LOS ANGELES | Downtown Project Rundown 4.0

[Pink Floyd]

And she can't get elected. From what I hear, only Glendale city council members can be mayor...

[alki]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

Well actually, that part of LA in the immediate foreground of that photo was not part of DTLA back then. What is now considered "downtown" has massively grown over the decades. Changes in zoning have altered the character of what were once single-family residential neighborhoods and industrial areas around the old historic core of Los Angeles. In fact, I read an article recently (from KPCC, maybe?) that said that LA was one of the first cities in the US to introduce specific land-use zoning; LA's city leaders in the very early years of the 20th century did not want what the older east coast cities had at the time, like people living on the same block as, or even next-door to, smoke-belching factories, apartment buildings with meat-packing plants on the first few floors, etc.

That's the point I was making in my post.........that areas adjacent to the DT core are a mixture of low rise and mid rise.....some residential mixed in with commercial. And eventually DTs begin to encroach on those areas with more hi rise bldgs. In that way, back when the photo was taken, DT LA was pretty typical. I think its particularly noteworthy that its hard to find a parking lot.

Considering the gripes people make about the aesthetics of LA's built environment and the negative, supposed "image-conscious" artificiality that people in other parts of the US associate with LA, for a place that's accepted me and many other people for who and what they are, I must say, somewhat ironically, that I find LA to be a city that's very real.

Good point. I think LA's acceptance of those who don't fit the American stereotype is one of its assets.

[alki]

Originally Posted by pesto

I agree that general economic vitality is critical to office growth. Sort of makes sense.

Just to clarify, Facebook and Google have HQ's about 30 miles south of SF. Twitter has a very small HQ in a SF low-rise. They would have moved to Silicon Valley but the city offerred them a waiver of taxes.

Yes, you're right about Google and Facebook......my bad. As for Twitter, they are talking of taking 400K sq ft of office space over the next 5 years:


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...392147060.html

That's not huge but its substantive.

And then there is this:

Forty technology companies are looking for close to 2 million square feet of office space in San Francisco, most of it South of Market, according to a report by real estate firm Colliers

Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...#ixzz1t1XAAqMo

Its this kind of talk that leads to new office skyscrapers.

[QUOTE]As for total employment and new buildings, it depends on what you mean by DT SF. Does this include just the financial district, or Market, SoMa and surroundings. I don't really care either way, but it's a matter of how far you believe the DT areas really extend. Probably not worth discussing.[/QUOTE]

I consider DT SF to run from Van Ness on the north to the Embarcadero center to the south......I think that's north/south. And includes SOMA, Market, the Federal Plaza and the financial district.

[alki]

Originally Posted by citywatch

Not compared with the ppl who caused these results....






^ some of that can be taken with a big grain of salt, cuz there are some & cities on the list that score better than LA. Still, to be stuck on the bottom with a long running disaster like detroit & a longtime joke like oakland means we got a big problem.

I think too many ppl in LA for too long have not realized just about how overly gritty & fugly the city feels & looks to too many ppl. I don't think it's nearly as bad as some of those ppl think it is, but I must be in a minority.

Okay. I see what you're saying. On this site we are talking the built environment. That's where I think you are being too harsh. In the article above, they are talking about the overall image of a city which transcends the built environment....and there I might agree with you. LA's image has suffered badly over the past 20 years......and yes, some people outside of LA are pretty negative about the city.

However, I don't think its built environment is the main culprit or even plays a leading role. I think other factors come into play........for example, like its air pollution. LA has the opportunity to reverse that image but IMO its going to require Angelenos demanding changes from their leaders.

[alki]

Originally Posted by Illithid Dude

Also, the article shows a good picture of the progress being made at 8500 Burton Way.

Wow. Just looked the website for the bldg. Its an interesting design. Its supposed to open this summer. If you go by when its finished and can grab a shot, I would like to see the finished product.

[alki]

Originally Posted by pesto

Quite a teaser from Caruso. Could he be buying the Glendale Galleria? Looking at downtown or Dodger Stadium with Magic and Frank? He was looking at Arcadia a while ago.

I don't know.........it does sound like he's blowing some smoke. If its true what he's saying, there should be announcement pretty soon.

[alki]

Originally Posted by Illithid Dude

This is huge! I read the article. So, they are propsing an office building of around 600,000 (!) square feet. Maguire Properties is doing it. Apparently, there are 'at least two' prospective tenants for this building. Also, apparently, creative office space downtown is doing very well. Also apparently, NFL might move downtown. Also also apparently, they are looking for high-tech companies on the westside to movie downtown. The last apparently is that Gensler is designing the building, and they are hoping for completion by 2015.

Can you post the article? Otherwise, you have to have a subscription to LABJ to see it.

[Illithid Dude]

Originally Posted by alki

Can you post the article? Otherwise, you have to have a subscription to LABJ to see it.

It's actually free to make an account. Moreover, Curbed just did a story on it.

http://la.curbed.com/archives/2012/0..._park_ritz.php

AEG, Maguire Want 20-30 Story Tower Near South Park Ritz

LA Live developer AEG and Robert Maguire, formerly of MPG Office Trust née Maguire Properties, recently announced plans to construct a 600,000 square foot creative office space tower on a parking lot across the street from the LA Live campus in South Park, the Los Angeles Business Journal reports [sub. req.]. The lot is next to the double Marriott tower expected to break ground soon. Gensler, the architect behind LA Live's Ritz-Carlton, will design the building. It's early in the plans, so renderings aren't available, nor is it clear how tall this office building would be (which, if completed, would be Downtown's first ground-up office tower built since '92). The LABJ surmises that, considering the square footage and the higher ceilings given to creative office suites, it could rise to a maximum of about 30 stories. The 78 year old Maguire, driven out of MPG after the tumult of the last few years, sees an opening for creative companies moving Downtown. Specifically, he sees office space similar to his Water's Edge project in Playa Vista, which houses Electronic Arts in a glassy, modern building. There are rumors that NFL's local offices in Culver City could be lured Downtown after their lease is up in 2015, especially if the NFL stadium is a go. But the idea is to also attract less flashy businesses, like law firms, to creative, open spaces, in lieu of regular Class A offices.

[pesto]

[QUOTE=alki;5678549]Yes, you're right about Google and Facebook......my bad. As for Twitter, they are talking of taking 400K sq ft of office space over the next 5 years:


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...392147060.html

That's not huge but its substantive.

And then there is this:

Forty technology companies are looking for close to 2 million square feet of office space in San Francisco, most of it South of Market, according to a report by real estate firm Colliers

Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...#ixzz1t1XAAqMo

Its this kind of talk that leads to new office skyscrapers.

As for total employment and new buildings, it depends on what you mean by DT SF. Does this include just the financial district, or Market, SoMa and surroundings. I don't really care either way, but it's a matter of how far you believe the DT areas really extend. Probably not worth discussing.[/QUOTE]

I consider DT SF to run from Van Ness on the north to the Embarcadero center to the south......I think that's north/south. And includes SOMA, Market, the Federal Plaza and the financial district.

I assume you mean Van Ness on the west, maybe MLK on the south and the water on the east and north. This is about the largest possible definition of downtown and is not commonly used that way. But given that, I would assume that employment there is larger than the employment in any reasonable definition of DT LA.

Twitter's real employment is tiny and tax motivated. The announcements usually use high estimates, since that's their job.

The new "talkers" about renting space will likely go to low-rise and in SoMa. It is very unusual for tech to put people (other than urban sales offices) in highrise. Rents are too expensive in SF to justify this.

SF is a desirable area, but the big tenants are not corp. HQ's. It's professional services and govt. And, of course, hotels, restaurants and tourism are the other backbones of the economy.

[pesto]

Originally Posted by Illithid Dude

It's actually free to make an account. Moreover, Curbed just did a story on it.

http://la.curbed.com/archives/2012/0..._park_ritz.php

AEG, Maguire Want 20-30 Story Tower Near South Park Ritz

Isn't this old news? AEG proposed something similar (with ESPN as the main tenant a year or two ago). Maybe it's finally moving forward.

It IS interesting that AEG is doing so much PR work these days. They must have something in mind.

[LosAngelesSportsFan]

Originally Posted by pesto

Isn't this old news? AEG proposed something similar (with ESPN as the main tenant a year or two ago). Maybe it's finally moving forward.

It IS interesting that AEG is doing so much PR work these days. They must have something in mind.

as i posted over at SSC, ESPN already moved into AEG land over at LA Live.

[DJM19]

Metro has revealed the high concept Union Station Master Plan from its six finalist firms. According to Meto, Metro staff will make their recommendation to the Metro Board on June 28. I assume this means picking the finalist and then working with them to build the full master plan.

EE&K, a Perkins Eastman Company, in association with UNStudio


IBI Group/Foster+Partners


Grimshaw/Gruen


Moore Ruble Yudell Architects and Planners/Ten Arquitectos/West 8


NBBJ/Ingenhoven Architects


Renzo Piano Building Workshop/Parsons Transportation Group Inc.

[Illithid Dude]

So many good choices! The only one I don't like is Grimshaw Gruen. Besides that, any one would be a winner.

Also, Renzo Pianos is bat shit crazy. In a good way.

[Easy]

Thanks DJM19. The twin towers jail puts a wet blanket an any serious redevelopment for that area. Obviously all of the firms visualize them not existing in 2050, which is smart.

But 2050? What's the point of this? They need a long term plan, but not that long term. It will be developed much sooner than that.

[DJM19]

Well its not atypical for general plans to be 40 years in scope. Im sure the idea is not this this would only be complete by 2050...

Certainly a HSR terminal should be done by 2030 at the latest.

[Lovetowers]

stuff like this gets me excited because I love LA so much and love to see move forward in such a cool way . . . I know none of this is gonna happen anytime soon but it still gets me excited that someone is at least thinkin about it yknow

[alki]

North America's Most Distinctive Theater Marquees





http://www.theatlanticcities.com/des.../1810/#slide10

[colemonkee]

These are all great in their own way, and some interesting visions on how to bridge that gap. The Grimshaw/Gruen proposal is also my least favorite, but it still has its upsides. Like completely wiping out the entire Orsini complex.

[alki]

From Brigham Yen's blog:



http://brighamyen.com/2012/04/24/but...-la/#more-7469

[citywatch]

Originally Posted by alki

However, I don't think its built environment is the main culprit or even plays a leading role. I think other factors come into play........for example, like its air pollution. LA has the opportunity to reverse that image but IMO its going to require Angelenos demanding changes from their leaders.

I'm not sure what is the main cause of the bad image. I don't think a lack of pristine air quality helps the city's reputation, but since it's much cleaner today than it was 30 yrs ago, I doubt that's as much of a factor to many ppl as it once was. The image of LA being full of gangs probably is far more of a turn off. The image of jammed fwys & no convenient transit is another one.

However, I think all of that pales next to the appearance of the city. The reason is that even before LA got stuck with the same problems that detroit & oakland are now infamous for, it still was treated with a kind of indifference. It's never had alot of the press & hype that has been directed at certain other cities. But LA imho is better today than it was several yrs ago, esp around the 92 riots, & there are alot of cities that ppl----for whatever reason----gave higher marks to than LA. btw, I think most american cities aren't all that. Most of them are forgettable or boring to me.

It's my own personal experiences, based on the reaction of ppl I've known & my own impressions, that lead me to believe that if LA didn't look so , it wouldn't make ppl feel like . I think that's a big reason so many companies still are avoiding moving to dt. Even if the hood itself is in better shape today than it was in the past, many ppl do have to drive through hoods to reach it.

sadly enough, that could be why the very ambitious plans for the area around union station probably are pie in the sky. It's why the owner of the grand wilshire hotel had to change their plans at the last minute. It's why there's still plenty of empty space in the hood even though no new office bldgs have been created in 20 yrs.