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  #4521  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2024, 5:27 PM
WarrenC12 WarrenC12 is offline
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Originally Posted by lio45 View Post
Yeah, because that's the only way to calculate how many extra households, behaving typically, the addition of one charging EV to the grid represents.

Your household's average energy consumption rate *IS* ~0.8 kW, whether you like it or not.
You're arguing in bad faith using the peak consumption of my vehicle against the average of my household.
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  #4522  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2024, 5:29 PM
lio45 lio45 is offline
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Originally Posted by WarrenC12 View Post
You're arguing in bad faith using the peak consumption of my vehicle against the average of my household.
No, I'm just defending a metric that I think is fair enough, which is "when you plug an EV into the grid, what's the equivalent in terms of adding average households?"

Whenever your EV is plugged, assuming it draws ~7 kW like you said, then from the grid's point of view, while your EV is plugged it's like you added 8-9 households like yours.

(Now, obviously, if it's only plugged 1/32th of the time, the result is energy usage that's ~25% of your household.)
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  #4523  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2024, 5:45 PM
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Changing City Changing City is offline
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Originally Posted by whatnext View Post
I bolded an interesting stat:

Charging a single EV draws as much energy as two average households combined, according to Toronto Hydro. Many observers have warned that rapid EV adoption will cause demand for electricity to surge.
Thanks for identifying the confusing 'stat' in the Globe and Mail piece. Who knows what Toronto Hydro said, and whether the journalist understood what they were being told.

Here are more helpful comparisons, from Toronto Hydro. They say a battery electric vehicle, driven 20,000km a year, owned by a household paying $0.1471 / kWh for electricity, would cost $530 a year to charge.

(An average Toronto household uses 750 kWh per month, and pays $130 per month for that electricity. So clearly, they don't mean an EV uses as much electricity to charge in a year as two households use, although the G&M piece could be misinterpreted to mean that).

They ask "Can your home handle the electrical load? An EV can add significant electrical load to your home. They have similar electrical requirements to a clothes dryer or stove."
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  #4524  
Old Posted May 1, 2024, 1:04 AM
urbandreamer urbandreamer is offline
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If they bought their house 15 years ago, the car is worth more. (Today this teeny house is $1 million as is, $3 million rebuilt into something huge and usually hideous.)

Note the neighbors vehicle.

Tesla laid off their entire Supercharger team yesterday, 500 employees!!!
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  #4525  
Old Posted May 1, 2024, 1:08 AM
Truenorth00 Truenorth00 is offline
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Originally Posted by urbandreamer View Post
If they bought their house 15 years ago, the car is worth more. (Today this teeny house is $1 million as is, $3 million rebuilt into something huge and usually hideous.)

Note the neighbors vehicle.
Can we ban posts like these? What does this add at all to the topic at hand?
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  #4526  
Old Posted May 1, 2024, 1:12 AM
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SpongeG SpongeG is offline
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I can't find a related story but it was mentioned on the radio I was listening to that if you are in the market for an EV perhaps you would be better off converting your ICE vehicle as it is a cheap option rather than buying an EV and than it trailed off into how are we going to meet the demands that 90% off vehicles sold by 2030 must be electric and how will the grid handle it etc.

Has anyone looked into converting an ICE car into an EV?
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  #4527  
Old Posted May 1, 2024, 1:17 AM
urbandreamer urbandreamer is offline
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I was in Yorkdale Mall recently and sat in a $160,000 Lucid Air. It's a nice car, but ultimately reminds me of a 1990s Oldsmobile Ninety Eight. Perhaps it should have traditional analog dials appealing to the 60+ multi millionaire crowd?

(The Tesla showroom was busy, Apple to Lucid's Microsoft vibes. Meanwhile, Vinfast was deserted: Blackberry?)
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  #4528  
Old Posted May 1, 2024, 1:45 AM
Truenorth00 Truenorth00 is offline
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Originally Posted by SpongeG View Post
I can't find a related story but it was mentioned on the radio I was listening to that if you are in the market for an EV perhaps you would be better off converting your ICE vehicle as it is a cheap option rather than buying an EV and than it trailed off into how are we going to meet the demands that 90% off vehicles sold by 2030 must be electric and how will the grid handle it etc.

Has anyone looked into converting an ICE car into an EV?
There is no way that is a cheap or practical option for an average person. It's like suggesting somebody take a clunker and turn it in to a hotrod. Cheaper than buying a hotrod. But probably not justifiable on performance output or cost.

Batteries, the battery packs, the motors, etc are all highly optimized for any EV. Simply shoving batteries and any ol' motor into any car will work. But it will not be much cheaper than a similar sized used EV and will come with a lot less range and acceleration and worse handling.
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  #4529  
Old Posted May 1, 2024, 2:03 AM
Djeffery Djeffery is offline
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Originally Posted by SpongeG View Post
I can't find a related story but it was mentioned on the radio I was listening to that if you are in the market for an EV perhaps you would be better off converting your ICE vehicle as it is a cheap option rather than buying an EV and than it trailed off into how are we going to meet the demands that 90% off vehicles sold by 2030 must be electric and how will the grid handle it etc.

Has anyone looked into converting an ICE car into an EV?
Yeah, probably 100 pages or so ago in this thread. Probably posted by ssiguy
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  #4530  
Old Posted May 1, 2024, 4:48 AM
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Changing City Changing City is offline
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Originally Posted by SpongeG View Post
I can't find a related story but it was mentioned on the radio I was listening to that if you are in the market for an EV perhaps you would be better off converting your ICE vehicle as it is a cheap option rather than buying an EV and than it trailed off into how are we going to meet the demands that 90% off vehicles sold by 2030 must be electric and how will the grid handle it etc.

Has anyone looked into converting an ICE car into an EV?
You can do it (or much more likely, you can pay someone to do it) but it's probably cheaper to buy a new EV. There are companies that will do it all over Europe, and north America, Here's your local converter: "Riise EV specializes in converting sports cars and classic cars, usually at a cost of about $50,000 to $100,000."
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  #4531  
Old Posted May 1, 2024, 6:01 AM
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Doady Doady is offline
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If people want to save money and use less gas and reduce emissions, maybe try not to keep the foot on the gas all the way to the red light or stop sign and then step on the brakes at the last second. People see the red light, they can just take their foot off the gas pedal and let the car decelerate and come gently to a stop.

It amazes me how many people waste so much energy by coming to the red light or stop sign at full speed, then they complain about gas prices. These people can switch to electric vehicles but it won't stop the waste, and they'll just start bitching about electricity rates instead.
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  #4532  
Old Posted May 1, 2024, 12:22 PM
jonny24 jonny24 is offline
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I've looked into converting, but it seems kind of hard to DIY still and way to expensive to pay someone else. It's really high-voltage stuff, it's not just twisting a few wires together.

My previously-mentioned 2002 GMC Sierra is almost to 400,000 km. My plan is to keep fixing manageable repairs when they come up, but if the engine or transmission die catastrophically I'll be comparing EV conversion vs simple rebuild vs a fun performance engine.

In theory a motor could hook up to the driveshaft, sitting in place of where the transmission is, leaving the engine bay, gas tank location or the bed for battery space.
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  #4533  
Old Posted May 1, 2024, 12:22 PM
OldDartmouthMark OldDartmouthMark is offline
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Originally Posted by SpongeG View Post
I can't find a related story but it was mentioned on the radio I was listening to that if you are in the market for an EV perhaps you would be better off converting your ICE vehicle as it is a cheap option rather than buying an EV and than it trailed off into how are we going to meet the demands that 90% off vehicles sold by 2030 must be electric and how will the grid handle it etc.

Has anyone looked into converting an ICE car into an EV?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Changing City View Post
You can do it (or much more likely, you can pay someone to do it) but it's probably cheaper to buy a new EV. There are companies that will do it all over Europe, and north America, Here's your local converter: "Riise EV specializes in converting sports cars and classic cars, usually at a cost of about $50,000 to $100,000."
I've seen it done for old vehicles, like pre-1970s, from the age where vehicles were simply built and contained no electronics and automation. Then it's more or less a matter of removing all the ICE related stuff (engine, exhaust, fuel system, etc) and installing EV stuff (electric motor, battery packs, electronics, wiring, hardware/software to make it work, etc). Even in this case it's not a simple job that the average DYI person could do in their driveway. And in the end, the result won't work as well as a new state-of-the-art EV. Plus, you're still left driving a 50+ year old car without modern safety systems or crashworthiness.

If it's been done to a newer (say, post 2000) vehicle, I'm not aware. Today's newer vehicles are very electronics-laden, and the drivetrain is very much integral to the functioning of most other systems, so I would suspect it might be a bit of a bear to pull that one off, and make it work as it should. Additionally, the layout isn't optimized for an EV, so massive battery packs will have to be put in the trunk or some other location, which would compromize luggage capacity, interior space, or wherever you try to fit in the packs (fuel tank location?). On top of that, you have a mickey-moused EV that may or may not work well, may or may not be reliable, and may require roadside expertise when it just quits and you can't quite figure out why (or a CAA membership, perhaps...). And none of that deals with the fact that your climate control system, which works using heat from engine coolant and an A/C compressor driven off of the ICE, and the complex electronics that operate these systems in modern vehicles. Additionally, you are likely also dealing with all the old car stuff, like rust, worn and degraded parts, etc., which adds additional work to the project.

In the end, IMHO, really not worth the heartache, unless you're an enthusiast who likes to do this sort of thing for fun. Then it's a whole other thing. I'm still not seeing the cost advantage either way.

IMHO, if you really want an EV, there are some good choices out there, so you are better off buying a new one, or if the stories I'm hearing that the prices of used ones will come down are true, find a nice gently-used example. That said, they are still evolving, so unless you need one right now, it might be an idea to wait a few years to see how new technologies and OEM experience improves the herd.

There's a lot happening in the EV world now, including some exciting (to me) new production coming to Canada. I don't drive as much these days, but when I am finally in the market for a new EV, I will choose to buy one that's built in Canada.
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  #4534  
Old Posted May 6, 2024, 2:38 PM
P'tit Renard P'tit Renard is offline
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Who will fill in the gap now that Tesla's EV network is plunging into the abyss?

Fired Supercharger Maintenance Workers Say Network Will Fall Into Disrepair
https://futurism.com/the-byte/superc...work-disrepair

Tesla’s Supercharger layoffs couldn’t have come at a worse time
https://www.theverge.com/2024/5/3/24...cture-projects
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  #4535  
Old Posted May 6, 2024, 2:49 PM
whatnext whatnext is offline
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Originally Posted by P'tit Renard View Post
Who will fill in the gap now that Tesla's EV network is plunging into the abyss?

Fired Supercharger Maintenance Workers Say Network Will Fall Into Disrepair
https://futurism.com/the-byte/superc...work-disrepair

Tesla’s Supercharger layoffs couldn’t have come at a worse time
https://www.theverge.com/2024/5/3/24...cture-projects
Elon Musk, business genius.
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  #4536  
Old Posted May 6, 2024, 4:35 PM
WarrenC12 WarrenC12 is offline
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Betting against Musk is a mug's game. Twitter isn't the same, but these people were calling for it to fall apart in a month after he fired so many people.
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  #4537  
Old Posted May 6, 2024, 5:22 PM
Jaws Jaws is offline
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Originally Posted by WarrenC12 View Post
Betting against Musk is a mug's game. Twitter isn't the same, but these people were calling for it to fall apart in a month after he fired so many people.
How was Musk's ROI on that purchase? Curious to see what the balance sheet looks like now.
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  #4538  
Old Posted May 6, 2024, 6:33 PM
whatnext whatnext is offline
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Originally Posted by WarrenC12 View Post
Betting against Musk is a mug's game. Twitter isn't the same, but these people were calling for it to fall apart in a month after he fired so many people.
Maybe in the past. Now he's just an increasingly erratic and negative figure.
He basically burned bridges with the Biden administration with the charger decision, after Tesla had collected so much in gov't money. You can bet he's being watched following his latest summoning to China.
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  #4539  
Old Posted May 6, 2024, 10:12 PM
Truenorth00 Truenorth00 is offline
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Originally Posted by WarrenC12 View Post
Betting against Musk is a mug's game. Twitter isn't the same, but these people were calling for it to fall apart in a month after he fired so many people.
It's not physically failing. Have you seen their performance though? Everything from ad revenue to participation and new signups are down. The place is full of spam and bigotry now.
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  #4540  
Old Posted May 6, 2024, 10:15 PM
Truenorth00 Truenorth00 is offline
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Originally Posted by whatnext View Post
Maybe in the past. Now he's just an increasingly erratic and negative figure.
He basically burned bridges with the Biden administration with the charger decision, after Tesla had collected so much in gov't money. You can bet he's being watched following his latest summoning to China.
They had better be watching him. He will absolutely sell out to China, to make up his losses on Twitter. I honestly think Space X should be expropriated from his ownership given his views and their national security implications. He doesn't contribute much there anyway at this point and the rest of their executive team is highly competent.
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