designated Horticulture Building, have been under utilized while maintenance to the sports facilities has been under funded. The City threatens its own heritage designation by entertaining options to relocate a masonry building that is approximately 200 feet in length. Rather than finding a lucrative adaptive reuse, the City is considering something that is arguably logistically and financially impossible.

Initial threats to the fabric of the Aberdeen Pavilion National Historic Site have been mitigated but plans for the building remain unclear. City‐wide concerns about the proposed development from private citizens, community organizations and local politicians have led to additional reports and studies but they have not led to a fundamental change to what is being promised for the site — large‐scale retail.

Lansdowne Park's history and proximity to the Rideau Canal World Heritage Site in the heart of the Nation's capital should be worthy of continued use as a public space of world‐class caliber not endangerment.

City council will decide the future of Lansdowne Park in June 2010.
source
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  #276  
Old Posted Apr 14, 2010, 1:33 AM
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The Ottawa situation seems to be dragging on forever. I'll be astonished if that city manages to make any significant progress by this time next year.
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  #277  
Old Posted Apr 14, 2010, 9:40 AM
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At this rate both Surrey BC and Rochester NY will have CFL teams before Ottawa.
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  #278  
Old Posted Apr 14, 2010, 6:03 PM
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Even if Ottawa can approve a simple design to encase the southern part of the stadium in a U-Shape design this would be sufficient.

Civic Centre also the Northstand was issued that only the 30 first rows would be seated and nothing past that for fear of stability.

My Proposal to get a Stadium Built.
PHASE I - Demolish the rest of South.
PHASE II(a) - Build U-Shape seating East-South-West.
PHASE II(b) - Add Grand Stand on South subject to capacity or approval.
PHASE III(a) - Demolish Civic Centre and relocate on Lansdowne.
PHASE III(b) - Build Northside to match Southside design.
PHASE IV - Green Space, Parks, Historic Buildings and Parking.
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  #279  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2010, 5:53 PM
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CFL of Interest

Overtime rule changes get final approval
< Return to Article


April 14, 2010

OVERTIME RULE CHANGES GET FINAL APPROVAL
Board of Governors approves two-point converts proposed by rules committee and fans

TORONTO, Ont. -- This year, a thrilling touchdown in overtime might just be the prelude to even bigger drama.

The Canadian Football League’s Board of Governors has approved a rule change that will see teams that score a touchdown in overtime be required to go for a two-point convert by running or passing the ball into the end zone instead of kicking for a single point.

The proposal was brought forward by the league’s Rules Committee last March, after the change was among those suggested for overtime by fans from across Canada.

“It’s now official,” said Tom Higgins, the CFL’s Director of Officiating.

“The Governors have agreed with our committee, and our fans, that the two point convert will make an exciting approach to overtime even more exciting, with a pass or run with the game potentially on the line replacing a kick that has become relatively routine.”

In 2009, CFL Commissioner Mark Cohon took the unprecedented step of asking fans for their input on proposed rules changes, a step that led to a change in field position following a safety.

This year, Cohon issued the call to fans on behalf of the league again, but this time he asked them to pay particular attention to whether the league’s overtime format could be improved.

Fans sent in more than 2,000 rules suggestions, with about 1,500 of them focused on overtime.

The vast majority said they preferred keeping the league’s overtime format, which has teams take turns scrimmaging from their opponent’s 35-yard-line, instead of changing to a different format, such as two five-minute halves or some other sort of “mini-game”. But many suggested various tweaks to the format.

In the end, the rules committee agreed the format should not be changed and decided that the best “tweak” is requiring two-point converts in overtime.

Under the current rules, if the score is tied at the end of a game, each team gets an opportunity to scrimmage from its opponent’s 35-yard-line, until it makes a score or loses possession.

If the score remains tied, the procedure is repeated at the opposite end of the stadium.

If the score is still tied after each team has had two attempts, the game is declared a tie during the regular season. If the game is a playoff or championship game, the same procedure continues until a winner is decided.

The Board also approved three other rules committee recommendations that:

* Will allow a team that gives up a field goal (during regulation time) the option of scrimmaging from its 35-yard line instead of receiving a kick-off.
* Will ensure there is no penalty for pass interference applied if a forward pass is deemed uncatchable.
* Will, when a ball is punted, hits the ground and hits a player from the covering team, result in a penalty of five instead of fifteen yards.

John Butler, Chair of the CFL Board of Governors, thanked the rules committee for its work.

“And on behalf of the Board, and Commissioner Mark Cohon, I want to thank our fans for their input,” Butler added.

“It’s another sign of their tremendous passion for our game and our league, and that passion is one of the things that make the CFL so special.”
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  #280  
Old Posted Apr 15, 2010, 6:05 PM
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