Lloyd District News

[eric cantona]

The 12th street commons design based on the image on page 31 looks way too narrow.

[urbanlife]

Originally Posted by DMH

Well, something like that did happen....

Subsequently Olimpia & York got rights to develop 3 blocks north of Keller Auditorium. ZGF conceptualized buildings on those 3 blocks. Each tower was designed by a different ZGF partner. Ultimately only the Koin Tower was built. The other two blocks were sold off and developed later. Those blocks are the next blocks just north & east of Koin Tower.

Well damn, now I wonder what that would have looked like if all three had been built. When I think I know everything about Portland's history, then I come across stuff like this.

[maccoinnich]

Originally Posted by eric cantona

The 12th street commons design based on the image on page 31 looks way too narrow.

I'm not sure why it looks so narrow in the rendering, but per the site plan on page 46 it would be at least 66.5' wide, which is wider than a typical Portland street.

[eric cantona]

Originally Posted by maccoinnich

I'm not sure why it looks so narrow in the rendering, but per the site plan on page 46 it would be at least 66.5' wide, which is wider than a typical Portland street.

Thanks for the clarity. I feel better now!

[DMH]

Originally Posted by urbanlife

Well damn, now I wonder what that would have looked like if all three had been built. When I think I know everything about Portland's history, then I come across stuff like this.

If you look up KOIN Tower on Wikipedia, you can read some of this history. It was a Portland Development Commission project to develop those 3 blocks. The northern half-block Essex House residential building with ground-floor retail was developed later from a design by another architecture firm.

[maccoinnich]

Big changes in store for prominent Portland property



The Portland Design Commission on Thursday got its first look at the 29.3-acre redevelopment plan for transforming the Lloyd Center into a high-density, mixed-use neighborhood.

The project team’s aim is to reimagine the property that currently holds an inward-facing, auto-centric mall so that it becomes a regional destination. This transformation will involve incorporating housing, retail shops, office spaces and restaurants – all interconnected via plazas, parks and open spaces.

“We see this as an amazing opportunity to completely remake a large part of the Lloyd District,” said Tom Kilbane, managing director at Urban Renaissance Group (URG). “It’s not often that you get a chance to reimagine 30 acres of prime real estate in a big city.”

The project team includes owners URG of Seattle and KKR Real Estate Finance Trust (KREF) of New York; master planner ZGF; landscape architect and urban designer Field Operations of New York; civil engineer DOWL and structural engineer KPFF.

URG and KREF have owned the Lloyd Center since December 2021. The mall, which opened in the summer of 1960 as a 1.2 million-square-foot shopping center with approximately 100 stores, over the years has gone through multiple renovations, including enclosure of formerly open-air space via a glass ceiling and the addition of a third level.

However, like many other enclosed malls in the U.S., the Lloyd Center saw major tenants begin to depart. Then, during the COVID-19 pandemic, in January 2021, the mall’s last remaining department store, Macy’s, closed. The mall was in foreclosure when URG and KREF took over.

...continues at the DJC ($).

[maccoinnich]

Lloyd Center Redevelopment Central City Master Plan DAR #2 Drawings [32 MB]

[AdamUrbanist]

Originally Posted by maccoinnich

Lloyd Center Redevelopment Central City Master Plan DAR #2 Drawings [32 MB]

I don't understand the logic of building two separate new parks within a block of an existing park. Seems like it would be much more effective to extend Holladay park across Multnomah.

[urbanlife]

I wonder if a MLB expansion could throw a wrench in any of these Lloyd Center plans?

[Socinus]

Originally Posted by AdamUrbanist

I don't understand the logic of building two separate new parks within a block of an existing park. Seems like it would be much more effective to extend Holladay park across Multnomah.

I think a series of smaller spaces that are multi-functional will get considerably more usage. Many of our larger, longer parks that are more traditionally park-y are underutilized, I say this as someone who grew up across the street from two different large parks in Portland in my life. These spaces that flow into the buildings and streets surrounding them look more like a lived in space that could see natural use, and pull people outside more effectively than a larger space that folks avoid at night (like Holladay park).

[Jakz]

So far looks great. I like that the parks/plazas (12th-13th north of Clackamas?) are actual blocks surrounded by pedestrian walkways, not intra-block spaces like the disappointing Slabtown Square.

[PhillyPDX]

Originally Posted by urbanlife

I wonder if a MLB expansion could throw a wrench in any of these Lloyd Center plans?

I'd assume these developers have been in discussion with local MLB groups, have contingencies, etc to allow for a stadium. But also won't wait forever. If I were them I'd have a plan B that includes a different design with a stadium somewhere.

[ThatDarnSacramentan]

Originally Posted by Socinus

I think a series of smaller spaces that are multi-functional will get considerably more usage. Many of our larger, longer parks that are more traditionally park-y are underutilized, I say this as someone who grew up across the street from two different large parks in Portland in my life. These spaces that flow into the buildings and streets surrounding them look more like a lived in space that could see natural use, and pull people outside more effectively than a larger space that folks avoid at night (like Holladay park).

If done well, it could be quite similar to the Jamison Square/Tanner Springs duo in the Pearl. Two blocks apart, but very different spaces with different moods and uses.

[AdamUrbanist]

Originally Posted by ThatDarnSacramentan

If done well, it could be quite similar to the Jamison Square/Tanner Springs duo in the Pearl. Two blocks apart, but very different spaces with different moods and uses.

I can see these two small spaces being pretty active. I worry more about the design focusing it's energy inwards at the expense of Holladay park and the surrounding perimeter. Circling the wagons and turning inwards is an understandable reflex because the surrounding fabric is mediocre, but I think it's the reverse of what's needed. I'd rather see new development focus it's energy outwards to improve the surounding streets and park. I have a similar concern about the OMSI master plan and the decision to re-align Water Ave.

[DMH]

Originally Posted by AdamUrbanist

I can see these two small spaces being pretty active. I worry more about the design focusing it's energy inwards at the expense of Holladay park and the surrounding perimeter. Circling the wagons and turning inwards is an understandable reflex because the surrounding fabric is mediocre, but I think it's the reverse of what's needed. I'd rather see new development focus it's energy outwards to improve the surounding streets and park. I have a similar concern about the OMSI master plan and the decision to re-align Water Ave.

Ah, but on Page 24 of the draft master plan, the entire frontage along NE Multnomah is designated for Active (retail presumably) uses. All of that frontage across from Holladay Park is currently a dead zone of parking garages or lots. The implemented master plan would bring the activity to the perimeter that you want.

[AdamUrbanist]

They couldn't get the plan approved without an active use along the park and clearly a sophisticated firm like ZGF understands this. But providing retail space is different from making the park frontage the central focus of the development. Hopefully the Holladay retail will be filled with tenants that contribute to the streetscape but there's a limit to how much frontage you can successfully activate in a challenging area like the Lloyd district. The plan is not terrible by any means, I just think it would be more succesful if it made Holladay park a more central feature of the planning

[FiveOverPun]

With the current financing and cost situation, what are the odds any of this actually gets built in the next 5-10 years? Been thinking about the same with the Broadway Corridor project - the plans are ambitious and great, but will it get funded?

[DMH]

Originally Posted by FiveOverPun

With the current financing and cost situation, what are the odds any of this actually gets built in the next 5-10 years? Been thinking about the same with the Broadway Corridor project - the plans are ambitious and great, but will it get funded?

Patience, patience. Consider other big redevelopment sites such as River District (aka Pearl District) with its subarea Brewery Blocks or South Waterfront. Despite the tech bubble bursting in the early 2000s and the Great Recession around 2009, much has been built as was hoped.

[PhillyPDX]

Originally Posted by FiveOverPun

With the current financing and cost situation, what are the odds any of this actually gets built in the next 5-10 years? Been thinking about the same with the Broadway Corridor project - the plans are ambitious and great, but will it get funded?

This has way less burden for the developer to work around (prosper portland, etc), so it's probably much more likely. But agreed, not likely in the near term.

[CorbinWarrick]

Originally Posted by FiveOverPun

With the current financing and cost situation, what are the odds any of this actually gets built in the next 5-10 years? Been thinking about the same with the Broadway Corridor project - the plans are ambitious and great, but will it get funded?

Great question I’ll take the over on 10 years with how big projects move here