Atlantic Canada Regional Transportation Thread

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by mylesmalley

I still think that this particular part of the highway is the only one that really could benefit from twinning and realignment though. The rest of the highway could be significantly improved just by adding a third lane for passing every few km.

Agreed. Twinning the road to Bouctouche makes sense, but I feel any further would be better served with passing lanes.

[mylesmalley]

I'm not even sure if Bouctouche makes sense. I guess I could have been clearer in my last post. I don't think there's much benefit in twinning any further than maybe Cocagne. The current interchange between the 15 and 11 is pretty bad though.

I have two issues with this whole twinning project. First off, the fact is that the population along the route of the highway isn't growing at all. There may be traffic pattern changes, but there's no way of knowing because I don't believe DOT releases counts.

The other issue I have is the fact that there are several parallel routes in the area that won't be used less if the highway gets twinned. Even if the 11 is four lanes and has a 110km/h speed limit from Moncton to Miramichi, I'm still going to take the 126 through Rogersville because it'll still be faster.

[JHikka]

The main reason for the twinning is to provide a safer drive, is it not? A four lane divided highway would be infinitely safer than driving the 126. For anyone who lives in the area they may still prefer to use the smaller, local roads, but for tourists/people from outside of the area, the four lane highway would definitely be more appealing.

The argument I heard from a friend of mine in Bathurst is the build it and they will come model. His argument was that a four lane highway north to Miramichi would spur tourist activity and transport north, primarily on the new highway. Build a four lane highway north and the tourists will keep driving it rather than stopping in Shediac and turning around. I'm not really sure if I buy into this, and to be frank it might look dumb in twenty years when we have a divided four lane highway to literally the middle of nowhere. At the same time the highway enthusiast in me wants to see a better developed highway system.

I'd still much prefer Highway 7 be fully twinned rather than 11, but beggars can't be choosers.

[MonctonRad]

I would agree to dividing the highway to Bouctouche (but no further).

Bouctouche is at the extreme limits for the commuter watershed for greater Moncton and is the home of a couple of major tourism draws (Irving Ecocentre and the Pays de la Sagouine). Beyond Bouctouche however, the population thins out and traffic dies down. I agree with Greg that traffic beyond this point can be ameliorated with passing lanes alone.

[mylesmalley]

You're right. The twinning is being done to improve safety. As I've been saying from the start though, huge improvements could be made just by straightening out a few areas and adding passing lanes. Even turning it into a super-2 like they use in Europe would make more sense. The twinning project just seems like huge overkill to me.

On a different topic:

Does anyone know why the path that Rt 2 follows was chosen?

I wonder if the split between Rt 2 and Rt 1 had happened further down, like between Norton and Sussex, we could have killed two birds with one stone. It would still have offered much better highway access between Moncton and Fredericton, but would shave an hour off the trip between Saint John and Fredericton if someone was determined to stay on 4-lane highways all the way. It would still be longer than Rt 7, but you could probably justify it for the safety value. I'm assuming too that if htat route had been taken that none of the twinning work done on Rt 7 would have been necessary.

Maybe I'll put a map together to show what I mean.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by mylesmalley

Does anyone know why the path that Rt 2 follows was chosen?

I honestly read something about this recently but forget why the decision was made. Perhaps one of our older users can enlighten us.

I know exactly what you mean, though. One of the obstacles seems to be Washdemoak Lake, but it seems as though it could be crossed relatively easily at Cambridge-Narrows. The TCH was built and upgraded before the improvements were made to Route 1 I believe (correct me if i'm wrong) and the area around Sussex in particular was notorious for deaths and crashes. Perhaps they just felt better connecting at Salisbury than connecting to a two lane highway in Sussex.

Depending on where you live in the southern part of the province (Hampton, Norton, some parts of Quispamsis) it is almost quicker to drive Route 10 from Sussex north rather than Route 7 when driving to somewhere like Fredericton. Honestly I think Route 10 is the more difficult road to drive, although it is much shorter than Route 7. For those of us in Saint John, Route 7 is the pretty obvious choice. I can get to Fredericton in 45 minutes and Sussex in about 40 from central Saint John.

If we ever had our big International Airport in Sussex I guess we wouldn't have to have a discussion about twinning Route 10.

[MonctonRad]

I'm pretty sure the current allignment of Highway 2 between Salisbury and Oromocto was chosen for two basic reasons:

(1) - since it passes through the wilderness, that obviated the need for pesky negotiations with existing landowners.
(2) - it isn't as hilly as it would be if it passed near Sussex or Norton. This reduced cost.

[mylesmalley]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I'm pretty sure the current allignment of Highway 2 between Salisbury and Oromocto was chosen for two basic reasons:

(1) - since it passes through the wilderness, that obviated the need for pesky negotiations with existing landowners.
(2) - it isn't as hilly as it would be if it passed near Sussex or Norton. This reduced cost.

I was actually thinking your point 1 might be advantageous haha. One thing I've always found a bit annoying about the current alignment is that it passes through absolutely nothing for 75km or so after the highway splits. Depending on where it went, it could have connected a (comparatively) much more heavily populated part of the province than it does at the moment.

You're right about the hills, of course, but there would be cost savings as well by needing less highway overall.

Anyway, this whole idea is entirely academic.

Maybe when the Provincial Govt gets the idea to twin Rt 695 it might make sense to look at moving the TCH

[theshark]

Big part I have seen that costs attached to bridges!! They are expensive to build and needs constant expensive maintenance. I Know that they choose the path from Grand falls to woodstock in that effect.

Remember how you still cross the river in Grand Falls, then used to do it also in Florenceville, then back in Hartland but not anymore.

look also between Oromocto and the 112, you first cross the St-John river at on of its narrowest place, then instead of crossing back at around cambridge narrows, look at how far north they went to cross the river at one of its narrowest point instead of building a bigger bridge and almost having a direct line to moncton.

[Vorkuta]

As someone who travelled the 11 quite often (daily commute from Rexton to Moncton for 3 years) I can definitely see how twinning, at least from Buctouche to Shediac would improve the safety factor. At points in the day the 11 gets fairly busy, and finding a place to pass was pretty tricky (even back in 1990). Most of those tricky areas are between Rexton and Buctouche in the form of small hills that can hide a car behind them, but some exist on the relatively straight stretch between Buctouche and Cocagne, too. Factor in the traffic and you'd often have to pass a string of 5 or 6 campers, and it could get dicey. I'm one of the CLOSEST houses to where the four-lane in Shediac ends, and the traffic is pretty constant, well into the evening. Lots of accidents there too, though that's more a result of the four-to-two merge along with the Shediac Cape on-ramp...

It probably doesn't make great sense from a monetary standpoint, but it would make that stretch a LOT safer.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by GregHickman

I'd still much prefer Highway 7 be fully twinned rather than 11, but beggars can't be choosers.

I'm not sure that's necessary. The Welsford bypass is definitely necessary, as that stretch of road is dangerous and has a 60 km/h speed limit, but overall I consider highway 7 to be fine. There's plenty of places to pass and visibility is good. There have been a few deaths there over the years but they've been relatively few and far between.

Instead of focusing on twinning a highway that works well and isn't that dangerous I'd rather see money put towards provincially designated routes in urban areas that desperately need work. In Fredericton, for example, we really need to complete the 105/Two Nations Crossing interchange and the realignment of the Princess Margaret Bridge/Route 8/Highway 105 intersection. These projects would save thousands of people a lot of time on a daily basis by easing congestion, not to mention the drop in emissions and fuel use.

There's also a lot of highly travelled secondary roads that are in really bad shape that we need to fix. Highway 105 just west of Fredericton is atrocious, for example.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by OliverD

I'm not sure that's necessary. The Welsford bypass is definitely necessary, as that stretch of road is dangerous and has a 60 km/h speed limit, but overall I consider highway 7 to be fine. There's plenty of places to pass and visibility is good. There have been a few deaths there over the years but they've been relatively few and far between.

There was a collision yesterday.

Although I will agree that the Welsford bypass is much needed. Not only will it shave a few minutes off but will also eliminate the most dangerous part of the highway.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by GregHickman

There was a collision yesterday.

Sure, but let's be honest here - how many people have died on this stretch of road in the last 10 years? I can think of 3 or 4, one being the cyclist who was hit by a truck on the divided part.

[JHikka]

I'd argue that it would be preferable if no-one died, but I understand your point. I guess it would just save me some gray hairs and blood pressure if the whole highway was divided. I'm going to be driving it to and from Fredericton tonight so perhaps i'll update you on my position once i'm through.

If I never post on here again, you may know why.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by CBC News

Highway-twinning project beating schedule
Dexter Construction official confirms the project will finish in 2012
CBC News Posted: Jul 13, 2012 10:37 AM AT Last Updated: Jul 13, 2012 12:31 PM AT

Dexter Construction is six months ahead of schedule in finish its highway-twinning project between Saint John and the U.S. border.

The three-year project was supposed to wrap up in July 2013 but the construction is expected to wrap up early.

But the Department of Transportation is refusing to confirm the progress. Instead, provincial officials say the completion date is still next July.

Harry Varjabedian, a senior executive with Dexter Construction, told the Rotary Club of Saint John a few weeks ago the project will be done this year.

Imelda Gilman, the president of the Saint John Board of Trade, was at the public meeting when the construction company revealed the new timeline.

"I thought it was very ambitious. I've driven that road over the last number of months and there's so much activity all the way down to the border,” Gilman said.

The twinning of the highway to the border is among the business group’s priorities for southern New Brunswick.

Gilman said she was pleased to hear the project is ahead of schedule.

She said the bulk of New Brunswick's exports come from the greater Saint John area.

A 17-kilometre section of the new highway from Bethel to Waweig will open to traffic on Tuesday.

The highway construction project is worth $540 million.

Dexter Construction will also operate and maintain the highway until the year 2040.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-br...ject-1014.html

Google Maps has already been updated with the extended twinned highway now reaching from the border to Bethel.

[JHikka]

The Welsford Bypass is set for completion later next year:

Originally Posted by CHSJ News

Work Set To Resume On Welsford Bypass

There may be no construction activity at the moment - but - the provincial Transportation Department says that's about to change.
A department spokesperson tells CHSJ News a 3-million dollar contract for grading and paving of the Welsford Bypass will be awarded soon.
The contract involves grading and paving of 5-kms of new highway and four ramps in the Welsford area - and - we are told that work will start in about 3-weeks.
The 60-million dollar project is now scheduled for completion in the fall of next year - about a year later than originally planned.

http://country94news.blogspot.ca/201...rd-bypass.html

[Fischbob]

Wow.

Acadian Bus Lines shutting operations by November
CBC News
Posted: Aug 7, 2012 5:27 PM AT
Last Updated: Aug 7, 2012 5:42 PM AT

Acadian Coach Lines in New Brunswick, P.E.I. and Acadian Intercity Coaches in Nova Scotia are closing their Maritime operations by the end of this year.

Employees were given the news Tuesday afternoon.

The bus service says it can't make a profit in the region.

"It is well known that Acadian has been struggling financially for quite some time and we’ve worked hard over the last few years to try to implement a sustainable network," said CEO Denis Andlauer in a release.

The company was the centre of a labour dispute this winter, where workers in P.E.I. and New Brunswick were locked out for five months.

By the time it ended, many employees had moved on to other jobs

The plan is to shut down all operations by Nov. 30, 2012.

Acadian is the only intercity coach line in the Maritimes.

Source: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-br...n.html?cmp=rss

[MonctonRad]

What a travesty!

This on top of VIA gutting their service!!!!

How are university students, the poor and those who can't drive going to get around the region?

[ErickMontreal]

Acadian tried to move out from unprofitable lines but their plan was rejected by provincial regulator. In my opinion, the province should have listened to them and taken them seriously.

At the end of the day, you can't force a private company to offer an essential service that is unprofitable. Irving pulled back at the right time.

Sad day for the region.

[SignalHillHiker]

I'm sorry for all of you impacted by this. You should write to your provincial government and demand some sort of resolution.