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Old Posted Mar 8, 2011, 8:02 PM
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Provincial Economies

I thought it would be interesting to find out how the provincial economies are doing after the recession, especially now that some provinces are releasing their budgets.
     
     
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Old Posted Mar 9, 2011, 3:44 AM
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Let's make things interesting.


SOURCE: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repor...cle1878273.ece

Last edited by MTLskyline; Mar 10, 2011 at 4:45 AM.
     
     
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Old Posted Mar 9, 2011, 5:24 AM
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^ Do you have a link for the article to go with that map?

Here's something else you can check out -

http://www.rbc.com/economics/microec.html
     
     
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Old Posted Mar 9, 2011, 6:27 AM
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please link the source or this image will have to be removed
     
     
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Old Posted Mar 9, 2011, 1:36 PM
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Do you have any other information on the map? Did an article or a report accompany it? And when is it from?

Here's an interesting linking on growth and momentum.
http://www.bmonesbittburns.com/econo...010q4/pemi.pdf
     
     
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Old Posted Mar 9, 2011, 4:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTLskyline View Post
Let's make things interesting.


(The Globe and Mail)
What does this represent exactly? Total GDP I presume. It can't be per capita...
     
     
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Old Posted Mar 9, 2011, 11:08 PM
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how are ontario and quebec denmark and swiss when they are almost broke compared to western canada?
     
     
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Old Posted Mar 9, 2011, 11:38 PM
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^^ That map is about GDP... so it doesn't consider debt.
     
     
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Old Posted Mar 9, 2011, 11:52 PM
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Yeah its total GDP. I got it from mtlurb. The guy who posted it on Mtlurb didn't provide a link.
     
     
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Old Posted Mar 10, 2011, 12:46 AM
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Yeah its total GDP. I got it from mtlurb. The guy who posted it on Mtlurb didn't provide a link.
About 10 key strokes on the google search page brings this.
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Last edited by shreddog; Mar 10, 2011 at 4:14 AM.
     
     
  #11  
Old Posted Mar 10, 2011, 1:21 AM
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I tried to look for BMO's release on the map but I'm having trouble.
     
     
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Old Posted Mar 10, 2011, 1:46 AM
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someone posted that map last summer on here no?
     
     
  #13  
Old Posted Mar 10, 2011, 2:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shreddog View Post
About 10 key strokes on the google search page brings this.
I looked, I couldn't find it at all (although that page you found doesn't show the map itself). What did you search under? I searched for "How Provincial Economies Stack Up".
     
     
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Old Posted Mar 10, 2011, 4:17 AM
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Originally Posted by MTLskyline View Post
I looked, I couldn't find it at all (although that page you found doesn't show the map itself). What did you search under? I searched for "How Provincial Economies Stack Up".
Sorry I originally posted the link from their mobile page, fixed the link and now it points to the full article.

Also, it appears I lied about the key strokes, it was 17 not 10 .... "quebec denmark gdp"
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Old Posted Mar 10, 2011, 4:57 AM
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So is this supposed to start a debate, or be educational, or both? Because the way I see it, we should all be happy to see all our provinces doing economically well (on a global scale). We are truly blessed with an abundance of resources and healthy, smart, human capital, making us one of the richest nations on earth. So to me, this map just highlights how productive and lucky we all really are. Although props to Alberta for having the GDP output equivalent to that of the UAE. Impressive.

Oh but just to put things in perspective, California has the same GDP output equivalent as all of Canada.
     
     
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Old Posted Mar 11, 2011, 4:46 PM
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Not quite sure where the OP meant this thread to end up, however there is a blog I follow with some very interesting economic entries and contributors. I am not pushing an agenda here, but the latest entry about the economic role of Ontario within Canada is very interesting to say the least.

The premise is that Ontario is in the midst of a major challenge - it's share of the Canadian population is increasing (from roughly 37% to about 40%) in the past 30 years whereas it's share of the Canadian GDP over the same time (from about 42% to about 37%). Especially interesting is that it's current GDP-to-population is in a negative trend with no signs of changing.

I'll leave any conclusions to the reader.

Link.

Two key graphs:

GDP

Population
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Old Posted Mar 11, 2011, 5:37 PM
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Oil and Gas are playing a big role in redistributing wealth in the country. (Never mind the fact that GDP is where it's produced, not whom that GDP is owned by ) Also, Ontario still gets the Majority of immigrants into Canada. Add the two together and it looks like this will be the demographic fact of life for the next generation. Once, the baby boomers start dying off in the next 20 or so years from now, you might see some equalization/ or balance in the falling GDP per capita numbers for Ontario relative to the rest of the country.
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Old Posted Mar 11, 2011, 6:16 PM
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I remember seeing a chart a while ago and only a few provinces have a higher share of Canada's GDP then their share of the Canadian population. I know Alberta and Newfoundland and Labrador and maybe Saskatchewan don't know if there were any other provinces if it was it would be BC I guess.
     
     
  #19  
Old Posted Mar 11, 2011, 6:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caltrane74 View Post
Oil and Gas are playing a big role in redistributing wealth in the country. (Never mind the fact that GDP is where it's produced, not whom that GDP is owned by ) Also, Ontario still gets the Majority of immigrants into Canada. Add the two together and it looks like this will be the demographic fact of life for the next generation. Once, the baby boomers start dying off in the next 20 or so years from now, you might see some equalization/ or balance in the falling GDP per capita numbers for Ontario relative to the rest of the country.
Hmmm, not sure I agree with your perspective on this. First off, O&G - and commodities in general - are not the only driver of this since the role they are playing a smaller overal share in the BC/AB/SK economies. As a percentage of their GDP, the impact of O&G has actually been dropping the past 20 years.

Secondly, what do you mean by "whom the GDP is owned by"? I think you are confusing the fact that if Teachers owns a company in the oil patch that by inference the Ontario government can tax that GDP which belongs to that company? Economies don't work that way. If they did a good chunk of Ontario's GDP would belong outside the country since a good chuck of the economy is foreign owned, branch plants.

The driver for GDP wrt to a government is the impact it plays on a government's ability for taxation. As the per capita GDP drops in Ontario wrt Canada as a whole, it means that Ontario tax rates will be impacted accordingly meaning that while all those baby boomers in Ontario start dying off over the next 20 years (likely 30 BTW) they will be putting an incredible burden on the Ontario health care system driving costs through the roof. Since health care is the biggest line item in the Ontario budget, this too will either drive overall taxation rates in Ontario up or impact the ability to provide other services. Lastly, this does impact all the other provinces since this may keep Ontario below the national average line wrt equalization payments and thus on the recieving end. Since equalization is capped, whatever Ontario gets is money the tradiational have-nots don't get.

Again, I am not saying it is doom and gloom for Ontario, rather that this could have significant impacts on all Canadians.

BTW, your statement "Ontario still gets the Majority of immigrants into Canada." is not true at all. Since the mid-2000's, Ontario has been getting less than 50% all immigrants to Canada, with an overall downward trend. Last quarter Ontario took in 41% of all immigrants to Canada (links to SC), which has been typical for the past 8 quarters. Ontario used to get the majority and while it still gets the lion share, the majority now land elsewhere in Canada - and given that this is longstanding trend, I don't see it changing anytime soon.
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Old Posted Mar 11, 2011, 6:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shreddog View Post
Hmmm, not sure I agree with your perspective on this. First off, O&G - and commodities in general - are not the only driver of this since the role they are playing a smaller overal share in the BC/AB/SK economies, as a percentage of their GDP, since their share of the local economies GDP has actually been dropping the past 20 years. When you look at GDP numbers for AB, manufacturing actually has a higher share of the GDP - though the bulk of that is related to energy, but not just O&G.

Secondly, what do you mean by "whom the GDP is owned by"? I think you are confusing the fact that if Teachers owns a company in the oil patch that by inference the Ontario government can tax that GDP which belongs to that company? Economies don't work that way. If they did a good chunk of Ontario's GDP would belong outside the country since a good chuck of the economy is foreign owned, branch plants.

The driver for GDP wrt to a government is the impact it plays on a government's ability for taxation. As the per capita GDP drops in Ontario wrt Canada as a whole, it means that Ontario tax rates will be impacted accordingly meaning that while all those baby boomers in Ontario start dying off over the next 20 years (likely 30 BTW) they will be putting an incredible burden on the Ontario health care system driving costs through the roof. Since health care is the biggest line item in the Ontario budget, this too will either drive overall taxation rates in Ontario up or impact the ability to provide other services. Lastly, this does impact all the other provinces since this may keep Ontario below the national average line wrt equalization payments and thus on the recieving end. Since equalization is capped, whatever Ontario gets is money the tradiational have-nots don't get.

Again, I am not saying it is doom and gloom for Ontario, rather that this could have significant impacts on all Canadians.

BTW, your statement "Ontario still gets the Majority of immigrants into Canada." is not true at all. Since the mid-2000's, Ontario has been getting less than 50% all immigrants to Canada, with an overall downward trend. Last quarter Ontario took in 41% of all immigrants to Canada (links to SC), which has been typical for the past 8 quarters. Ontario used to get the majority and while it still gets the lion share, the majority now land elsewhere in Canada - and given that this is longstanding trend, I don't see it changing anytime soon.
How about, Ontario gets the most immigrants of any of the Canadian provinces?
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