Pedestrian experience in Calgary

[Calgarian]

Originally Posted by mwalker_mw

I think we need to push a bit more toward equal responsibility - there are certainly places where 100% pedestrian priority is warranted and effective (marked crosswalks, parking lots, signed ped crossings w/ lights) but there are also places where the responsibility needs to be clearly shared (both in use and in the case of an accident) such as all corner "unofficial" crosswalks and ped crossings with only paint markings. The burden of responsibility cannot be placed entirely on the driver with pedestrians who walk out without so much as a glance, often from behind telephone poles, signs, other traffic, vehicle pillars, etc. Doubly so for cyclist illegally using crosswalks - they approach at too high a speed for drivers to monitor. The final part of this are pedestrians who jay-walk where there is clear vehicular priority. I'm not going to advocate making them fair game for a hood ornament (though a little part of me would like to see that) but there needs to be much stricter enforcement to discourage this - specifically when their actions impact traffic. Now, I actually do support jay-walking provided it is done under the assumption that the pedestrian assumes all risk in the matter and does not impede traffic and I do not believe jay-walking tickets should be handed out if the pedestrian takes due care. Cross where you like - but make damn sure there isn't any oncoming traffic.

agreed 100%

[frinkprof]

^You're up over 10 000 posts Calgarian, in case you haven't noticed.

As for the topic, I don't find drivers that bad. For me it is more an issue of infrastructure and urban design that factors into experience as a pedestrian. As for reducing the conflict between myself (as a pedestrian), and other modes of transport, my first concern is looking out for myself. If I don't do things like looking both ways, making eye contact, etc. I am only asking for trouble.

[93JC]

Originally Posted by mwalker_mw

I would argue that Calgary, due to drivers generally being so accommodating to pedestrians, actually has the opposite problem. I have frequently observed some pedestrians crossing mid block as if they owned the place. This wasn't a quick scamper across, this was a slow stroll causing traffic to slow down on a major downtown road during morning rush (Most recently 5th, but I've seen other places).

I was driving through Marda Loop yesterday and turned right from northbound 20th St onto eastbound 33rd Ave, when out of nowhere the two cars in front of me stopped. I exclaimed, "What the hell are you doing?!"

They stopped mid-block to let two 'cougars', shopping bags in hand, cross the street. They only had to walk another fifty feet to the marked crosswalk.

[Calgarian]

Originally Posted by frinkprof

^You're up over 10 000 posts Calgarian, in case you haven't noticed.

holy crap, I knew I was getting close but didn't realize I passed it. I should get back to work! lol

As for the topic, I don't find drivers that bad. For me it is more an issue of infrastructure and urban design that factors into experience as a pedestrian. As for reducing the conflict between myself (as a pedestrian), and other modes of transport, my first concern is looking out for myself. If I don't do things like looking both ways, making eye contact, etc. I am only asking for trouble.

I agree about the infrastructure and design. My complaint about Union Square is a good example where the pedestrian realm is overlooked in favour of vechicle traffic, in a pedestrian area.

[Wooster]

Originally Posted by Calgarian

holy crap, I knew I was getting close but didn't realize I passed it. I should get back to work! lol

10,000 posts! ha ha. you have no life!

...oh, wait.

[kw5150]

I walk to work everyday, but........

1. I agree that pedestrians should try harder to let vehicles through during rush hour. In the small town I was from it was common to do a short jog to move out of the way. People REALLY REALLY seem to slower saunter across streets here and it drives me crazy. It only creates more anger in this nice city of ours. Even if it is those crazy drivers heading out to the burbs, we have to be more courteous.

2. I agree with making eye contact with drivers turning right!! Very important. (I have almost ran over a pedestrian that way as well)

3. Again, I walk to work everyday.....

4. On 9th ave SW, the exit ramp to bankers court has an abnoxious, very very loud buzzer that goes off when a vehicle is exiting. It needs to be swapped out for something else. It actually scares people...lol

[freeweed]

Originally Posted by kw5150

On 9th ave SW, the exit ramp to bankers court has an abnoxious, very very loud buzzer that goes off when a vehicle is exiting. It needs to be swapped out for something else. It actually scares people...lol

There are many of these in the downtown lately, some worse than others. Seems to be some new fad over safety or something. I agree, they can be needlessly loud but I guess they need to make sure I hear them over my iPod.

[Riise]

I definitely have to agree with Rusty, drivers in Calgary are very respectful of pedestrian's right of way. While I do like the ability to jaywalk freely around London, I'm very wary when I'm crossing the road at non-signalized intersections. Unlike back home I have no clue who has the right of way, car or pedestrians, and cars seem to act like they have the priority. In Calgary, you can feel very confident when crossing the street and that's great! Unfortunately, that can almost get travelling Calgarians killed as we get so use to just walking out on the road and expecting cars to stop for us.

[jeffwhit]

I totally agree about equal responsibility as well. The scrambles in Eau Clare I don't feel are explained well enough by the signage in place. Cars turning right on red is a problem, but so are pedestrians unaware that they have to wait two lights to go.

Again, I think the benefits of these types of intersections are twofold. Pedestrian safety, and traffic flow are both improved drastically, particularly at high-volume intersections.

[Ramsayfarian]

Originally Posted by 93JC

I was driving through Marda Loop yesterday and turned right from northbound 20th St onto eastbound 33rd Ave, when out of nowhere the two cars in front of me stopped. I exclaimed, "What the hell are you doing?!"

They stopped mid-block to let two 'cougars', shopping bags in hand, cross the street. They only had to walk another fifty feet to the marked crosswalk.

I don't understand why people stop jaywalkers. If they're halfway across the street sure, but when they're standing on the side of the road, they can wait or head to an intersection.

Being a none parent, I'm constantly dumbfounded when I see parents jaywalking with their small children. The fines for that should be huge.

[Wooster]

I have no problem with mid-block jaywalking as long as those pedestrians don't interfere with automobile/cyclist traffic as it moves through. Jaywalking is a part of city-life, it's how people naturally move throughout urban environments.

As Christopher Hume puts it:

We are all jaywalkers. We have no choice; to negotiate the city on foot requires endless street crossing without benefit of traffic light, crosswalk or corner.

[niwell]

Regarding the jaywalking situation described above this is a problem with both drivers and pedestrians in Calgary. There is absolutely nothing wrong with crossing mid-block, and in Ontario at least it's completely legal. Not sure on Alberta traffic laws, but based on the people I knew growing up getting tickets for jaywalking I'm assuming it's illegal. The problem is people who cross impeding traffic, and in turn the cars who come to a complete halt at the first sign of someone attempting to jaywalk.

In my neighbourhood jaywalking is commonplace and I do it at least a few times a day. But... pretty much everyone waits for gaps in traffic, even if this means waiting on the yellow line. And cars don't come to a stop if they see someone hovering just off the curb waiting for a gap. If you just walk into traffic people will stop (they're paying attention) but probably honk at you. I think it's a good balance that would be good for central areas of Calgary.

[bigcanuck]

I was in New York several years ago and a buddy of mine from Staten Island said that a few years prior, the city tried to crack-down on mid-block jaywalkers. However, the effort was short-lived as the crack-down actually impacted vehicle traffic flow too much at intersections (where the pedestrians were now forced to cross).

[Calgarian]

CPS was doing a crackdown on jay-walking a couple weeks ago, it's definitely illegal. I jay-walk all the time, even if I'm at a corner and I have a do not walk light, if there is no one coming, why should I wait.

[kw5150]

Originally Posted by Calgarian

CPS was doing a crackdown on jay-walking a couple weeks ago, it's definitely illegal. I jay-walk all the time, even if I'm at a corner and I have a do not walk light, if there is no one coming, why should I wait.

Totally agree. I am responsible for my own life. I SOMETIMES jaywalk. I figure if I do it 25% of the time it reduces the chance of getting caught. In Winnipeg you can jaywalk wherever you want even though it is illegal. No one cares. Just dont get in the way of a car or bike!!

When I moved back to alberta after being in Winnipeg for 5 years I felt like a little child who was not allowed to cross the road anymore!

[Danma]

Every Calgarian should spend a week in NYC. They might appreciate how nice drivers are in Calgary by comparison. I remember being in a cabbie who, upon coming across a pedestrian, sped up and honked his horn incessantly. The pedestrian scrambled...

[KingBrisketBoy]

Originally Posted by gammell

I found Saskatoon more accommodating but its comparable. I much prefer walking around here to the larger, more pedestrian-heavy cities I've been to like Paris, Seoul or NYC. I eventually adjusted to the aggressive interaction between pedestrians and drivers there, but I never liked it.

after living in vancouver for the last year it was extremely refreshing to come back to calgary for a visit where it didn't feel like I was going to be run over every time I crossed the road.

overall I find calgary to be a very pedestrian friendly city, but yet again I love to walk and experience the urban landscape on foot wherever I am, so im a little biased.

[freeweed]

Originally Posted by kw5150

Totally agree. I am responsible for my own life. I SOMETIMES jaywalk.

Unfortunately this is far from the truth. First, because we have a medical system that everyone else also pays for.

Second, and this is much more subtle, but pedestrians are almost never at fault when hit by a vehicle. If you run in front of me and there's no way I can stop, odds are I'll still be held responsible. Best case is it affects my insurance, worst case I'm facing vehicular manslaughter charges because you couldn't walk to the nearest intersection. There's also the situation where I have to slam on my brakes and/or swerve to avoid you, thereby causing an accident behind/beside me, all to save your selfish ass.

Jaywalking laws aren't really there to protect you. They're there in large part to protect the rest of us from your mistakes. Much like helmet and seatbelt laws, for that matter.

That being said, I jaywalk when there's no traffic as well. I don't think CPS is that bored that they'll ticket me for it when the next car is 2km down the road. But there's a whole range between "no car for 5 mins" and "I can make it if I run as fast as I can", and I wish that people who do the latter would get ticketed, every time. Downtown Calgary is full of retards who insist on running in front of moving traffic and I'm sorry, but you deserve a ticket for doing this. Regardless of whether or not you think it's "safe for you".

[frinkprof]

Originally Posted by freeweed

I don't think CPS is that bored that they'll ticket me for it when the next car is 2km down the road.

While I agree with your post, this part reminds me of an anecdote.

To illustrate, this is the intersecion of Queensland Drive/Deer Ridge Drive (it changes names at the intersection) and Canyon Meadows Drive.



During the north/south movement phase of the traffic signal, the northbound lanes get an advanced green, whereby the lane marked green is a left hand turn only lane (to go westbound on Canyon Meadows Drive), and the orange is straight through northbound only. All other lanes, marked red, are facing red lights. Most importantly, this means the southbound lane of Queensland Drive can't turn left to go eastbound on Canyon Meadows Drive.

Now, although no cars can cross the crosswalk marked by yellow during the advanced green phase, the signal is set up to show "Don't Walk" during the advanced green. The crosswalk marked by black also sees "Don't Walk," which does make sense. Anyone who regularly walks in the area ignores this and walks anyway when using the yellow crosswalk, since, like I said before, there is no way a vehicle can (in a legal sense) or will cross that crosswalk during the advanced green. I've done so myself hundreds of times. It's just a signal design oversight.

One time though, my roommate and his friend was crossing at that intersection, against the "Don't Walk" signal in the manner I described above, when the cops stop him shortly after he had crossed. After trying to explain the situation to the cops, they still got tickets. Now, of course they were technically crossing illegally (J-walking), but quite obviously weren't really doing anything wrong.

Anyway, it's not the most exciting story, but it's little things like this that irk me when it comes to the "pedestrian experience."

[freeweed]

Oh absolutely. There are plenty of stupid pedestrian situations just like there are plenty of stupid car situations like that (construction speed when there's no construction for miles around; ie: Stoney Trail for the past couple of years, or times when a light sensor refuses to change and you either sit there for an hour or run a red light).

Thing is, we either go "zero tolerance" on this stuff, which is lunacy, or we turn everything into a judgment call, which inevitably ends up with people doing some pretty dangerous things. Common sense being very uncommon and all. It's annoying because there's no real answer.

Personally, I just try to follow the rules and avoid hassle in life. It's not worth the annoyance of having to argue a ticket just because I wanted to shave 30 seconds off my day.